UPDATED! Lots of new Captain America pics! SPOILERS AHEAD !!!

[MooCriket]

okay, one question.....where is the nazi symbols? did they magically make up hydra or was hydra in the comic cooks?

It's all about marketing. Not too many parents are going to by toys with Nazi swaztika's on them. Really a shame that it has to be so sanitized. What's wrong with having a bad guy with the symbols the way it was created?...Oh that's right we need to sell some toys.

 

[CTF]

I still say his head should be brown...

 

[El Duderino]

 

[CTF]

Again, it should be brown.

He is a Nazi, after all.

And Captain America could call him "Poo-poo-head," too, which would be hilarious.

 

[Rupert_Angier]

okay, one question.....where is the nazi symbols?

Exactly!

 

[GeorgeC]

It's all about marketing. Not too many parents are going to by toys with Nazi swaztika's on them. Really a shame that it has to be so sanitized. What's wrong with having a bad guy with the symbols the way it was created?...Oh that's right we need to sell some toys.

This is EXACTLY what is wrong with superhero films today...

They're really not made to be faithful to the comics let alone tell a good story, dammit! "Sell toys and license the **** out of everything! Story and film quality be damned!"

The 3 or 4 good live-action superhero adaptations I've seen were obviously flukes.
Thank goodness the jerks that interfere with the live-action stuff leave the animated TV adaptations alone! Those have generally been better than any of the live-action films AND most of the direct-to-video animated films!
(Speaking of the DC animated series... Wake me up if Marvel ever gets it right!)

Yeah, the toy marketing/kiddie excuse doesn't wash well with me.

I like my history to be told with ACCURACY and FACT. Political correctness doesn't wash well with me with any era of history.

The fact that the Nazi past of the Skull is being rushed through for the Hydra stuff doesn't sit well with me and a lot of history AND Captain America fans. You can't stress enough how evil the Skull really is... He lives up to the worst aspects of the swastika.

Getting an action figure with a swastika isn't going to turn a kid into a Nazi. The environment he grows up in and his parents will decide that...

We all know swastikas in connection with World War II aren't cute but do we have to white-wash everything for the sake of kids??????



P.S. -- You know customized figures of the Skull with the swastika or repaints with authentic World War II markings are coming.... Marvel's not going to let a mass run version of the Nazi Skull be done because of concerns about Aryan Nation and white supremacist -- in addition to catching hell from the ADL. Guessing e-Bay auctions with customized Skulls won't happen for the same reason in the US or Europe.

This isn't the first time the Red Skull's been sanitized. When the original Captain America cartoons were made in the 1960's, Jack Kirby's art from his Tales of Suspense run was used for the bulk of those 13 or so episodes. All Nazi symbols were erased from the art that was photocopied onto animation cels. Even Hitler, who appeared in several of the Captain America "Suspense" issues was replaced with a bald generic dictator-type design.

Sad state of affairs when we can't represent more semblance of reality in what was originally intended to be a warning of and call for action against the Nazis. Those are two of the reasons Cap was created early in WWII in the first place!

 

[MooCriket]

^Very true and very well spoken.

 

[JD]

This is EXACTLY what is wrong with superhero films today...

I like my history to be told with ACCURACY and FACT. Political correctness doesn't wash well with me with any era of history.

Well, do you want a superhero movie or do you want accurate, historical depiction of WWII or something?

Because - there weren't any superheroes in the past, so you're not going to get an accuracy and fact with a guy throwing a shield around.'' :confused

For the most part, these are movies made for the masses. If you can accept a man in a mask and shield and another man with a red skull for a face, then really it shouldn't take too much more to imagine Hydra represents Nazi Germany.

 

[Westies14]

I wish the nazis were more prevalent in this as well (I understand they ARE in the film, but the Hydra "branch" is featured), but let's keep some perspective...

I like my history to be told with ACCURACY and FACT.

You realize this is a movie about a superhero who's injected with a "super-serum" and fights his way through Nazi (okay, Hydra) armies with a metal frisbee?

The 3 or 4 good live-action superhero adaptations I've seen were obviously flukes.

Because they want to downplay the swastika in this film?

Getting an action figure with a swastika isn't going to turn a kid into a Nazi. The environment he grows up in and his parents will decide that... We all know swastikas in connection with World War II aren't cute but do we have to white-wash everything for the sake of kids??????

Again, I'm glad the nazis are actually in this film, but I understand why they want to feature "Hydra," SS style. For one thing, Hydra is a Marvel property. Brandable, expandable, living on in the Marvel Universe well past WWII and the Nazi party. And concerning the toys and kids - do you have kids? It really does make life a bit simpler for parents to not have the nazi toys around. Not because it will turn their kids into anti-semites, but for legitimate reasons. I know I used to latch on to certain action figures as a kid. I was also allowed to bring one figure with me when we'd go out in public, or travel on a plane, etc. Sometimes it was Egon, or Venkman, or He-Man or Optimus. But sometimes it was Skeletor, or Megatron. In the context of a line of toys, I wouldn't object to nazi toys for my kid's Cap toy to fight. But I don't like the idea of my kid having a Hitler doll by itself; it's not just the image it presents to other people. It'd make me uncomfortable. It's really hard to fault Marvel for this.

We're getting a Captain America movie (and Thor, and Batman, and Spider-Man, etc etc ect). A lot of these are pretty solid. Downplaying - but including - the swastika is really minor here. This isn't real "history." It's not a documentary. The nazis will be shown and referred to, so it's not even erasing them from WWII. Marvel's just featuring their proprietary baddies.

 

[Westies14]

haha well said, JD! "Great minds..."

 

[Jet Beetle]

Not since the early days of comics are Superheroes ever allowed to confront true bad guys. On 9/11 there could have been a Superman issue with the man of steel charging an terrorist camp, but no. Ironically most of these heroes were created to fictionally wipe out Hitler and Stalin, but in todays world of business first where everyone's a future customer - true life has been washed clean from these mags and nothing truly topical ever raises its head. Dont forget - This movie is being called "First Avenger" in more than one oversea market - dropping the possibly offensive "America" from it's title - and you ask for a shred of realism when they are willing to hide anything to get a few dollars more.

 

[Westies14]

The name change is both offensive as an American, and just plain stupid overall. Swapping the cover doesn't change the content of the book. Actually, it's pretty offensive to people who hate America, too - do they really think anyone's gonna be fooled by that name shift?

 

[nick daring]

The name change is both offensive as an American, and just plain stupid overall. Swapping the cover doesn't change the content of the book. Actually, it's pretty offensive to people who hate America, too - do they really think anyone's gonna be fooled by that name shift?

Marketing works. People are INDEED easily swayed by pretty book covers. The contents are often inconsequential. Nothing new there and silly to argue otherwise.

When millions of dollars are at stake businesses will do anything to make that investment pay off.

Nick

 

[Jet Beetle]

When millions of dollars are at stake businesses will do anything to make that investment pay off.

Nick

Make no mistake - this move has nothing to do with paying off investments - the intake from Americans will take care of that opening weekend - this has to do with greed, plain and simple.

 

[Westies14]

Marketing works. People are INDEED easily swayed by pretty book covers. The contents are often inconsequential. Nothing new there and silly to argue otherwise.

When millions of dollars are at stake businesses will do anything to make that investment pay off.

Nick

Oh I know marketing works and much can be done to make a product look better than it is - Kurt (chewbaccadoll) and I work for a marketing agency - but I can't see people not recognizing the "America" that's all over this character just because they take his name out of the title.

 

[micdavis]

"Calm down kid, it's only a movie." --Ham Salad, Hardware Wars.

Don't like it, don't go.

Vote with your dollars.

How much more Captain America can you get than that?

 

[MooCriket]

^Cant argue that logic.

I'll just say again though for the hell of it...this is the way Red Skull should be portrayed on the screen. That is all you gnarly gnarlington's.

 

[nick daring]

I like my history to be told with ACCURACY and FACT.

I agree.

Captain America and the Red Skull aren't real. They should really fix those inaccuracies first.



Nick

 

[MooCriket]

^Oh, ha ha. I'm sure he meant the history of the characters, which I 100% agree with. I guess some people just don't get it. Maybe someday a character or characters you do care about will have their history altered to be for p.c. Then maybe you will feel differently.

 

[rodneyfaile]

The facts and stories surrounding most comic superheores has changed many times. Watch and see, one of them will probably "come out of the closet" soon.

The pics of Red Skull look awesome. Im not gonna let an emblem keep me from enjoying the movie.