The Walking Dead Season 3

[Qui-Gonzalez]

In Woodbury maybe where they more proper medical facilities, a doctor, and, presumably, medicine but not Rick's prison. Even if they managed to somehow to keep Oscar from bleeding out from Woodbuy to the prison I don't think that Herschal knows anything about treating gunshot wounds, at least not much, he may know some as a country vet but I don't think that treating gun shot animals was a common occurrence. Then there's the matter of avoiding infection, something they managed to miraculously avoid with Hershal but I don't know that they'd be that lucky twice.

Thrice...because Hershel is the one who patched up Carl, so the wound COULD have been treated, but you are right about the bleeding out.

 

[Riceball]

Isn't that the same knife used in NuBSG?

Yup, it is, same knife worn by the Marines on the Galactica. It's billed as the next generation KBar, sort of a (US) Marines KBar for the 21st century kind of thing. I don't know much about this knife but KaBar does have a pretty decent reputation and probably well worth the money. If you don't want to spend the money there are replicas of this knife out there that sell for around $15, I have one and it's not bad for light work but I wouldn't count on it in a serious survival scenario (I suspect it has rat tail tang) but it's better than nothing and a great price if all you want it for is a prop. Here's one place carrying them: Ka-Bar Knife You might be able to find them for even less on eBay.

 

[Sir Angus]

Just because Michonne knows how to use a sword doesn't mean that she knows to fight, we don't know enough about her and her background to really say that she should have been able to handle herself better against the Governor. Unless she's MMA trained or has taken jiu jitsu she's going to have a hard time on the ground, especially against someone who's both stronger and heavier than her and sword training and surviving a zombie apocalypse isn't going to help all that much.

Actually, if she was trained with a katana, then she should've definately been trained in h2h combat. Rarely in asian MA does someone get training with a weapon without being proficient in h2h. Michonne displays the earmarks of real swordmanship training (particularly with the katana). It follows that her character should also be a strong fighter. Also, long before MMA, most martial arts around the world incorporated the key concepts of using your oponents strength and size against them.

Agreed, it look like it was long enough to do more than just take out an eye although you do have take into consideration the overall size of the shard and whether or not it's narrow enough to go very far into the eye socket. Then there's the matter of the bone at the back of the eye socket, even if the glass was long and narrow enough to penetrate all the way into the socket it would have stopped at the bone in the back. But then again, as soft as they make skulls out to be in this show it's entirely possibly for the shard to penetrate the bone in the back of the eye socket and get into the brain.

A sharp shard of aquarium glass thrust into the eye (the way she did) should've caused a lot more damage. Life threatening damage in this environment, and at the very least after it was removed the Gov would be incapacitated. There would've been a lot of blood loss and trauma. They would need to remove the eye, suture the muscles and suture the lids closed. The Gov would have to be under general for all that ... Or he's the toughest SOB alive and after a few swigs of whiskey they just carterized the socket. :lol

In Woodbury maybe where they more proper medical facilities, a doctor, and, presumably, medicine but not Rick's prison. Even if they managed to somehow to keep Oscar from bleeding out from Woodbuy to the prison I don't think that Herschal knows anything about treating gunshot wounds, at least not much, he may know some as a country vet but I don't think that treating gun shot animals was a common occurrence. Then there's the matter of avoiding infection, something they managed to miraculously avoid with Hershal but I don't know that they'd be that lucky twice.

Carl is alive because Hershel has the medical knowledge to treat gun wounds. Also, they purposely mention a few times in S2 and after the amputation about needing antibiotics & pain killers.

But had Maggie not shot Oscar in the head, you right that he may not have made it back to the car. Still would've been nice if he survived.

 

[Kerr Avon]

The gun shot on Oscar looked to be in his abdomen upper left, probably spreading around in the lung area. I'd think that'd be probably pretty quickly fatal. I can't believe Maggie would have shot the guy in the head if he wasn't already dead too. Face it folks, they killed Oscar off because he was spare meat after the arrival of Tyreese. There's no point to try to justify them getting him somehow to safety with a hole in him like that.

 

[Riceball]

Actually, if she was trained with a katana, then she should've definitely been trained in h2h combat. Rarely in asian MA does someone get training with a weapon without being proficient in h2h. Michonne displays the earmarks of real swordmanship training (particularly with the katana). It follows that her character should also be a strong fighter. Also, long before MMA, most martial arts around the world incorporated the key concepts of using your opponents strength and size against them.

That's not necessarily true, I know that you can learn how to use a katana without any other other MA training, there's swordsmanship classes, quick draw, as well as just plain old kendo and I'm not sure that the former two teach any or many open hand techniques and kendo certainly wouldn't. Even still, learning how to use your opponent's size and weight against them tends to be relegated to specific arts, not all teach that and fewer still teach ground combat. Most Asian martial arts focus on fighting on standing up and, generally speaking, are at a sever disadvantage on the ground against a judoka or someone trained in jiu jitsu. Trust me when I tell you that's a whole different game when you're on the ground wrestling with an opponent; I've been taking taekwondo for going on 3 years now and I've done a little jiu jitsu during that time and it's pretty tough and even tougher when you're going against someone bigger and stronger and knows what they're doing.

The other thing to consider is that most martial arts are not really for self defense and have evolved into more of a sport, this is especially true for any form of competitive martial art. You can be a high level black belt in a martial art but that doesn't necessarily mean that you're a trained killer. There's certain things that you do in competition and practice to keep from hurting your opponents but might run contradictory to what you'd do in a real no holds barred fight. This doesn't mean that you wouldn't be effective, just that it doesn't automatically make you an unarmed killing machine. Now something like krav maga or Marine Corps MCMAPS are something differently entirely and are not designed as sport and would be much more effective on the street or in a knock down, drag out fight with a mad Governor.

 

[Sir Angus]

The gun shot on Oscar looked to be in his abdomen upper left, probably spreading around in the lung area. I'd think that'd be probably pretty quickly fatal. I can't believe Maggie would have shot the guy in the head if he wasn't already dead too. Face it folks, they killed Oscar off because he was spare meat after the arrival of Tyreese. There's no point to try to justify them getting him somehow to safety with a hole in him like that.

I try not to be as cynnical about it, but it's getting pretty annoying.

 

[Feezle-Nuts]

AFAIK, none of the Gerber's on the show are custom. I really don't think the Bowie is a Gerber. Odd that we haven't seen that knife yet (unless I missed it). It was in several promo shots and the Gov was not missing an eye.

 

[allosaur176]

The sword Michonne carries belonged to her boyfriend before the apocalypse hit, atleast that's how I believe it was in the comic world, so I don't think she was trained, hence not properly holding the sword in her scenes..

 

[Feezle-Nuts]

It was her neighbors.

 

[Clutch]

If I was Michonne, I would have said, "You want your daughter? You can have her." Then I would have shoved her in his direction to create a distraction in order to cut him down.

 

[Sir Angus]

That's not necessarily true, I know that you can learn how to use a katana without any other other MA training, there's swordsmanship classes, quick draw, as well as just plain old kendo and I'm not sure that the former two teach any or many open hand techniques and kendo certainly wouldn't. Even still, learning how to use your opponent's size and weight against them tends to be relegated to specific arts, not all teach that and fewer still teach ground combat. Most Asian martial arts focus on fighting on standing up and, generally speaking, are at a sever disadvantage on the ground against a judoka or someone trained in jiu jitsu. Trust me when I tell you that's a whole different game when you're on the ground wrestling with an opponent; I've been taking taekwondo for going on 3 years now and I've done a little jiu jitsu during that time and it's pretty tough and even tougher when you're going against someone bigger and stronger and knows what they're doing.

The other thing to consider is that most martial arts are not really for self defense and have evolved into more of a sport, this is especially true for any form of competitive martial art. You can be a high level black belt in a martial art but that doesn't necessarily mean that you're a trained killer. There's certain things that you do in competition and practice to keep from hurting your opponents but might run contradictory to what you'd do in a real no holds barred fight. This doesn't mean that you wouldn't be effective, just that it doesn't automatically make you an unarmed killing machine. Now something like krav maga or Marine Corps MCMAPS are something differently entirely and are not designed as sport and would be much more effective on the street or in a knock down, drag out fight with a mad Governor.

This is not intended to brag or inflate my own ego, accepting that this is mainly a prop forum and we are discussing a fictional scenerio, but a quick CV seems to be warranted.

Here's a quick rundown on my realworld expertise, 10+ yrs Army & USAF (special training in CBRNE, HAZMAT, HAZWOPR, Incident Command, EOD, beddown & SERE), 15+ yrs western martial arts specifically melee weapons from 1066-1605AD, 20+ yrs asian martial arts (TKD, Judo, Aikido, Karate, JKD & kickboxing) with 3 blackbelts and instructor certifications, 18+ yrs various asian weapons (including the katana & wakizashi).

With that in mind and sincerely not trying to instigate anything, there's not much in your previous statement I can agree with.

I've never heard of "quickdraw" so I can't comment, but I believe I said classical (or maybe traditional) swordmanship ... If not then I intended to but failed to proof read. So any modern interpretations of traditional sword training programs, IMO, don't do the student service by negating h2h skills. Kendo no more teaches how to use a real sword than Mario kart teaches how to legally drive. Kendo use shinais/bokkens and a very formalized "fight" much like modern fencing. Both would be better than nothing in TWD, but poor substitutes for real training.

The Gov (as far as we know) has no formal or otherwise training. He's just a average middle class American that can be charming. Michonne is portrayed as a trained & proficient swordsman and it can be easily inferred that she has had other combat training from her actions so far. They predominantly fought standing up (advantage Michonne). It was only after he shoved her head into the aquarium that it went to the ground, and even then it only lasted another few seconds before she shoved the glass in his eye. The several minutes prior to the aquarium she fought very poorly. I was disappointed because that's the only thing I expected her character to do well.

 

[Astrokid248]

The sword Michonne carries belonged to her boyfriend before the apocalypse hit, atleast that's how I believe it was in the comic world, so I don't think she was trained, hence not properly holding the sword in her scenes..

In the comic she took it from her next door neighbor, who was an otaku punk obsessed with killing cats. I prefer to think that this Michonne owned the katana and was a bit of a geek herself, partially cos there's a lot of nerdy colored folk in Atlanta of late, partially cos I don't like the implication that teens who own katanas kill cats for fun. I own several swords and I love my cat with all my heart. **** you Robert Kirkman.

 

[Sir Angus]

If I was Michonne, I would have said, "You want your daughter? You can have her." Then I would have shoved her in his direction to create a distraction in order to cut him down.

That would've required Michonne to speak aloud. We can't have any of that nonsense. :lol

 

[Kerr Avon]

I've never heard of "quickdraw" so I can't comment, but I believe I said classical (or maybe traditional) swordmanship ... If not then I intended to but failed to proof read. So any modern interpretations of traditional sword training programs, IMO, don't do the student service by negating h2h skills. Kendo no more teaches how to use a real sword than Mario kart teaches how to legally drive. Kendo use shinais/bokkens and a very formalized "fight" much like modern fencing. Both would be better than nothing in TWD, but poor substitutes for real training.

Probably Iaido, which teaches to draw and strike in one movement. Iaido - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Kerr Avon]

That would've required Michonne to speak aloud. We can't have any of that nonsense. :lol

HHHhhhhhHHhhHHhhhiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiisssssssssss... :behave

 

[Sir Angus]

Probably Iaido, which teaches to draw and strike in one movement. Iaido - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Maybe ... Iaido basically takes the age old martial theory of "conservation of force" to the extreme. I was taught aspects of Iaido when I learned the katana, but they aren't inherently just Iaido concepts.

 

[Riceball]

AFAIK, none of the Gerber's on the show are custom. I really don't think the Bowie is a Gerber. Odd that we haven't seen that knife yet (unless I missed it). It was in several promo shots and the Gov was not missing an eye.

I agree, that massive bowie is probably not a Gerber, it just doesn't look like a Gerber to me, I don't think that Gerber makes giant bowies but I could be wrong.

 

[crabra comander]

The several minutes prior to the aquarium she fought very poorly. I was disappointed because that's the only thing I expected her character to do well.

I don't expect any female who is of a smaller stature than her opponent to hold her own that well. Especially when the Gov has probably been eating good food for a while now and Michonne has been roughing it with Andrea.

 

[Sir Angus]

I don't expect any female who is of a smaller stature than her opponent to hold her own that well. Especially when the Gov has probably been eating good food for a while now and Michonne has been roughing it with Andrea.

I wouldn't expect any of the other women on the show to do well, however Michonne is portrayed as a warrior. She's muscular and athletic (at least to a point). Granted I've not read the comics and know nothing of her backstory, but her on-screen time so far tells me she should've fought better. Particularly against the Gov; maybe not Merle or another equally capable fighter.

 

[Riceball]

Maybe ... Iaido basically takes the age old martial theory of "conservation of force" to the extreme. I was taught aspects of Iaido when I learned the katana, but they aren't inherently just Iaido concepts.

That's what I meant by quick draw, just couldn't think of the name at the time. Anyhow, while I do respect your experience and while mine don't compare to yours I do know that here in LA you can take kenjutsu and Iaido by themselves completely separate from any other form of martial art. I don't know what's taught in these classes besides sword techniques but I don't think they're going to be spending a whole lot of time on punching, kicking, holds, and throws.

As for kendo, I realize that it's very formalized and basically the Japanese equivalent of fencing but I'd argue that it's not completely useless in a zombie apocalypse. You still learn basic moves in kendo, moves that should transfer from a shinai or boken to a real blade, moves that should be more than adequate against an opponent that's not wielding another blade against you or really fighting back for that matter. The only thing would be, just like someone trained in real sword fighting techniques or with guns, learning to aim for the head as much as possible.