Your Indiana Jones Displays - Lets see 'em

[kevin926]

These are a bunch of shelf items In Star Wars

welders goggles
Tupperware
Flash guns
Car parts
Webley and lee enfield and Mauser guns
Cameras

the list goes on

 

[VonMagnum]

Some items are collectors items almost immediately even if they’re not used in films. Those items will remain hard to find and expensive. I have yet to see a real world part labeled as Indiana Jones but I’m not saying it doesn’t happen

the pocket knife is very expensive but it’s also one of those sought after collectors items

Compared to some of the other items, both pocket knives were "reasonable" for what you get, IMO (the Raiders one and Mutt's Crystal Kingdom switchblade were both <$200 brand new as they're both still made). Quality pocket knives aren't cheap (movie or not). A friend at work has several and he paid over $200 for a few of them that weren't in any movie. Unfortunately, the Raiders one isn't likely to match the handle in the movie since it's a real antler based handle. I've thought about modifying mine with a Dremel tool and some stain to look much closer, but people keep telling me NO! That destroys the value of the knife. Yeah, well, not matching the movie visually also reduces its value a bit too.

 

[kevin926]

Compared to some of the other items, both pocket knives were "reasonable" for what you get, IMO (the Raiders one and Mutt's Crystal Kingdom switchblade were both <$200 brand new as they're both still made). Quality pocket knives aren't cheap (movie or not). A friend at work has several and he paid over $200 for a few of them that weren't in any movie. Unfortunately, the Raiders one isn't likely to match the handle in the movie since it's a real antler based handle. I've thought about modifying mine with a Dremel tool and some stain to look much closer, but people keep telling me NO! That destroys the value of the knife. Yeah, well, not matching the movie visually also reduces its value a bit too.

Bone handle knives are born expensive regardless of what they end up doing I would also stay clear of a switch blade They were never legal to own and it’s not really on my list of props .

 

[VonMagnum]

These are a bunch of shelf items In Star Wars

welders goggles
Tupperware
Flash guns
Car parts
Webley and lee enfield and Mauser guns
Cameras

the list goes on

I don't follow Star Wars as much as Indiana Jones so I'm far less aware of what was used, but personally, those items don't interest me for the simple reason they're not supposed to be those items (again a long time ago in a galaxy far far away means they're not supposed to be Webley and Mauser guns or Tupperware, etc. even if the prop is made of or with them. I'm sure that doesn't matter to many Star Wars fans that just want accurate props, but part of the appeal of some Indy items to me, anyway, is that they were REAL period items, like the IMCO Super 6700 lighter (even if it's unlikely Marion would have one that year since they were just out in Austria and hadn't been widespread yet; it's STILL a real lighter that really existed in 1936. I collect vintage lighters now just because owning a working lighter that is almost 100 years old has a "cool" factor to it that other items like say furniture just don't have. Indiana Jones is all about history (real or imagined) and having the actual pocket watch Belloq is holding that is from the 1930s is kind of cool.

I've got two lighters with historical significance (one was a wedding gift Ronson Touch-Tip lighter given in 1943 in the middle of World War II to Walter K. Whigham with signatures from people in the electric company in England, two of which went on to British Parliament and Whigham himself went on to have a world record breaking steam train locomotive named after him shortly after the war was over. How the heck I own this guy's wedding gift seems almost crazy to me, especially when his family still exists and are quite rich in England. Similarly, I have a Dunhill table lighter from 1946 that was owned by the only Ace pilot to shoot down both German and Japanese fighters in WWII (Dean "Diz" Laird) who the last time I checked was still alive at 98 years old! How his lighter came up for sale, I don't know and believe me the owner didn't know either or he would have charged a lot more for it. It's not quite like owning something from someone really famous like Albert Einstein or whatever, but still, anything historical is pretty neat to own, especially the older it becomes.

Bone handle knives are born expensive regardless of what they end up doing I would also stay clear of a switch blade They were never legal to own and it’s not really on my list of props .

Switch blades are perfectly legal in where I'm located and always have been (whether they're legal depends on where you live) to keep at home and in the past two years were cleared for concealed carry without a permit, even so I'm not concerned about owning one. Here's my Mutt replica made with the same finish/handle (buffalo horn) by the same maker in Italy:

My Raiders knife:

 

[kevin926]

I would be perfectly happy with your knife . Close enough to Indys . Besides , movie props usually have a bunch more on hand Incase they lose one or the lighting causes issues I don’t know the real reasons but I do know there are a few and perhaps not all are the same . This was proven in Star Wars props and Lucas is Indy as well .

 

[MaverickFerg]

All this talk about "real world" props (combined with the fact that I'm working on a Ravenwood Diary at the moment) got me thinking about the surveying instrument that Indy uses to locate the Well of the Souls in ROTLA. After some intense Google research, and a few emails to some vintage surveyor equipment experts, I've finally tracked down some interesting findings!

The model he uses in the film appears to be manufactured by Keuffel & Esser Co. of Hoboken NJ. The film prop appears to be based on the "Engineer's Railroad Transit" No. 5160, however a few modifications seem to have been made to the screen-used prop - specifically:
-The screen-used prop appears to have been painted matte black (perhaps to cut down on any glare from the original brass for filming?)
-The originals have a large "wheel" attachment on one side. Experts I've spoken with indicated that these transits were very "modular" so it's possible the wheel was removed for filming so it didn't block the camera's view of HF for the scene.
-Indy is using it upside down! (Do a quick Google search on vintage transits and you will find that the smaller "tube" always goes on the bottom in normal use!)

These were made throughout the early 1900s, so it would certainly make them period accurate. (I was able to pick one up off of the Bay with serial number 322123 which dates it to 1916.)

I'm attaching some screen grabs of the movie prop as well as some pictures of the one I ordered (I'll post better pics when it actually comes in). I was also able to find a pdf version of the K&E catalog from 1909, so I'm also attaching the relevant pages. (I might even print those out and include them in my Ravenwood diary as an insert, simply because they look cool.) Interestingly enough, these retailed for $175 (in 1909) which would be equivalent to almost $5000 today, accounting for inflation.

Unfortunately, the one I found didn't include a tripod, so the prop archaeology quest for that continues.

 

[Indy Magnoli]

Great find! I don't think I've seen one of these in another collection.

 

[kevin926]

So who has the list of real world props.


I will be clear this time and exclude these props.
sankara stones and script
idol
ra staff
cross
tablet
coins and diamond
urn
antidote

you get the picture.

Real world parts
hat
bag
bottles
lighters
Watches, and so on.

I do have most of these however I'm curious about books. I'm sure the books in the background were just random, however some of those we seen him open and reference illustrations or text. Are these made up or real books that we can still find?

 

[MCINTOSH275]

So who has the list of real world props.


I will be clear this time and exclude these props.
sankara stones and script
idol
ra staff
cross
tablet
coins and diamond
urn
antidote

you get the picture.

Real world parts
hat
bag
bottles
lighters
Watches, and so on.

I do have most of these however I'm curious about books. I'm sure the books in the background were just random, however some of those we seen him open and reference illustrations or text. Are these made up or real books that we can still find?

They are real books and some can be found, i have three at the moment...

 

[MaverickFerg]

Most of the books can still be found used on Amazon or Abe Books. Here's the list of books I've collected over the years, although there may be more:

(Since MCINTOSH275 already posted pictures, I'll just include the bibliographic details here.)

Clark, Grahame. (1957). Archaeology and Society. Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press.
Berton, Pierre. (1959). The Mysterious North. New York: Alfred A. Knopf.
Steward, Julian H., & Faron, Louis C. (1959). Native Peoples of South America. New York: McGraw-Hill Book Company, Inc.
Strand, Paul & Aldridge, James. (1969). Living Egypt. New York: Horizon Press
Guise, Hillary. (1980). Great Victorian Engravings: A Collector's Guide. London: Astragal Books
Society of Antiquaries of London. (1936). Archaeologia or Miscellaneous Tracts Relating to Antiquity. Volume LXXXVI (86). Oxford: The Society of Antiquaries.

 

[MaverickFerg]

A couple of other "real world" props that come to mind include:

1. Knives (already discussed at length above): Indy's pocketknife (ROTLA), Mutt's Switchblade (KOTCS)
2. Indy's Various Desk Accessories: Antique globe (ROTLA), Brass Magnifying Glass Stand (ROTLA), Vintage GE Fan (ROTLA), 3-Bulb Hour Glass by Wilson & Co. Ltd. Barnsley (KOTCS)
3. Henry Sr.'s Pens: Conway Stewart Series 58 - Lever Fill (LC - from tank scene), Summit S100 Cadet (LC - appears in the Lucasfilm Archives Book)
4. Pocket Watches: Belloq's Watch - Ingersoll Triumph (ROTLA), Henry Sr.'s Pocket Watch (LC)
5. Indy's Compass (ROTLA) - Verner's Pattern Prismatic (Mk VI-VIII)
6. Indy's Guns - Covered in great detail in this post: Indy’s Guns
7. German Alpine Rucksack (KOTCS)

Chances are good that if you have questions, want to see pictures of the items, or want more details about how they were featured in the movies, someone here will be able to chime in.

Perhaps it would be an interesting project to start a thread of all the real-world props with details and pictures of each for reference!

 

[Lightning]

but the film apparently used a cheap Chinese modern knockoff and painted it to look like the Masterlite (how bloody cheap can a film crew get when the real thing is often for sale for not a lot of money?).

The need for redundant extra replacement props will always push propmasters to go with modern versions when possible. It's just plain difficult to track down multiple matching vintage items. Unless they get lucky and find a whole case, like with military surplus.

Are these made up or real books that we can still find?

In addition to those mentioned, there is also 'Living Egypt' by Paul Strand and James Aldridge on his desk in Last Crusade.

Perhaps it would be an interesting project to start a thread of all the real-world props with details and pictures of each for reference!

That's a great idea.

Indy's typewriter in Crystal Skull is a Corona Speedline, in maroon.

 

[kevin926]

2nd the motion for its own thread . lol

Thanks, I knew you guys would pull through and post . Henry Sr. And Belloq use the same watch. I have it.

To me, Indy Movies are mostly intellectual with added @#$ Kicking here and there, so books and maps are a huge part in his prop collecting.

 

[Jamesfett]

I am totally blanking I guess. When does he use a compass in Raiders?

Thanks

 

[kevin926]

I am totally blanking I guess. When does he use a compass in Raiders?

Thanks

I want to say during the idol hunt, but I'm pulling off memory, by the lake with the torn up map

 

[agent5]

I want to say during the idol hunt, but I'm pulling off memory, by the lake with the torn up map

Locating the Well of Souls. Deleted scene.

 

[MaverickFerg]

2nd the motion for its own thread . lol

I created a thread for us here: Indiana Jones - 'Real World' Props

Feel free to add your own real world props to the list!

 

[Remote People]

Check out post #619 in this thread for his compass.

 

[VonMagnum]

The model he uses in the film appears to be manufactured by Keuffel & Esser Co. of Hoboken NJ. The film prop appears to be based on the "Engineer's Railroad Transit" No. 5160, however a few modifications seem to have been made to the screen-used prop - specifically:
-The screen-used prop appears to have been painted matte black (perhaps to cut down on any glare from the original brass for filming?)
-The originals have a large "wheel" attachment on one side. Experts I've spoken with indicated that these transits were very "modular" so it's possible the wheel was removed for filming so it didn't block the camera's view of HF for the scene.
-Indy is using it upside down! (Do a quick Google search on vintage transits and you will find that the smaller "tube" always goes on the bottom in normal use!)

Interesting find. However, what makes you certain it's a Keuffel & Esser Co transit, though? I've located several other brands that looks quite similar and I cannot make out enough detail on the compass to tell (most have the company name on the compass).

I've been looking at numerous K&E models for sale and it seems some did come in matte black (see two examples below), although there were still some brass fittings on them (but even in the snapshot you posted, there is still brass at the eye lens and a few parts on it, so how much they actually painted I don't know. I've seen at least three for sale with a black lens on the end and the lenses vary in size and attachments as well. Some come with the wheel on the side and some don't. I've seen one for sale that is upside down like the one in the movie as well (perhaps they put it together incorrectly?). The tripods also varied a fair bit as did the compass style and color (which was also apparently an optional module as many for sale don't have one at all). I suppose the issue for any collector would be how accurate to the movie do you need it? 100%? 90%?

The most accurate looking one I found didn't include the tripod (despite one featured in the photo that looks very close) and was priced over $500 once shipping was included. I found another one that is more reasonable and includes a tripod, but the tripod isn't the same and the lens mount is a bit different (fancier mechanism than the movie). That one doesn't have the wheel, though and has a cracked compass glass.


Very close looking (wheel can probably be removed) and I'm sure it could be displayed upside down.

Cracked compass, but no wheel and it does have a tripod included (not shown), but the mounting mechanism to allow different lenses isn't on the one in the movie. It's already mounted upside down like the movie, though. You can see where a wheel could be attached or removed on the side, though. The "surround" around the compass part isn't there like the above one either.

Neither are exact and both cost over $300 with shipping included. I don't think I even have a place to display them left in my home theater, although a tripod would make it bit easier to put anywhere there's some free floor space (not much left here).

Here's an antique Brandis & Sons transit. It looks quite similar other than reading the compass up close (bit of dirt/dust on it as well) and since the movie one doesn't have the side wheel installed, that's no indicator of the difference, thus I'm not sure how to tell the movie one is a K&E transit.

 

[MaverickFerg]

Interesting find. However, what makes you certain it's a Keuffel & Esser Co transit, though? I've located several other brands that looks quite similar and I cannot make out enough detail on the compass to tell (most have the company name on the compass).

As with most of these “real world” props, you’re absolutely right, it’s hard to be 100% certain of a specific make and model. In this case it’s also complicated by the fact that these transits were manufactured for many years in the early 1900s, which could result in minor differences in the same model year-over-year.

Mine is supposed to arrive tomorrow, so I will be able to match parts with the screen captures with more certainty once I can put the actual model in the same position as the screen used caps. I will post more pictures with a more detailed part by part analysis then.

For now, I’m about 90% sure that the model used in the movie was a K&E Railroad Transit for a couple of reasons.

1. The ‘U’ shaped mounting brackets are one of the biggest differences between other models and manufacturers. Many others (including the Brandis& Sons that you mention above) have cross bars and different attachment pieces where the transit mounts to the actual bracket.
2. Many transits (even in the K&E line) are much shorter in length than the Railroad transit. When you compare the screen grabs, you can see based on HF’s head and hands for scale, that it’s rather long.
3. The eye piece and opposite end have distinctive shapes. These are consistent with the Railroad transit.
4. The various screws and attachments on the scope itself and also the levels on the compass part are in distinctive spots that match the railroad transit. (This is another key difference in a lot of the other manufacturers.)
5. The location of the attachment of the smaller “tube” to the scope, combined with the placement of the focus knobs was a key indicator and difference between models. (Again, you can really see this when you compare it to the Brandis & Sons picture above. The tube attaches almost at the eye piece, where on the screen captures you can see it attached a few inches in - more in the middle of the scope.)

Like I said, I’m still not even 100% sure, but hopefully having the actual model in hand and being able to post comparisons with it in the same angle as the screen captures will increase that certainty. Also, as I mentioned - I did consult with a few antique surveying equipment experts who were actually the ones who pointed me in the direction of K&E in the first place just based on the movie screen grabs I sent them.

Also, like you pointed out, these things were very modular, they could be ordered in a number of configurations with lots of variation. The likelihood of any one of us happening to find the exact same configuration used in the movie is pretty slim (but that’s never stopped us from trying before!) As you said, it’s up to each collector to decide how “close” is close enough for your collection.

Hopefully soon I’ll be able to post some more convincing evidence with photo comparison proof.