MasterAnubis
Sr Member
So, here is 23 1/2 minutes of me rambling about what I used.
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Another P1 Mask... Silicone And Animatronics Done.
- Thread starter MasterAnubis
- Start date
TokyoRose
New Member
Watched the vid when it popped up on Youtube last night. Kind of made me want to do one of my own. I love seeing what tools others have in their kits and how they use them. (I had to reword that about 6 times, because everything I typed seemed like it was referring to genitalia... 
)
Great stuff though! Thanks for taking the time to put it together and share. And I know you've seen me on the Lab, but it was a great idea to include the link to Sendy's Sculpting skin Detail Tutorial. It's an amazing guide that I'm sure many members here haven't had the chance to read over.
)Great stuff though! Thanks for taking the time to put it together and share. And I know you've seen me on the Lab, but it was a great idea to include the link to Sendy's Sculpting skin Detail Tutorial. It's an amazing guide that I'm sure many members here haven't had the chance to read over.
MasterAnubis
Sr Member
No problem and your welcome.
You would have been the first on to actually see it. It took about 10 hours to upload it to YouTube. I don't have the fastest connection but the fact that it was a 1.6 gig video doesn't help. It started as a 2.6 gig video and then I recompressed it to 1.6 gig. It's all about the formats.
I think I lost the real direction of the video. The original intent was to show the sculpture and to show how to make a couple of the tools. You kind of don't realize how long your talking or how long these things take to do.
I encourage everyone to make videos of what they do, you get a better feel for what they're doing then a bunch of stills. Don't get me wrong I like pictoral articles too. That's one reason that I had to include the shout out to The Lab. I don't think I would have even known about some of those tools if it wasn't for them.
You would have been the first on to actually see it. It took about 10 hours to upload it to YouTube. I don't have the fastest connection but the fact that it was a 1.6 gig video doesn't help. It started as a 2.6 gig video and then I recompressed it to 1.6 gig. It's all about the formats.
I think I lost the real direction of the video. The original intent was to show the sculpture and to show how to make a couple of the tools. You kind of don't realize how long your talking or how long these things take to do.
I encourage everyone to make videos of what they do, you get a better feel for what they're doing then a bunch of stills. Don't get me wrong I like pictoral articles too. That's one reason that I had to include the shout out to The Lab. I don't think I would have even known about some of those tools if it wasn't for them.
MasterAnubis
Sr Member
OK, so I haven't turned my computer on in over three days... yes very odd for me. I've been a bit obsessed with this damn mold. I have spent more time on this then I ever expected and ever would have planned. I'm using all new materials to me with a bit of a learning curve so here it is all in its glory.
After talking with a sculptor/sales rep I decided to go with the Polygel 35. I'm still on the fence to whether I actually like it since I haven't cast anything in it yet and I spent a whole day making my mold. I'm told it is versatile in what I can cast in it so if it can actually cast resin, stone and silicone then I've saved a ton of time and money on not making another mold(at least, that was the plan).
This is Polytek's video about Polyfel 35, I used a lot of these techniques.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzmt63gWvvY
Going off of advice and some example molds I saw, I completely coated the sculpt with two layers. I guess I probably should have used the black dye I have like in the video but I didn't realize they were compatible. After the first layer I used Polyfill to thicken up the layers.
After those layers, I setup the seam line. I used strips of bubbles that I got from my sculpting store. (http://www.arizonasculpture.com/) I actually spent enough on this last trip to get a free t-shirt. I supported the bubbles with pins and taped them together so that they would be sturdy enough to stay with the weight of the Polygel.
Then another two layers are built up over the flange areas and the keys are added.
Here the flange gets trimmed to size:
Now time for the mother mold. I chose to tryout Forton MG, it's a resin and gypsum blend. The instructions were very poor to say the least. I'm very disenchanted with this stuff but I think I may like it more if I do it properly. I don't think I had it mixed well or ratioed properly or something. I'm told this stuff is excellent for outdoor use for statues.
This is the first part after three layers. The middle layer includes fiberglass.
I went a little complicated with a two piece plug for the mouth area. I used FGR-95 for it and used water based clay to make my parting line for the front half of the shell to be in two parts. I only used petroleum jelly on it to seal it and it worked OK but I probably should have sprayed clear or something. I also used some mold release but that didn't seem to do much.
This is the completed shell before drilling bolt holes.
Here is where is turn south... bad. I go the remove the shell and everything just breaks apart. The one side that came off in one piece was the side I used more fiberglass in. So, I should have used more fiberglass. You can see the repairs on the top and fron of the background piece after I did a thickness "break check" and realized that it was pretty brittle.
The carnage of the shell.
By now, I was pretty tired of working with uncooperative materials and was about to fiberglass and resin the whole thing. I opted to continue with the Forton MG and use more fiberglass. This worked and I reinforced all of it. I somehow misplaced a flange key and I didn't feel like remaking it. -note-this picture is out of order to show the repaired reinforced shell.
So now with the shell done I can cut out the sculpture. Here I remove a pin I used and pull out all of the plastic part line. I just needed to run an x-acto knife down it and it was cut out.
I pulled the top over and it mushed the sculpt a little.
The front half. This pic is of it without the support shell and it holds its shape well. The popular part line turned out to be a good choice.
I used a scrap piece of plastic to cap the bottom and in this pic it holds up the front half. The back half is standing on its own.
All in all, I've learned a bunch. I'm pretty pissed at the actual time I have into the mold though. I still need to cast up the teeth and mandibles. I want to make a stone casting first to make sure they fit perfectly.
After talking with a sculptor/sales rep I decided to go with the Polygel 35. I'm still on the fence to whether I actually like it since I haven't cast anything in it yet and I spent a whole day making my mold. I'm told it is versatile in what I can cast in it so if it can actually cast resin, stone and silicone then I've saved a ton of time and money on not making another mold(at least, that was the plan).
This is Polytek's video about Polyfel 35, I used a lot of these techniques.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzmt63gWvvY
Going off of advice and some example molds I saw, I completely coated the sculpt with two layers. I guess I probably should have used the black dye I have like in the video but I didn't realize they were compatible. After the first layer I used Polyfill to thicken up the layers.
After those layers, I setup the seam line. I used strips of bubbles that I got from my sculpting store. (http://www.arizonasculpture.com/) I actually spent enough on this last trip to get a free t-shirt. I supported the bubbles with pins and taped them together so that they would be sturdy enough to stay with the weight of the Polygel.
Then another two layers are built up over the flange areas and the keys are added.
Here the flange gets trimmed to size:
Now time for the mother mold. I chose to tryout Forton MG, it's a resin and gypsum blend. The instructions were very poor to say the least. I'm very disenchanted with this stuff but I think I may like it more if I do it properly. I don't think I had it mixed well or ratioed properly or something. I'm told this stuff is excellent for outdoor use for statues.
This is the first part after three layers. The middle layer includes fiberglass.
I went a little complicated with a two piece plug for the mouth area. I used FGR-95 for it and used water based clay to make my parting line for the front half of the shell to be in two parts. I only used petroleum jelly on it to seal it and it worked OK but I probably should have sprayed clear or something. I also used some mold release but that didn't seem to do much.
This is the completed shell before drilling bolt holes.
Here is where is turn south... bad. I go the remove the shell and everything just breaks apart. The one side that came off in one piece was the side I used more fiberglass in. So, I should have used more fiberglass. You can see the repairs on the top and fron of the background piece after I did a thickness "break check" and realized that it was pretty brittle.
The carnage of the shell.
By now, I was pretty tired of working with uncooperative materials and was about to fiberglass and resin the whole thing. I opted to continue with the Forton MG and use more fiberglass. This worked and I reinforced all of it. I somehow misplaced a flange key and I didn't feel like remaking it. -note-this picture is out of order to show the repaired reinforced shell.
So now with the shell done I can cut out the sculpture. Here I remove a pin I used and pull out all of the plastic part line. I just needed to run an x-acto knife down it and it was cut out.
I pulled the top over and it mushed the sculpt a little.
The front half. This pic is of it without the support shell and it holds its shape well. The popular part line turned out to be a good choice.
I used a scrap piece of plastic to cap the bottom and in this pic it holds up the front half. The back half is standing on its own.
All in all, I've learned a bunch. I'm pretty pissed at the actual time I have into the mold though. I still need to cast up the teeth and mandibles. I want to make a stone casting first to make sure they fit perfectly.
Darth Pinhead
Active Member
Great documentation of the molding process, on top of a beautiful sculpt. Anticipating the first pull!
Guan Thwei
New Member
Sorry that the process was so difficult for you man I hope that the latex pull comes out better then this thing did
MasterAnubis
Sr Member
Your all welcome and thanks for the compliments.
No latex in this one, just resin, stone or silicone.
Well, not any time soon anyway. I've got to get things ironed out. (a whole lot of stuff going on with me)
So I just pulled my first whole head. I did a small test patch which will end up as a wall hanger.
The seems came out outstanding. I couldn't have asked for better. This is FGR-95, a gypsum.
I've got some small air bubbles from slushing and the mold has a bubble on the upper lip. Kind of a bummer but all things considered I'm really happy and relieved that was it.
The seams right out of the mold.
.
It's all good... now.Sorry that the process was so difficult for you man I hope that the latex pull comes out better then this thing did
No latex in this one, just resin, stone or silicone. Um.... no.
Well, not any time soon anyway. I've got to get things ironed out. (a whole lot of stuff going on with me)So I just pulled my first whole head. I did a small test patch which will end up as a wall hanger.
The seems came out outstanding. I couldn't have asked for better. This is FGR-95, a gypsum.
I've got some small air bubbles from slushing and the mold has a bubble on the upper lip. Kind of a bummer but all things considered I'm really happy and relieved that was it.
The seams right out of the mold.
.
PredatrHuntr
Master Member
Great looking molds and casting! Kudos!
MasterAnubis
Sr Member
Thanks again, guys .
What I've found out:
-For the mother mold, the FMG I mixed had too much FGR-95. I didn't need to use as much fiberglass as I used either. If I mixed it right in the first place the original shell I made would have been perfect. After finding that out, I think the FMG is some good stuff. I'll eventually try making a bust in it and maybe even trying some bronze powder.
-I was using the Mann 200 as a release agent in addition to the spots that got the petroleum jelly. The Mann 200 is not the stuff I should be using since it may interact with the silicone because it is silicone based. I got Poly-ease 2500. It can be used for releasing silicone without interacting with it.
-Since Gel 10 is a Polytek product I can get it locally too. So when I'm ready with my paints/pigments, I'll be able to buy it on short notice.
-I got some "unintended texturing" when the brush was dabbed into the sculpture. This is pretty weird but it shows that this PolyGel picks up some awesome detail.
Overall, after taking a breather from it, I'm really happy with this mold. I really didn't like how long it took to make but this turned out great.
.What I've found out:
-For the mother mold, the FMG I mixed had too much FGR-95. I didn't need to use as much fiberglass as I used either. If I mixed it right in the first place the original shell I made would have been perfect. After finding that out, I think the FMG is some good stuff. I'll eventually try making a bust in it and maybe even trying some bronze powder.
-I was using the Mann 200 as a release agent in addition to the spots that got the petroleum jelly. The Mann 200 is not the stuff I should be using since it may interact with the silicone because it is silicone based. I got Poly-ease 2500. It can be used for releasing silicone without interacting with it.
-Since Gel 10 is a Polytek product I can get it locally too. So when I'm ready with my paints/pigments, I'll be able to buy it on short notice.
-I got some "unintended texturing" when the brush was dabbed into the sculpture. This is pretty weird but it shows that this PolyGel picks up some awesome detail.
Overall, after taking a breather from it, I'm really happy with this mold. I really didn't like how long it took to make but this turned out great.
Last edited by a moderator:
Guan Thwei
New Member
Ok it is official I'm coming over sometime soon and looking at your science lab of molding
tehfailsafe
New Member
Could you explain a bit on the bubble strips you used to shim them with? How did you get it to stay perpendicular after adding more silicone?
It's awesome how great it came out. Is it possible to cast latex in a silicone mold at all?
It's awesome how great it came out. Is it possible to cast latex in a silicone mold at all?
MasterAnubis
Sr Member
Polygel-35 is a polyurethane rubber not a silicone. It’s cheaper than the silicone counterpart but works a lot like it. I’ll definitely be using it again. My understanding is that it likes to stick to just about everything, except silicone. Which is why it’s a suitable choice for silicone casting.
I’ll try to explain the bubbles better. I think the pictures should show the most of the details if you look closely, this was the best picture that I took that shows it:
The bubbles were from a sheet that I bought at my sculpting supply. I it came with three size bubbles and I cut them into strips and then into smaller sections to better follow the curve. It’s called “E-Z Fin Bubble Sheet “ .
From: http://www.sculpture...sting-tools.htm
I liked the way the small bubbles worked better then the medium ones(I don't think I can use the big ones). There were easier to cover and fill in rubber and they didn’t need me to make the flange too much thicker. I feel they aligned better too. What I did as I was putting it together was tape them with clear tape. If it drooped a little, then I added a straight pin through the mold and into the sculpture then taped it to the plastic too. That made it pretty secure. They got sprayed with mold release after that. Be sure not to get any on the rubber if possible, it will prevent the layers from bonding on those areas.
The bigger bubbles were nearly impossible to fill upside down. I ended up putting in pre made bubbles that I poured into other bubbles before that. Then fill over it and hoped it stayed long enough to cure. I will not put anymore bubbles facing up again.
As far as casting latex in it goes, I believe if you treat it like your making a mold it could work. But, a mask has a lot of deep crevices that would take more time to cure and would have to be brushed on in thin layers not slip cast. It sounds very time consuming and would not yield best results.
troggs
New Member
Excellent result in the end, well done for sticking with it through all the mould making problems - the only thing I'm not sure about are the bubble strips, did you have to cut a slot for them in the two layers of gel you'd already applied? Looking forward to seeing the completed bust.
MasterAnubis
Sr Member
If I understand your question, no. The bubble strips went on top of the layers without cutting them. The last two layers go on then the mother mold is made. Once the mother mold is ready to remove, then the plastic and the pins got removed. Then I spread the flange apart enough to cut through to the sculpture with an Xacto knife. Then the mold can be removed from the sculpture.Excellent result in the end, well done for sticking with it through all the mould making problems - the only thing I'm not sure about are the bubble strips, did you have to cut a slot for them in the two layers of gel you'd already applied? Looking forward to seeing the completed bust.
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