cboath
Master Member
Re: Kathleen Kennedy to step down from Lucasfilm?
Marvel does the 6 month gap (or less) thing yearly and has for like a freaking decade. So it's less so the timing of it.
I think the big thing is that no one was clamoring for this. It wasn't really needed and it wasn't asked for. There were 3 character movies talked about prior to TFA. Han, Fett, and Ben. The only one I personally had any interest in was Ben. That may have a lot to do with the fact it'd star Ewan doing Ben (whom i like and think does great with the role). That in and of itself isn't an indictment of Alden. I don't have a any real issues with him even in this role, though i admit i thought it was a less than ideal choice. But, even at that, i'm not 'ohh i gotta see that ben movie'. I don't think it'll approach SW BO levels either.
Another big thing is the general public likely didn't identify the movie as likely good. There were publicly known issues (from fans) about casting, multiple articles and the directors being fired, etc. Nothing about it screamed success.
Couple that stuff with bad feelings with a large part of the core fan base over TLJ and you have the makings of something not likely to be a big hit. The studio didn't do much of anything to generate interest or positive word prior to the opening either. For a SW flick - it kinda flew under the radar with very limited ads. I don't think too much of movies when the majority of the commericials are here's product A, it's really cool, you should buy this (with SW music in the background) and once the commercial ends See Solo in theaters. To me, that's if YOU don't care enough to advertise your own movie, why should i care to see it? An SW is not the only movie that does this and I feel the same regardless. Have the balls to promote your own stuff.
There was a singular aspect of this that was supposed to be a draw for people: It was a move about a beloved character. That, in and of itself, does not make anyone want to see it. You still have to give people a reason to WANT to see it.
It's what makes me think IX's sales will be a far cry from VIII. There isn't going to be a large 'want' out there. Even for those who liked TLJ, there's nothing we know of that will be in IX right now to make you WANT to see. You may be interested in continuation, but there's not a compelling reason.
There was a compelling reason to ESB even though there weren't really any loose ends from ANH. It was a massive hit and people wanted more.
ROTJ had open plot lines to be concluded and ESB was excellent and people WANTED more.
(people wanted more after ROTJ, but had to wait 16 years to get it).
TPM had want. Then people saw it But there was want.
Even at that AOTC and ROTS still had want because people knew how things ended but wanted to see how it got there. The want was waning a bit though
Nothing again. But when sequels were anounced, people wanted to see VII. Badly. It left open stories and people wanted to see luke, badly still.
So there was want for TLJ. The last jedi kind of stomped on the heart of SW and even if you disagree, the core audience are fans of the originals and they showed they don't really care about that group. Plus, they didn't leave any real loose ends.
So, is there really any "Want" left out there for IX?
To tie this back to KK and ILM. That's kind of the job of the studio - to keep that want there. To keep the people interested. Doesn't matter how good or bad a flick is if no one wants to see it in the first place. I'm sorry, but that is WHY you have a story group. You do not take star wars and create a trilogy and tell the first guy 'do whatever you want' and then tell the second guy pick up where the first guy left off and do whatever you want and the third guy just has to deal with the whole thing and end it. No, no, no.
You need at least a loosely defined plan. Directors, are hired to DIRECT a story. Not to create the whole thing. Writers create the story and the writers tend to have to answer to someone. Whether that's the person who created the story or the studio. But there needs to be a story and the directors are hired to execute the story. That's the entire point of the job, right? To execute the story. It is not to create and execute it. People get sick of marvel comparisons, i know, but it's the closest thing we've got. The Russo's directed Infinity War (and part 4). They couldn't do whatever they wanted as there was a plan in place over a 10 year span. I'm sure there had ample freedom, but not complete. They were hired to do the infinity war and they were told what had to be accomplished. So far, they've done brilliantly. They were not able to do whatever they wanted. Period. There were specific guidelines. it's part of the job. I'm sure they were free to argue a point if they felt something needed adjusted but they couldn't just up and do whatever they wanted.
Not having that for this trilogy and beyond is completely on the studio and the lead. I think that's a big part of the problem. You can't guide something you want to keep going for a long time without having a targeted plan. They seem to have failed in that respect and I think it's really hurting things now.
Marvel does the 6 month gap (or less) thing yearly and has for like a freaking decade. So it's less so the timing of it.
I think the big thing is that no one was clamoring for this. It wasn't really needed and it wasn't asked for. There were 3 character movies talked about prior to TFA. Han, Fett, and Ben. The only one I personally had any interest in was Ben. That may have a lot to do with the fact it'd star Ewan doing Ben (whom i like and think does great with the role). That in and of itself isn't an indictment of Alden. I don't have a any real issues with him even in this role, though i admit i thought it was a less than ideal choice. But, even at that, i'm not 'ohh i gotta see that ben movie'. I don't think it'll approach SW BO levels either.
Another big thing is the general public likely didn't identify the movie as likely good. There were publicly known issues (from fans) about casting, multiple articles and the directors being fired, etc. Nothing about it screamed success.
Couple that stuff with bad feelings with a large part of the core fan base over TLJ and you have the makings of something not likely to be a big hit. The studio didn't do much of anything to generate interest or positive word prior to the opening either. For a SW flick - it kinda flew under the radar with very limited ads. I don't think too much of movies when the majority of the commericials are here's product A, it's really cool, you should buy this (with SW music in the background) and once the commercial ends See Solo in theaters. To me, that's if YOU don't care enough to advertise your own movie, why should i care to see it? An SW is not the only movie that does this and I feel the same regardless. Have the balls to promote your own stuff.
There was a singular aspect of this that was supposed to be a draw for people: It was a move about a beloved character. That, in and of itself, does not make anyone want to see it. You still have to give people a reason to WANT to see it.
It's what makes me think IX's sales will be a far cry from VIII. There isn't going to be a large 'want' out there. Even for those who liked TLJ, there's nothing we know of that will be in IX right now to make you WANT to see. You may be interested in continuation, but there's not a compelling reason.
There was a compelling reason to ESB even though there weren't really any loose ends from ANH. It was a massive hit and people wanted more.
ROTJ had open plot lines to be concluded and ESB was excellent and people WANTED more.
(people wanted more after ROTJ, but had to wait 16 years to get it).
TPM had want. Then people saw it But there was want.
Even at that AOTC and ROTS still had want because people knew how things ended but wanted to see how it got there. The want was waning a bit though
Nothing again. But when sequels were anounced, people wanted to see VII. Badly. It left open stories and people wanted to see luke, badly still.
So there was want for TLJ. The last jedi kind of stomped on the heart of SW and even if you disagree, the core audience are fans of the originals and they showed they don't really care about that group. Plus, they didn't leave any real loose ends.
So, is there really any "Want" left out there for IX?
To tie this back to KK and ILM. That's kind of the job of the studio - to keep that want there. To keep the people interested. Doesn't matter how good or bad a flick is if no one wants to see it in the first place. I'm sorry, but that is WHY you have a story group. You do not take star wars and create a trilogy and tell the first guy 'do whatever you want' and then tell the second guy pick up where the first guy left off and do whatever you want and the third guy just has to deal with the whole thing and end it. No, no, no.
You need at least a loosely defined plan. Directors, are hired to DIRECT a story. Not to create the whole thing. Writers create the story and the writers tend to have to answer to someone. Whether that's the person who created the story or the studio. But there needs to be a story and the directors are hired to execute the story. That's the entire point of the job, right? To execute the story. It is not to create and execute it. People get sick of marvel comparisons, i know, but it's the closest thing we've got. The Russo's directed Infinity War (and part 4). They couldn't do whatever they wanted as there was a plan in place over a 10 year span. I'm sure there had ample freedom, but not complete. They were hired to do the infinity war and they were told what had to be accomplished. So far, they've done brilliantly. They were not able to do whatever they wanted. Period. There were specific guidelines. it's part of the job. I'm sure they were free to argue a point if they felt something needed adjusted but they couldn't just up and do whatever they wanted.
Not having that for this trilogy and beyond is completely on the studio and the lead. I think that's a big part of the problem. You can't guide something you want to keep going for a long time without having a targeted plan. They seem to have failed in that respect and I think it's really hurting things now.