Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Post-release)

What did you think of Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker?

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    415
Inquisitor Peregrinus said:
Which is ironic. The Holiday Special is a good concept, poorly executed. Kinda like George did himself with the Prequels. And, in his more honest moments, he recognized that about them. You'd think he'd be a little more forgiving of the HS, in that light...
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Not sure if a weird cartoon side story and having a trippy purple wig lady are good concepts haha
I'd argue the Holy Special had both poor concept and execution.

The PT on the other hand definitely had great ideas going for them.
 
patrickivan said:
It was so odd having Finn seem like he was going to place a more pivotal role after setting him up for big things in TFA, but only have him run around doing nothing in TLJ (because apparently Maz was far too busy doing more important things to help), and then do nothing but run around screaming REY in TROS.

I was positive he was going to be shown force sensitive and go on the similar journey with Rey. It was certainly a waste of his character.

I think there's just become too much Star Wars. It's taken a lot of the imagination out of that universe. Oh well. Give it 30 years and we'll see what comes out then when our Disney Overlords give us the remakes. Or Amazon. I have no idea who will own us all, but it'll be one of them.
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Yes, Finn's character is all about screaming "Rey!"

I personally really like Colin Trevorrow's take on Finn... Going from a coward-like character in TFA to being a revolution leader in Duel of the Fates.

But, TROS gave us Finn who maybe has 10 midichlorians, friend zoned by Rey, and the same signature "Rey!" scream.
 
patrickivan said:
I was positive he was going to be shown force sensitive and go on the similar journey with Rey. It was certainly a waste of his character.
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I so did not want that. I was hoping he would be Rey's opposite pole, a bum who came from nowhere and actually rose to importance and turned his life around without spacemagic. There was so much in for him, being the underdog rising up against his oppressors, his injury at the end of TFA could have been something to develop, his past as a Stormtrooper could have had a line of his own and he's as important as Chewbacca or R2 really in the end in the ST...just kinda...there...
 
I had wanted Finn to become the audience-representative co-character along with Rey. They way the role was split between Han and Luke in Star Wars. Both identifying with the bored kid who wants to leave home on an adventure but feels he can't... and the guy who gets caught up in all this and is trying to figure out what the hell's going on.

With more screen-time and better writing, I'd've seen Rey learn what she can do. About the time Finn followed his instincts to find her after she'd been captured would be when he mentions "I don't know... I just felt like you were this way" and she realizes he's a sensitive, too. I see him becoming more of a Kyle Katarn character. Or a faaaaaar less OP Force Unleashed Starkiller. Not the most skilled Jedi ever, but able to do little things to help with his commando missions, equally at home with blaster or lightsaber -- sometimes both simultaneously. Often getting dragged along by Poe who needs his navi-guessing hunches... *shrug* I have ideas about how it could have been done. Apart from what I describe there, he'd be the character who is the audience's vehicle to what Rey's cycle was supposed to be about back when George drafted it -- a deeper delve into the nature of the Force, who has it, why maybe, and where both the Jedi and Sith went wrong with it.

PrinceZip said:
Not sure if a weird cartoon side story and having a trippy purple wig lady are good concepts haha
I'd argue the Holy Special had both poor concept and execution.

The PT on the other hand definitely had great ideas going for them.
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I mean the basic premise that there's a Wookiee Force-related festival/ritual that only happens once every great while, that Chewbacca, as head of his family, needs to get home to participate, but it's an occupied world and they need to find a way in past the Empire.

For what it's worth, I want the animated Boba Fett portion just done properly as a separate, full Adventure of Luke Skywalker, along with Splinter of the Mind's Eye.
 
I cannot understand the military logic of bringing a sanitation worker from Starkiller Base and assigning him to the Stormtrooper group directly under the command of Kylo Ren in a critical mission.
 
I always envisioned a stormtrooper indoctrinated since birth to be more like the Universal Soldier after he turned his back on the First Order, not the timid love struck puppy dog doofus that Finn was
 
I think Finn turning at the beginning of TFA was acted well but then his characterization makes no sense.

I inferred that Finn was just sick of the killing, seeing His friend die and his blood leave a print on his helmet. It was really a great scene and I was completely on board with Finn.

then literally one scene later, he happily shoots his former comrades with a huge laser while he and Poe try to escape in their stolen tie fighter.

and Finn was completely wasted as a character. He got a great setup in 7, a recently turned coward who would grow to make a name for himself. His story is essentially repeated in 8. And 9 he is more useless than C3PO. given that Poe was originally planned to die, I strongly believe that Finn’s initial story outline was to take Poe’s place as the “ace” of the rebellion and grow into the character. Maybe he gets found out as a fake, then allowing him to become his own person.
 
He's not a janitor. Ask any Marine. Everyone fights, everyone works. Vehicles need maintenance, food needs prepping, latrines need cleaning -- and you're not in armor and fighting constantly. It's mostly downtime. Lots of training, lots of drills, lots of practice.

And even to this day, there's still no substitute for getting out on the battlefield for the first time. No way to know whether someone's going to break first time they see combat til they're in it.

That said, I absolutely agree that his behavior after deserting was too inconsistent. There was plenty of fish-out-of-water material at first that was appropriate, and he demonstrated his competence over the trilogy... but then they had him acting the buffoon, and a cowardly one at that. It's one thing to realize you can't do what you've been trained your entire conscious life to do. It's quite another to have decades of indoctrination and training evaporate because you're intimidated by the organization you're leaving. He's just too pusillanimous. He needed to be all, "We need to stop the First Order... Um. How do we stop the First Order?"
 
With Finn, I feel they could've used him as a Stormtrooper with whom the "training", just wouldn't stick with him due to his force sensitivity. Then have it stated that it has happened before, and that once made aware of it, Snoke would request those troopers to be sent to them, and never seen again (Finn knows this and it drives him to help Poe escape and save his own life). Could also later have it shown that Palpatine had them transported to him to keep his spirit going until Kylo/Rey found him. Or have them be the Knights of Ren/Praetorian Guards.

To cut this short. Finn rejects being a Jedi, as he feels that it'd be swapping one oppression for another. Rey and Ben die in the end after they destroy the Emperor. Finn decides to take up the mantle of "Jedi", but takes it in a new direction (or views it like QGJ did).

I could go on forever with how I personally feel Finn should've been woven into the story more :)
 

I encourage people to watch this video.
It shows why TROS failed in terms of "creative minds" and talents,
And it lists exactly who to blame...

Some of the standouts who are not so widely talked about are
- Chris Terrio: ruined the script and doesn't even fully understand the story beat structures and Joseph Campbell's Heroes Journey concept

- Eunice Huthart: why are lightsaber/fight choreographies so boring? It's because she's replacing the legendary Nick Gillard

- Victoria Mahoney: instead of taking cool 2nd unit shots, she's more concerned about "political correctness" in the writers room

- Michelle Rejwan: literally just JJ's personal assistant... now she's credited as a "producer" AND senior VP of LFL live action

At the end, everything boils down to Kathleen and JJ making wrong hiring decisions.
 
PrinceZip said:
- Eunice Huthart: why are lightsaber/fight choreographies so boring? It's because she's replacing the legendary Nick Gillard

- Victoria Mahoney: instead of taking cool 2nd unit shots, she's more concerned about "political correctness" in the writers room
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I take the TFA lightsaber fight over everything that was in the prequels.

Also not sure what exactly is a cool second unit shot? A closeup of someone's head or some clatter falling?
 
sztriki said:
I take the TFA lightsaber fight over everything that was in the prequels.

Also not sure what exactly is a cool second unit shot? A closeup of someone's head or some clatter falling?
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We'll agree to disagree on which lightsaber fights are better.
Personally, I think PT fights offered a new style with more finesse.
ST fights were very similar to OT and didn't offer anything new, albeit TFA fight was serviceable.

TROS's environmental shots looked generic and did not "wow" me like Dunkirk or Bladerunner 2049 did.
And it's usually 2nd unit's job to film these.
 
sztriki said:
I take the TFA lightsaber fight over everything that was in the prequels.

Also not sure what exactly is a cool second unit shot? A closeup of someone's head or some clatter falling?
Click to expand...
Yeah, the fight in TFA (while admittedly the only good/real lightsaber fight in the ST) was a lot better than the stale, overly-choreographed “fights” in the PT where the opponents clearly only wanted to spar, rather than having to fight for their lives, not to mention the total lack of motivation for the audience to care about the fight beyond “bright glowing things are moving”. A fight—really any action scene, or scene in general—should tell a story on its own. It should inform us on the characters and who they are. It should feel genuine, and there need to be stakes. ESB and ROTJ do this incredibly well, and after seeing some clips of some of the Kurosawa samurai films that influenced the OT, the fight in ANH that most people point to as being “boring” or “slow” makes a lot more sense. It’s more about watching and waiting for the right moment to strike, not about flailing about and jumping forty feet into a quadruple front flip.

And as for the second unit thing, it’s too much to ask to have these stories be told all that interestingly visually speaking. Disney likes their blockbusters to be serviceable and that’s about it. Even most or all of the Marvel films, while entertaining and compelling, don’t particularly have any particular style or substance to their visual aspect.
 
PrinceZip said:

I encourage people to watch this video.
It shows why TROS failed in terms of "creative minds" and talents,
And it lists exactly who to blame...

Some of the standouts who are not so widely talked about are
- Chris Terrio: ruined the script and doesn't even fully understand the story beat structures and Joseph Campbell's Heroes Journey concept

- Eunice Huthart: why are lightsaber/fight choreographies so boring? It's because she's replacing the legendary Nick Gillard

- Victoria Mahoney: instead of taking cool 2nd unit shots, she's more concerned about "political correctness" in the writers room

- Michelle Rejwan: literally just JJ's personal assistant... now she's credited as a "producer" AND senior VP of LFL live action

At the end, everything boils down to Kathleen and JJ making wrong hiring decisions.
Click to expand...
I could say the same thing about the PT fights. Nick was replacing the truly legendary Bob Anderson.
 
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