Can anyone identify this Stormtrooper Helmet?

[Qui-Gonzalez]

Why are you picking a fight with me? I was just stating that it was an exceptable word to use.

Because even according to the site you referenced, it is no longer an acceptable word to use. Archaic English is one step removed from obsolete English. That's all there is to it, and if you see it as a "fight" then please ratchet back on the defense mechanism.

 

[exoray]

I'd like to ask one simple question. Has anyone seen the "original sculpt molds before this supposedly new and improved "recast" version appeared that made people do a double take on whether it was real or just recast.

Has anyone seen a bird's eye view of the faceplate mold on that and have anyone seen whether this mold had facial bumps in strange places?

Or... did I read it wrong and the "experts" thought it was a recast from the get-go?

As I remember there were some early photos posted of his sculpts at a preliminary stage when he was doing his suit, and yes the accusations of it being a recast were almost immediate once he showed the final product...

 

[defstartrooper]

This is a civil dispute if you are going to toss out legal terminology and play court then at least use the ones that apply...

"Preponderance of the evidence" is what applies in civil matters, not "beyond a reasonable doubt"

In this case as it stands, I have seen multiple photo evidence posted that shows it's origins as suspicious and all I see as a defense is multiple people saying "no he didn't"

As I have said before, the defense and 'what ifs' tossed up are empty they have very little if any substance, while on the other hand there has been some pretty good accusations tossed up and supported with multiple photos... Ironically the photos tossed up to counter the claims, to me only strengthened my belief in the claims...

At this point if you are to weigh it based on "preponderance of the evidence" then I believe the scale is tipping towards the claimed recast, the other side is empty...

One other thing to note since people like to play court, is that in a civil dispute the right to remain silent is held and counted against you negatively, nearly as bad as an admission of wrong doing...

Court in Session...

Another one blind to whats in front of them unless it suits their POV ?

Lets weigh the evidence shall we ?

Evidence for recast:

Gino says it's impossible to sculpt the face to such a standard of accuracy.
That is his opinion it's not factual.

There is a bump on some helmets that is present on the helmets TM recast.
So far seems to be on 2 helmets one belonging to Ghost and another from an anonymous source.

Evidence that it's not recast:

Different tubes,tears,vocoder,eyes.

Bump appears to be on two helmets although on one it appears to be in a different position.
Bump appears to be the only possible tell left behind from multiple bumps and tells that are a lot smaller in an area that if the face is recast has been reworked but relatively large bump overlooked.

This is all the " evidence " put forward so far from both sides of the discussion so far.

Looking objectively at what has been said from everyone so far can you really state that the evidence for it being recast is tipping toward recast ?

Oh and i guess TM will have to remain silent now as he appears to have been banned.

 

[defstartrooper]

Because even according to the site you referenced, it is no longer an acceptable word to use. Archaic English is one step removed from obsolete English. That's all there is to it, and if you see it as a "fight" then please ratchet back on the defense mechanism.

Behave will you nobody needs an English lesson from people that bastardised the English language

 

[Qui-Gonzalez]

Another one blind to whats in front of them unless it suits their POV ?

Lets weigh the evidence shall we ?

Evidence for recast:

Gino says it's impossible to sculpt the face to such a standard of accuracy.
That is his opinion it's not factual.

There is a bump on some helmets that is present on the helmets TM recast.
So far seems to be on 2 helmets one belonging to Ghost and another from an anonymous source.

Evidence that it's not recast:

Different tubes,tears,vocoder,eyes.

Bump appears to be on two helmets although on one it appears to be in a different position.
Bump appears to be the only possible tell left behind from multiple bumps and tells that are a lot smaller in an area that if the face is recast has been reworked but relatively large bump overlooked.

This is all the " evidence " put forward so far from both sides of the discussion so far.

Looking objectively at what has been said from everyone so far can you really state that the evidence for it being recast is tipping toward recast ?

Oh and i guess TM will have to remain silent now as he appears to have been banned.

I guess it is time to lock this bad boy down then, eh?

Def, maybe GINO should have said "improbable" instead. I guess if the guy had recast previously, it does add character weight to the argument that his current work is a "retooling" of "his" previous work.

Edit: Oh no you di'unt! I do try to not play Grammar Police, but it just happens sometimes.

 

[GINO]

I wouldn't have made this big a deal about this whole thing if I wasn't 100% sure.

.

 

[sskunky]

This is a civil dispute if you are going to toss out legal terminology and play court then at least use the ones that apply...

"Preponderance of the evidence" is what applies in civil matters, not "beyond a reasonable doubt"

In this case as it stands, I have seen multiple photo evidence posted that shows it's origins as suspicious and all I see as a defense is multiple people saying "no he didn't"

As I have said before, the defense and 'what ifs' tossed up are empty they have very little if any substance, while on the other hand there has been some pretty good accusations tossed up and supported with multiple photos... Ironically the photos tossed up to counter the claims, to me only strengthened my belief in the claims...

At this point if you are to weigh it based on "preponderance of the evidence" then I believe the scale is tipping towards the claimed recast, the other side is empty...

One other thing to note since people like to play court, is that in a civil dispute the right to remain silent is held and counted against you negatively, nearly as bad as an admission of wrong doing...

Court in Session...

Behave will you nobody needs an English lesson from people that bastardised the English language

:lol I agree, actually in England and in English we do actually use" beyond reasonable doubt" American law and terminology is very different. We also use the old English language when applicable as we invented it and are allowed to!:lol

 

[exoray]

Evidence that it's not recast:

Different tubes,tears,vocoder,eyes.

Bump appears to be on two helmets although on one it appears to be in a different position.
Bump appears to be the only possible tell left behind from multiple bumps and tells that are a lot smaller in an area that if the face is recast has been reworked but relatively large bump overlooked.

This is all the " evidence " put forward so far from both sides of the discussion so far.

But, your claimed "evidence that it's not a recast" isn't what the evidence suggest it suggest that it has differences, not that it's not a recast...

The evidence does not point or suggest it's origins, it only shows differences... Show me the final sculpt or a work in progress sculpt that is even 90% there... That would help establish origin... Hell any work in progress shots that resemble the final piece...

Anyway as it appears from the announcement forum, TM like many others accused before him instead of defending himself to the end (or even attempting to defend himself), has railroaded himself into a permaban without any defense... Says a lot right there and seals it for me...

 

[exoray]

:lol I agree, actually in England and in English we do actually use" beyond reasonable doubt"

Again only in criminal cases, it's my understanding from reading even in the UK for civil trials the burden of proof relies on "the balance of probabilities"

 

[moff man]

Because even according to the site you referenced, it is no longer an acceptable word to use. Archaic English is one step removed from obsolete English. That's all there is to it, and if you see it as a "fight" then please ratchet back on the defense mechanism.

Ok geeesh , I thought everyone spoketh Archaic English.

 

[defstartrooper]

But, your claimed "evidence that it's not a recast" isn't what the evidence suggest it suggest that it has differences, not that it's not a recast...

The evidence does not point or suggest it's origins, it only shows differences... Show me the final sculpt or a work in progress sculpt that is even 90% there... That would help establish origin... Hell any work in progress shots that resemble the final piece...

Anyway as it appears from the announcement forum, TM like many others accused before him instead of defending himself to the end (or even attempting to defend himself), has railroaded himself into a permaban without any defense... Says a lot right there and seals it for me...

So you're saying the judgement should be made on TM proving his innocence rather than Gino proving his guilt ?

The evidence put forward by Gino is at best shakey his main point is that it's not possible to sculpt a face plate from scratch that accurate to a cast from original original face plate.

The faceplate as above is not accurate though it differs in many ways.
I have no doubt any number of people on this board could if they wanted to sculpt a face plate closer to accurate than TM's from scratch if you put an original in front of them and tonnes of photos.

The other bone of contention is this bump which only appears to be on two lids i'm sure there are a number of people here with TM lids early pulls and more recent.
How old are these two that have a bump ?

 

[exoray]

So you're saying the judgement should be made on TM proving his innocence rather than Gino proving his guilt ?

No I say all things equal I feel the evidence towards recasting is heavier then that against...

The evidence put forward by Gino is at best shakey

And I have yet to see anything of substance put forward to suggest an original sculpt... Nothing... Everything put forward thus far trying to claim original can easily weigh on the side of chances made to hide origins... I see nothing to teeter it in either direction they simply even out the scale...

The bump on the other hand as small as it is to me is the most damning for recast, the chance of coincidence is beyond what I would consider likely in the real world... This as small as it is for me teeters the scale towards the recast side...

For me all things are equal the scale is perfectly balanced to start with, no innocence or guilt that is for criminal trials... You start with a even balance in favor of neither side and then weight the supporting facts and see which way the scale tilts...

The other bone of contention is this bump which only appears to be on two lids i'm sure there are a number of people here with TM lids early pulls and more recent.
How old are these two that have a bump ?

I really don't see how this has any relevance... What does it matter when or at what time these were pulled? And there has only been two lids shown, it's not like we have seen a ton of other pictures there could be many more...

 

[Qui-Gonzalez]

Ok geeesh , I thought everyone spoketh Archaic English.

Thou wouldst be mistaken, forsooth!

 

[TKDUEUNO]

Ask this: how can TM prove his innocence over every reasonable doubt?

By posting a picture of the original mould?

The moulds are very different from finished helmets, they're sharper and smaller, it won't change anything for us non-vacuumformers.

What would be the smashing evidence that can convince even Gino that he really sculpted that faceplate from scratch?

 

[GINO]

Nothing because I know 100% for a fact that he did it.

This was never an 'I'm open to having my mind changed' thing.
It was more like, how can I show in picture form what I know to be true.
Just saying it isn't enough for people, you have to show them.
And for people who don't want it to be true, showing them isn't enough either.

.

 

[exoray]

By posting a picture of the original mould?

That would have been a start, better to show sculpting progress though, even a single word of defense from himself rather then his customers... Instead it appears he threatened and cussed his way right off the forum instead of even starting a defense, that to me says it all...

The moulds are very different from finished helmets, they're sharper and smaller, it won't change anything for us non-vacuumformers.

No they are not, they are very similar to the final product... Yes they are sharper and smaller but all the details remain consistent...

 

[TKDUEUNO]

Nothing because I know 100% for a fact that he did it.

This was never an 'I'm open to having my mind changed' thing.
It was more like, how can I show in picture form what I know to be true.
Just saying it isn't enough for people, you have to show them.
And for people who don't want it to be true, showing them isn't enough either.

.

Everyone knows your attitude Gino, also Ptolemy wasn't open to having his mind changed, but Copernicus kicked his @ss nonetheless.

Again, what would be the smashing evidence that could change your mind too?

 

[GINO]

Asking me that question is like saying, what would convince you that the moon is made of cheese?

We know for a fact the moon is not made of cheese.
I know for a fact that TM recast his helmet and didn't sculpt it from scratch.

What about you? What exactly would convince you that I'm right?

.

 

[TKDUEUNO]

What about you? What exactly would convince you that I'm right?

.

I've told it many times in this thread: a direct confession from TM himself.

And you still haven't answered my question, mr.cheese.

 

[Qui-Gonzalez]

I've told it many times in this thread: a direct confession from TM himself.

Wait wait wait....you honestly expect someone to ADMIT being a recaster? A guy, who after selling his wares to people and claiming his sculpting prowess, may have duped you all into thinking you were buying anything BUT recast goods and you expect him to out HIMSELF?

Wow...