Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Post-release)

[Mr Webber]

Yeah, like the same plot leaks from the same sub forum that were actually more detailed and better explained than they were in the movie that turned out to be 100% correct, the very same plot leaks that came out 4 months ago and were updated as quick as they were changing stuff, funny that. LOL

 

[HeartBlade]

@Mr Weber not sure if that quote is true but if it is, that really sucks for JJ. I don’t think the JJ cut would be better necessarily but options like make the movie longer or split into 2 so have more time for actual character development was sorely needed in this ST.

just decided to watch “Cobra Kai” again and ******** is that show amazing. I’m not even a karate kid fan but I love the show and it made me want to watch the original movies and learn more about Daniel and Mr Miyagi (you do basically know the story of Karate Kid through cultural osmosis).

An amazing Star Wars ST would not only have made old fans love Star Wars more but also get the newer younger fans want to watch the PT and OT to better understand the previous characters. I don’t really see this happening.

also, Disney’s assumption on DC is moronic. Movies are judged by their quality, not who directed the movie. If Michael Bay made an amazing Superman or Batman movie that fans are raving as a must see, I'm going to watch the movie, no matter Bay’s previous work. I hope JJ kills it in DC.

 

[HeartBlade]

What a steaming pant load of a story. Sounds as believable as the "leak" that said there was a George Lucas cut of the film.

I do agree we can’t just trust this leak as true but the “leaked” script gave a lot of context and details that answered critical missing parts in the actual movie.

Jannah being Lando’s lost daughter explains why he stayed and even critics mentioned that there seemed to be hints of this being the case, except that there was no reveal making it feel like a dropped plot point.

 

[Mr Webber]

@Mr Weber not sure if that quote is true but if it is, that really sucks for JJ. I don’t think the JJ cut would be better necessarily but options like make the movie longer or split into 2 so have more time for actual character development was sorely needed in this ST.

just decided to watch “Cobra Kai” again and ******** is that show amazing. I’m not even a karate kid fan but I love the show and it made me want to watch the original movies and learn more about Daniel and Mr Miyagi (you do basically know the story of Karate Kid through cultural osmosis).

An amazing Star Wars ST would not only have made old fans love Star Wars more but also get the newer younger fans want to watch the PT and OT to better understand the previous characters. I don’t really see this happening.

also, Disney’s assumption on DC is moronic. Movies are judged by their quality, not who directed the movie. If Michael Bay made an amazing Superman or Batman movie that fans are raving as a must see, I'm going to watch the movie, no matter Bay’s previous work. I hope JJ kills it in DC.

Yes, Abrams was put into a no win situation here not just by Johnson but possibly the very company that hired him to do the job. When you look at the disjointed mess the movie actually is then this "leak" actually makes a lot of sense. I dont see Disney being moronic here, just Disney. A strong and vibrant DC is not something they would want at all and the back rooms of Hollywood are basically a nest of vipers. Of course I didnt expect anyone who gobbles the Disney ***** sandwiches down with glee to give this one iota of credit but considering recent track results I`m not totally discounting it. Like in sport, youre only as good as your last leak. In regards to the Lucas Cut leak, to bad he wasnt there on opening night to answer that inevitable question.

 

[sztriki]

In regards to the Lucas Cut leak, to bad he wasnt there on opening night to answer that inevitable question.

If there's a thing that I don't want in Star Wars anymore it's Lucas in the editing room.
That narrative does explain a lot of things. This movie was sorely missing some proper time. I placed about 80% of the blame for most things wrong in this film on TLJ not setting anything up for the closure but the more I think about it that number keeps going down. Scenes like the they fly now, the whole hyperspace skipping, the quicksand and the whole dragging 3PO from world to world was just fake drama where the runtime could have been used for better purposes.
I mean what would have been lost if they just WALKED down to that cave in 20 seconds instead of being trapped in the quicksand, create some fake drama then get there anyway? Or if 3PO could have straight away just translated the Mordor language? He got his memories back so that went nowhere eventually apart from some droid antics.

 

[Joek3rr]

As you already know, I have zero knowledge of any of that ancillary rubbish you so desperately cling to. Its nothing but fan fiction to me. If it wasn't in the first 6 movies, it didn't happen.

I love The Mandalorian and only accept the healing stuff because it was very obvious to anyone who doesn't gulp down the Kool Aid that it was only included as a directive from Darth Kennedy to help soften its ridiculous inclusion in TRoS. I'm fairly confident it will be explained later in the series because the people behind it seem to have integrity.

I'm far more interested in what you think about the rest of what I posted as you are a self confessed Reylo.

Gotcha But I do have to ask. What's wrong with them adding new things with the Force? With the exception of ATOC and ROTS. All the other films added something new about the Force or Force ghosts.

From a self confessed Reylo, I think they've got issues. And need to take down a notch. They are no better then the people that went after Ahmed Best, or Kelly Marie Tran.

 

[Joek3rr]

Very interesting reddit post that just came out. If true it exposes Disney/Lucasfilm and a certain executive as nothing but hypocrites, no shock here.
Of course its reddit but with the track record of this particular sub forum being pretty much 100% on point for a long time now, I have no reason to doubt it. It is without any doubt whatsoever that there are disgruntled Lucasfilm employee`s that are spilling the beans and have been spilling them for months.

Click on the post to go directly to the sub forum, some interesting opinions.

https://www.reddit.com/r/saltierthancrait/comments/eisnd8

Saltierthancrait.........I got banned there in under 4 hours. My crime? Sharing the opposite view.(I think they never gave me a reason, when I asked)

 

[Joek3rr]

The planet is healing? Sounds more like a case of, “We already shot this scene, and then the script changed, and now we have to include more references to things that people recognize. How can we do that?” “Oh, just add it into the Visual Dictionary and say it’s the moon of Alderaan or Mustafar or something. They’ll eat that stuff up.”

Actually the story of Mustafar is detailed in the Vader Immortal series. Mustafar wasn't always covered in volcanoes and lava.

 

[Apollo]

To busy enjoying his money!

I just read that George Lucas didn’t go to the premiere. Anybody know why? Was it deliberate or was he just unable to go?

 

[Mr Webber]

Gotcha But I do have to ask. What's wrong with them adding new things with the Force? With the exception of ATOC and ROTS. All the other films added something new about the Force or Force ghosts.

From a self confessed Reylo, I think they've got issues. And need to take down a notch. They are no better then the people that went after Ahmed Best, or Kelly Marie Tran.

Thats very simple, all the stuff they have added in this Disney trilogy has had tremendous ripple effects on the first six movies. Why didnt Obi Wan heal Qiu Gon? Why didnt Anakin heal his mother or Padme? Why didnt Luke heal Anakin? Why didnt Yoda and Ben reign down lightning destruction? etc etc etc. They were only added to make Rey even more powerful or to feed this reylo bulldust and dont bring up any fan fiction unknown by 98% of people who follow Star Wars movies either.

Heres the thing about Ahmed Best, he said quite unequivocally that the MEDIA were responsible for the issues he went through and it has never been reported that he received ANY death threats. KMT has never come out and actually explained why she left Instagram and I have never seen any screen grabs showing anything to indicate why. The fact you used these two overplayed, unsubstantiated examples to try and play off the reality before your eyes is frankly pathetic.

 

[Mr Webber]

To busy enjoying his money!

I saw a good point on a live stream the other day, Lucas got paid mainly in Disney shares and since that time the share price has doubled.

 

[Solo4114]

If there's a thing that I don't want in Star Wars anymore it's Lucas in the editing room.

Marcia Lucas, on the other hand...

That narrative does explain a lot of things. This movie was sorely missing some proper time. I placed about 80% of the blame for most things wrong in this film on TLJ not setting anything up for the closure but the more I think about it that number keeps going down. Scenes like the they fly now, the whole hyperspace skipping, the quicksand and the whole dragging 3PO from world to world was just fake drama where the runtime could have been used for better purposes.
I mean what would have been lost if they just WALKED down to that cave in 20 seconds instead of being trapped in the quicksand, create some fake drama then get there anyway? Or if 3PO could have straight away just translated the Mordor language? He got his memories back so that went nowhere eventually apart from some droid antics.

Yeah, that stuff didn't really bother me in the moment, but it does sort of highlight the meaningless nature of a lot of the drama in these films. That's JJ, though. You can see that same sort of thing in a lot of his other films including outside of Star Wars. It's just part of the roller coaster ride.

You raise a point I've brought up about TLJ, though. The end of TLJ practically begs for the franchise to not end with Ep. IX. The way I saw it, TLJ set up an Ep. IX that would end with the Resistance beginning to reconstitute itself, and start to present a real challenge to the First Order, with tension within the First Order beginning to wear on it. You could then have another three films to handle the eventual total defeat of the First Order, as well as Ben's redemption arc, Rey rebuilding the Jedi, etc.

Instead, for whatever reason, we get an end to the saga that ties it all up with a bow (kinda sorta mostly). The First Order is defeated utterly. The Emperor is destroyed. The Sith are defeated again, etc., etc.

My hope is that we do get a few new films with the ST cast because I actually really like the cast and these characters, but I'd like to see them more fleshed out and given more room to develop. I'd also like it if they either had a single creative team running the story aspects of the next series of films, or even a single director/writer. The approach taken with the ST was, in my opinion, a mistake. The ultimate films it produced are entertaining, but it could've been handled a lot better.

 

[HMSwolfe]

Very interesting reddit post that just came out. If true it exposes Disney/Lucasfilm and a certain executive as nothing but hypocrites, no shock here.
Of course its reddit but with the track record of this particular sub forum being pretty much 100% on point for a long time now, I have no reason to doubt it. It is without any doubt whatsoever that there are disgruntled Lucasfilm employee`s that are spilling the beans and have been spilling them for months.

Click on the post to go directly to the sub forum, some interesting opinions.

https://www.reddit.com/r/saltierthancrait/comments/eisnd8

I find most of this to be entirely believable, but the part about maybe trying to “tank” JJ’s reputation by making TROS bad seems pretty unlikely, even as an intended assault to WB. And if this whole post does turn out to be true, my opinion on JJ wouldn’t really change; I would just feel a little bad for him. Ultimately I still don’t particularly respect him as a storyteller—he tries to get away with a lot of unearned stuff. A lot of the decisions that were “cut” in the post still rub me the wrong way, and I wouldn’t have enjoyed the movie in his cut either. A big part of that is due to the comic-booky ridiculous production design and color palette—it looks terrible to me. Just wrong, especially for a Star Wars movie. It looked like a live-action Filoni show, like if Clone Wars or Rebels were translated directly to live-action. But, a few more scenes of Adam Driver would have been nice, and hopefully we’ll at least get those in some form or another later on, like deleted scenes.

 

[The Brahma Bull]

Actually the story of Mustafar is detailed in the Vader Immortal series. Mustafar wasn't always covered in volcanoes and lava.

I think we should really ignore any external lore to review a movie. If it's not in the movies it's not explained.

 

[HMSwolfe]

I think we should really ignore any external lore to review a movie. If it's not in the movies it's not explained.

I think we should ignore external lore always, but to each their own, I guess.

 

[The Brahma Bull]

I personally was surprised how well TLJ was received by critics despite its flaws in mocie making and story telling. They unanimously cheered Rian Johnsons guts for trying to radically change Star Wars and bring something new to the plate, but mostly without adressing craftsmanship flaws. Mind you, I dare to say that most critics are not really fans of lighter entertainment but prefer more intellectually challenging movies. The general aufience in comparison unfortunately does not. BLOCKBUSTERS are easily accessible for a large crowd! Did Woody Allen or Ingmar Bergmann ever make a blockbuster?

I think some were paid and others couldn't afford to do a real review. If you see that you automatically were called a racist/sexist etc for not liking this desaster of a movie.

That's what bugs me. It's not about if it's good. It's about that is feminist, clima neutral and vegan. FFS it's probably the worst movie with a story even more worse than everything Tommy Wiseau could come up with.

 

[Joek3rr]

Thats very simple, all the stuff they have added in this Disney trilogy has had tremendous ripple effects on the first six movies. Why didnt Obi Wan heal Qiu Gon? Why didnt Anakin heal his mother or Padme? Why didnt Luke heal Anakin? Why didnt Yoda and Ben reign down lightning destruction? etc etc etc. They were only added to make Rey even more powerful or to feed this reylo bulldust and dont bring up any fan fiction unknown by 98% of people who follow Star Wars movies either.

Heres the thing about Ahmed Best, he said quite unequivocally that the MEDIA were responsible for the issues he went through and it has never been reported that he received ANY death threats. KMT has never come out and actually explained why she left Instagram and I have never seen any screen grabs showing anything to indicate why. The fact you used these two overplayed, unsubstantiated examples to try and play off the reality before your eyes is frankly pathetic.

Not everyone has the same abilities in the Force. Palpatine uses lightning in ROTJ. But I've never seen people complain that changes everything, and ask why Vader didn't use that in first two films.

Okay, how about Rian Johnson then

Rian Johnson Received Death Threats After Star Wars: The Last Jedi Was Released

The fan backlash over The Last Jedi may have been darker than we realized.

www.cinemablend.com

 

[Bigdaddy]

Not everyone has the same abilities in the Force. Palpatine uses lightning in ROTJ. But I've never seen people complain that changes everything, and ask why Vader didn't use that in first two films.

Okay, how about Rian Johnson then

Rian Johnson Received Death Threats After Star Wars: The Last Jedi Was Released

The fan backlash over The Last Jedi may have been darker than we realized.

www.cinemablend.com

Because:
a) we never see Vader use lightning at all
b) the OT is the establishing story, not a tacked on prequel or sequel.

It's just simple story telling logic, I'm pretty sure you get that.

 

[Mr Webber]

I find most of this to be entirely believable, but the part about maybe trying to “tank” JJ’s reputation by making TROS bad seems pretty unlikely, even as an intended assault to WB.

It doesnt sound to far fetched to me, there is the rumor that Abrams was offered Kennedy`s job and refused and added with the fact that Disney lost out on his future services and that Marvel are entering uncertain territory heading in to the future with the main stars no longer involved and Disney cant afford with their amount of spending to lose any ground to DC.

Not everyone has the same abilities in the Force. Palpatine uses lightning in ROTJ. But I've never seen people complain that changes everything, and ask why Vader didn't use that in first two films.

Okay, how about Rian Johnson then

Rian Johnson Received Death Threats After Star Wars: The Last Jedi Was Released

The fan backlash over The Last Jedi may have been darker than we realized.

www.cinemablend.com

Yes Palpatine uses lightning in ROTJ and in TLJ Yoda uses it in a very similar fashion. Only Palpatine used it in the Lucas movies because it was his signature move, creatively it gave him something to wow over. Again, using the Lucas films in an attempt to explain off Disneys failings doesnt work, ever.

In regards to Johnson, he's proven himself to be a liar and a hypocrite. He lied about deleting 30,000 tweets after the James Gunn situation, they were deleted months before that. And he used his twitter blanket to claim there are too many white dudes making Star Wars and then continues to promote that he is making 3 more movies and then proudly says he wants in on season 2 of The Mandalorian.

 

[Joek3rr]

Because:
a) we never see Vader use lightning at all
b) the OT is the establishing story, not a tacked on prequel or sequel.

It's just simple story telling logic, I'm pretty sure you get that.

But why don't we see him use it? If Palpatine can, why not Vader?

Because right now what I'm getting is. If Rey and Ben can use Force heal, why not Luke or Obi-Wan etc?