Rian Johnson, 100 percent. He made something with TLJ that will stand the test of time, and I would have loved to see where he would have taken the third film.
Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Post-release)
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Rian Johnson, 100 percent. He made something with TLJ that will stand the test of time, and I would have loved to see where he would have taken the third film.
robn1
Master Member
JJ is a hackfraud who couldn't write a meaningful grocery list. The only emotions I've experienced while watching his films are anger, confusion and frustration. His mystery box is always empty.
John McTiernan.
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Jaitea
Master Member
I would say 100% against Rian Johnston, I think TLJ is purely the worst Star Wars film
Because RJ's TLJ divides the audience, he would definitely not have been the right person to do Episode 9,....whether we like it or not, we have what we have,...the ST has concluded & Disney/LFL have had a rocky road getting there
A lesson has been learned (hopefully) & future Star Wars will have to have a planned route
J
sbaxter
Sr Member
Voice-only roles are typically paid much less than on-camera roles. It is possible they paid Liam Neeson, James Earl Jones, or Samuel L. Jackson more than some of the others, but it wouldn't really surprise me if Ashley Eckstein or Freddie Prinze Jr. -- not to mention the other actors from Clone Wars and Rebels who voiced Jedi, such as Olivia d'Abo (Luminara Unduli), Jennifer Hale (Aayla Secura) and Angelique Perrin (Adi Gallia) only got union scale. That also wouldn't surprise me with even Ewan McGregor, who has a deal with the studio for his upcoming Disney+ series and may alrady have a formal or informal agreement to provide his voice (which could also be true for any of the other actors mentioned, as they are all voicing characters they have previously played). After all, if he had decided to hold out for more money, James Arnold Taylor could have voiced Obi-Wan and most people wouldn't have noticed a difference -- and of those that did notice, probably most wouldn't have minded it. After all, Taylor has played Obi-Wan far more than Alec Guiness and Ewan McGregor combined.
Based on standard union rates for voice acting in a feature film, it is possible that any or all of the actors mentioned received as little as about $900 for they work they performed. Getting any of them on camera would entail a significantly larger payday.
I'm sure there was at least one earlier, longer cut of the film; if not, that would quite atypical for a movie. For what it's worth, my brother and I had the perception after seeing the film that there was certainly some additional material shot that would have further illuminated some things. It didn't really bother us. I do hope some of the deleted material will show up on the Blu-ray or Disney+ versions as bonus features.
SSB
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Joek3rr
Master Member
As much as I love TLJ, I don't think his style is good for the ending chapter. But then again, I love TLJ, so I'm probably wrong he would have been the best choice.
modelcitizen
Sr Member
Orson Welles....
Mr Webber
Master Member
Three weeks and a reddit leak into the run and now we are getting some that either loved TRoS or liked it very much now making very valid points as to why it was a terrible movie by focusing on Jar Jar leaves me in no doubt that was always going to be the case after the absolute mess and impossible position RIAN JOHNSON left the last film in. Everyone including Disney know why Abram`s was only supposed to do the first movie. I think time will reveal that Colin Trevorrow wasn`t fired but actually walked away after learning what he was supposed to work with. Smart move.
Kylo Ren the Supreme leader, the Resistance decimated, Rey is a nobody. Yeah, what an impossible mess 
. Any writer worth his salt could go in a million directions with that. Instead what we got was a lazy story that followed the path of least resistance.
. Any writer worth his salt could go in a million directions with that. Instead what we got was a lazy story that followed the path of least resistance.
Joek3rr
Master Member
Just me throwing some ideas out.
I don't think what Palpatine and Anakin are talking about is your run of the mill Force healing. Or Palpatine is lying to Anakin.
But also, Rey and Ben's ability seem to be because they are a dyad in the Force.
vader45
Sr Member
I highly disagree on that statement. It throws out everything JJ has set up and Rian admitted that. It's very disjointed from the other 2 because of that.
No one will care about the war profitiering animal abusing rich A holes sub plot years from now and it's a huge chunk of the film. Current political issues is not what Star Wars is. If you think that will stand the test of time I feel sorry for you.
HMSwolfe
Master Member
I think, had Rian Johnson done a trilogy separate from the ST and the OT instead of TLJ, no one would be hating on him. Most of his other films have been moderately well received, and his ideas on disrupting what makes a Star Wars story, and about challenging our idea of a hero, and of lineage/the Force, would have gone over much better if they a: weren’t connected to the OT characters, and b: the film wasn’t the middle of a trilogy. I like TLJ, but it doesn’t work as the middle of three movies. And obviously it’s not a perfect film, because it has Laura Dern (in any capacity) and the Canto Bight stuff is a total sideplot, although if the rumors about Disney being against Finn from the beginning because he wouldn’t sell well in China are true, it might have been a corporate mandate to separate him from the rest of the characters so that the Chinese edit could drastically reduce his presence.
Except JJ didnt set anything up, as much as I enjoyed TFA what he gave you was a handful of mysteries to be left up to others to answer. If he didnt like where Rian took it he should have written and directed TLJ himself. And regardless of how anyone feels about Canto Bight, it was 11 minutes out of a 2 1/2 hour film, hardly a "huge chunk". Anyways, Im not continuing with the same back and forth arguments that have been made ad nauseum for over 2 years now. No ones changing their mind. You may feel sorry for me for enjoying the flick, but if you cant enjoy or recognize the merits of a beautifully shot, well acted and critically acclaimed film such as The Last Jedi then I feel sorry for you.
Paul Andrew
Master Member
I mean, Palps is a lying liar. I don't think this beef holds much water. Of course Palps was going to tell Anakin he was the only path to learning what he wanted to learn.
Honestly, the possibilities felt wide open after TLJ. They could have done ANYTHING and it would have been workable. Instead the boat was piloted back into very familiar waters. I maintain that I like the film, and will continue to enjoy it, but I can't help but wonder what would have happened had we gotten a filmmaker with a bit more adventurous take. This trilogy could have gone places.
Very much looking forward to RJ's vision when it's untethered from the Skywalker saga. Let's get weird.
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harrisonp
Sr Member
Kylo Ren the Supreme leader, the Resistance decimated, Rey is a nobody. Yeah, what an impossible mess
Thank you! Seriously I don’t get how so many people are scratching their heads over this.
I think the more important question is who should've written not just Ep9, but the whole trilogy. The fact that two separate directors (possibly three with Trevorrow) were given such creative freedom over what is supposed to be a cohesive three movie story is just mind-boggling to me. Abrams and Johnson had such wildly different approaches.
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vader45
Sr Member
Rey was built up to be this great character but was tossed aside by Rian Johnson. All she did was cry to Luke and lift some rocks. And the film is just 2.5 hours of the First Order chasing the Resistance with a political sub plot.
It's ok to enjoy the film. I'm glad you do but you're severely overrating the film, making it something it's not. The audience score is very low so it's far from a timeless film. More then half hates the film.
Enjoy the film but don't make it bloated.
HeartBlade
Sr Member
Kylo Ren the Supreme leader, the Resistance decimated, Rey is a nobody. Yeah, what an impossible mess
It was an impossible mess based on the previously established characters and threads left in the movie.
Kylo Ren went from mixed (had too much light in him) to be the ultimate big bad (no hints of Palpatine or another big bad). However, he has lost twice to Rey who was only going to get stronger reading the ancient texts, he wasn’t a serious threat and Rey isn’t losing in the last movie.
Rey went from mysterious and powerful to a nobody. Fine but then we need an explanation for why she was so powerful in the force in RJs version. We know force proficiency is related to . Does this mean Rey was just unnaturally talented? Is she the true one?
finally, the Resistance being near destroyed is a big deal because the government refused to send aid. That was the big issue. Not only was the meager force decimated by the first order, it is going to be difficult for the resistance to rebuild unless there is a decent time skip. They have no Luke, no Han, no support from the government.
I’m not saying they couldn’t make an interesting movie from this (honestly should have just extended to ep X and make Rey lose a fight to really subvert expectations) but the tone was very different from TFA.
That’s not fair for JJ.
JJ was never meant to direct the second or third trilogy. He was brought back because he was the safe choice and TFA’s performance.
like it or not, JJ set up several themes as well as mystery boxes to reel the audience in (which he is excellent at).
-Kylo is not evil bad guy #2 but more conflicted. This is a first for a Sith who were more black and white evil.
-Finn is the first stormtrooper to defect. Why is a big deal.
-Why is Rey so powerful in the force despite being a beginner?
-Why did Luke abandon his friends and a war to go to this unknown planet? What did he have or was looking for that the First Order wanted?
just because RJ fumbled the ball doesn’t mean JJ made a bad pass.
ghostryder
Legendary Member
vader45
Sr Member
ROS felt like the follow up people were waiting for to TFA, while TLJ was just a time waster.
TFA introduced this mysterious girl who discovers her force powers, An order that rose from the ashes of the Empire, first time we see a stormtrooper with a face and emotion, we get glimpses of a failed Jedi academy and Luke mysteriously disapearing. Kylo Ren was the leader to the Knights of Ren. Who are they and where did they come from?
A Lot could have been followed up to that.
Instead we get a huge build up about this mysterious girl and we are revealed with NOTHING and she does nothing in the film. I was so disappointed with the cave scene the first time I saw it. Huge build up just to see her own reflection? The defunct stormtrooper who helped destroy Starkiller base decides to run from the cause? Luke disappears because he doesn't like what is happening? It's like he was having one long temper tantrum because his academy didn't go as planned. Let's go hide and cry about it. While we are at it lets kill the new baddy forcing JJ to resurrect a dead one. All while the First order is chasing the Resistance and the first order can't make a clear shot at the Resistance ship point blank in front of them. AND the knights of Ren are ignored. The movie missed so much potential story telling. It's a very basic soft terrible remake of ESB. Good guys are on the run while the hero goes offworld to train.
ROS at least made an attempt, while not well received by everyone, at explaining her past and has showed with her training she isn't all powerfully perfect. And it actually gave Kylo Ren character growth unlike TLJ. It has pacing issues in the middle and It was hard to follow up on a movie that ignored it's predicessor but at least this one attempted to follow TFA with what JJ was given. I loved the whole final order fleet. It built upon the who First order idea. We had a movie that built apun the themes and characters more so then what Johnson did.
TFA introduced this mysterious girl who discovers her force powers, An order that rose from the ashes of the Empire, first time we see a stormtrooper with a face and emotion, we get glimpses of a failed Jedi academy and Luke mysteriously disapearing. Kylo Ren was the leader to the Knights of Ren. Who are they and where did they come from?
A Lot could have been followed up to that.
Instead we get a huge build up about this mysterious girl and we are revealed with NOTHING and she does nothing in the film. I was so disappointed with the cave scene the first time I saw it. Huge build up just to see her own reflection? The defunct stormtrooper who helped destroy Starkiller base decides to run from the cause? Luke disappears because he doesn't like what is happening? It's like he was having one long temper tantrum because his academy didn't go as planned. Let's go hide and cry about it. While we are at it lets kill the new baddy forcing JJ to resurrect a dead one. All while the First order is chasing the Resistance and the first order can't make a clear shot at the Resistance ship point blank in front of them. AND the knights of Ren are ignored. The movie missed so much potential story telling. It's a very basic soft terrible remake of ESB. Good guys are on the run while the hero goes offworld to train.
ROS at least made an attempt, while not well received by everyone, at explaining her past and has showed with her training she isn't all powerfully perfect. And it actually gave Kylo Ren character growth unlike TLJ. It has pacing issues in the middle and It was hard to follow up on a movie that ignored it's predicessor but at least this one attempted to follow TFA with what JJ was given. I loved the whole final order fleet. It built upon the who First order idea. We had a movie that built apun the themes and characters more so then what Johnson did.
Joek3rr
Master Member
Um Ben only lost once to Rey......................
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