Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Pre-release)

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

He could have survived the fall, but Naboo didn't exactly do the big firework the way DS2 did right after Palps fell. Guy be deadified.

well, Maul could have clawed his way out of the bottom shaft during the big parade and award ceremony! :D (im good with maul being dead in the end...) but ya, the death star being blown up shortly after Palpy is thrown down the shaft pretty much ends the emperor for sure! :thumbsup
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

A lot o' truth right there. Also, surprises may come along: I've seen a few silent films that have fx shots which, to this day, confound me as to how they accomplished them! :confused

Yeah, and there's other older films that lack the pacing or incidental music to help propel things, but still feature some AMAZING stuff. Try watching Howard Hughes' Hell's Angels some time. You wanna see some incredible aerial photography and stunt work...man that one's a stunner.

But that's the thing. It's in black and white (except for a few scenes). It's slow paced. The camera work for the non-aerial stuff is all shot like a stage play -- static camera, straight-ahead angles, etc. The music only pipes up at certain moments and the rest of the time it's just people talking and such. I expect a lot of kids would see it as really boring and wouldn't sit through it.

Unless you've grown up being exposed to a wide variety of stuff, I think, you can end up thinking that only new stuff is worth watching. Maybe not with everyone, but I think a lot of kids are like that these days. They never saw the old stuff, so to them, Michael Bay is a cinematic genius.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

He could have survived the fall, but Naboo didn't exactly do the big firework the way DS2 did right after Palps fell. Guy be deadified.

He's ashes, or less.

Except in the wake of the ST, George is releasing the ESE (extra special editions).

In ROTJ:ESE, as the rebels are losing the battle, a wormhole appears just outside the battle. Out of the wormhole emerges the USS Enterprise! (Turns out this is really where the enterprise was hiding from Khan during WOK). Even though they've never been anywhere remotely close to this area before, Capt Kirk instantly realizes the good guys are the allies. Kirk loads of a copy of the genesis project and launches at the death star to destroy it. Death start destroyed, kirk takes the enterprise back through the wormhole (after hitting it off with Mon Mothma) to face khan.

Therefore the rejuvenating ability of genesis could take the atoms of his body and resurrect him. And since they could jump start each atom, you'd have a planet populated by millions of emperors!

Maybe I shouldn't give george any ideas..... :)
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

The only visual metaphor that I can think of in the entire PT is Sidious destroying the Senate chamber. Literally destroying democracy. Which was really cool. One of the few scenes that I really enjoyed in the PT. The maniacal joy with which he throws those Senate pods, while laughing like a madman were a LOT of fun to watch.

I hope we don't see Vader or Palpatine in 7. 8. or 9, considering that they're already dead by that point in the time line. Plus, Vader has also become Anakin once more (Sebastian Shaw people, NOT Hayden Christensen).
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

At this point i'd lay even odds on Luke learning something about the force that turns out to be a dark side power and getting a flashback.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

That would be lame. I suppose anything is possible. But I still think that would be lame.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Yeah, and there's other older films that lack the pacing or incidental music to help propel things, but still feature some AMAZING stuff. Try watching Howard Hughes' Hell's Angels some time. You wanna see some incredible aerial photography and stunt work...man that one's a stunner.

But that's the thing. It's in black and white (except for a few scenes). It's slow paced. The camera work for the non-aerial stuff is all shot like a stage play -- static camera, straight-ahead angles, etc. The music only pipes up at certain moments and the rest of the time it's just people talking and such. I expect a lot of kids would see it as really boring and wouldn't sit through it.

Unless you've grown up being exposed to a wide variety of stuff, I think, you can end up thinking that only new stuff is worth watching. Maybe not with everyone, but I think a lot of kids are like that these days. They never saw the old stuff, so to them, Michael Bay is a cinematic genius.

Hell's Angels: mental note made! :)

I have long, long since forgotten directors and titles (they are 'movies' to me, not 'films' :lol ), but I will never forget the power of that silent movie with the guy over-eating and having a nightmare. The intensity of it is in the feeling of actually looking at someone's dream in a way that could never be accomplished by any amount of cgi or motion-control cameras. Creepy as hell! :eek Or, the appearance of Abe Lincoln in Birth of a Nation: you kind of forget for a moment and almost think you're actually seeing the man on motion picture film!
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

My money is on a new franchise rising up. Seven will only be the beginning and it'll start were six left off. We're gonna learn Darth Vader trained an evil army of Sith's and that he really killed Darth Sidious's look-a-like. There will be lots of Wookies for the kids and Ja-Ja Binks son will join the fray, a dash of Bounty Hunters including Boba Fetts long lost son. And Luke's very own privately owned Jedi school with Yoda and Obi's ghost as masters. Either Luke or Leia will find out they're not brother and sister and finally confirm that they were indeed in love with each other before. That last part alone will make people forget the blasphemy that movie will be. And in that process, George Lucas will alter the original trilogy some more, causing the highest mass suicide ever recorded in America.

I like to set my expectation low so I don't get disappointed. I expect to vomit in the trash can after I see this movie. :sick
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

a dash of Bounty Hunters including Boba Fetts long lost son.
Didn't we see Boba getting chummy with a dancer at Jabba's palace in the SE?? This could easily be fit into the next film with a 1/2 mandalorian- 1/2 twilek bounty hunter looking for revenge because Luke stole his only chance at a "normal" childhood. :lol
Edit "Oola-Fett"
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

That'd be a very odd looking helmet :)

Boba's son should be a clone, though, right? Jango's Grandclone. :)

As for spaceballs II, i had heard brooks was working on it about 4ish years ago. Guessing it was wrong or it never came to be. I so want SBII
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

I think your assessment is right on the money, really. As awesome as Maul and Fett were in concept, in practice they were either too short-lived or delivered little. These films had lots of characters that appealed to lots of people in lots of different ways, but as a matter of what they really delivered or how they were fleshed out, these two were misapplied. I've always thought Maul, for instance, should have been the only apprentice for Sidious in all three prequels, right up to the point of squaring off with Anakin in ROTS, which would have demonstrated awesomely how powerful Anakin had become as a Sith, rather than his being brow-beaten by a geriatric. The duel between Obi-Wan and Maul in TPM was a showcase of just how powerful Maul was, yet he died so preposterously easily. As for Fett, I dug the air of mystery about him in the OT, which was subsequently rent asunder in the prequels. But there was really nothing to prove how awesome he was, or was supposed to be, in the OT and he died a silly, humiliating death.

Everyone has their favorites for various reasons, and mine have always been The Emperor and Vader. Their lives and machinations were the very reason for the misery and strife of everyone else in the galaxy, so nothing says OT to me like these two. The Emperor was mentioned in IV, glimpsed a bit in V, and fully fleshed out in VI, yet his background remained foggy enough to keep us wondering about him. And nothing could have been any better than Ian McDiarmid's interpretation of him and his classically-trained performance thereof. His replacement of Clive Revill in Empire was one revision I never minded, though much closer scrutiny of his prosthetic and robe should have been given. As to Vader, he was full force through all three and extremely well developed as a character, nothing more to say there really.

Having said all that, as nice as it would be to see these characters again, there's just no place for them in the upcoming sequels and I think it would be a pandering mistake to try and put them there. The Emperor, Vader, Boba, Maul, they are all dead and gone, destroyed beyond any hope of resurrection even in that galaxy where belief can be suspended for this or that. There is definitely room to expound on them though, in other movies to come, Vader and the Emperor at least, just not in VII and beyond...









No one could have anticipated their popularity. Hell, no one even anticipated Star Wars ever getting made much less have characters that would resonate with people. But to me when it comes to Maul and Fett, and many, many others like them, it's more like "who cares?"

They were both cool looking/ cool fighting henchmen that both died in lame ways. At least if Obi-wan had cut Maul in half while he was still flying out of the chasm, like they did it in the TPM comic adaptation, that would have been AWESOME!

The problem is Boba Fett and Darth Maul were not developed characters in the films. They may have been fleshed out in the novels and comics, but in the movies alone, they were plot devices used to drive the story forward or increase the conflict. There's nothing wrong with that and they were fun to watch, but I can't take them too seriously like I could with the main characters and story. Just because their outfits were cool (and they most certainly were), it doesn't mean that they are good characters. They don't have an arch that shows growth, or depth like the leads do, and that's fine because that isn't their function in the story.

I think when they develop spin off films of these guys (and they likely will) they won't be as good as everyone is imagining them to be. Also I wouldn't expect ANY of their established canon being regarded in those movies. These guys are the ancillary players who don't have a lot to offer in terms of really meaty stories. Perhaps in the right hands, they could be, but as they are now, they don't have much to tell. I just wish more people would be honest about their love for them and say that they are awesome looking, rather than trying to argue about the greatness of their persona.

----If you want to get technical ROTS showed a lot of the things that people have been asking for, though in a lousy, truncated way. It showed Anakin turning, hunting down the Jedi, the emperor assuming power, the emperor "training" vader (more like giving him orders to murder people) and then telling Anakin AFTER he becomes Vader that "maybe they can figure out" the Sith secret of immortality. And like a complete and total idiot, he doesn't even bother asking how Palpatine knows about his wife, or how he means to teach him to cheat death. You'd think he would have killed Palpatine for lying to him about that. Not to mention being given some sort of proof that saving someone from death is even possible, BEFORE he decides to commit genocide. What a moron! How in the world was anyone supposed to view THAT as a tragedy? Why, because he couldn't think for himself? Don't get me wrong, that is sad, but sad meaning pathetic, not someone I could fully empathize with, which is what makes a tragedy story well, tragic.

Speaking of pathetic, it's sad that the 3D Clone Wars cartoon is even considered canon. They don't even stick with the continuity of the trilogy which spawned them. Darth Maul gets cut in half and lives? Anakin won't be given the rank of Master, but will still be given an apprentice? Jedi aren't allowed to love, but Obi-Wan has a girlfriend, and knows about Anakin and Padme? Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan have communicated several times, and yet by ROTS Yoda has to teach a shocked Obi-Wan how to do it. Does he have amnesia? Is everyone invincible? Jedi can withstand carbon freezing, but according to Lando (a few decades later) they've never done it, and they were terrified Han or Luke might die when frozen. Kind of kills all the dramatic tension in the freezing chamber doesn't it?-----

---The problem is that when you take a backstory and flesh it out into a full story, it too HAS TO HAVE IT'S OWN BACK STORY! I'm currently rewriting my own fantasy stories, and in order to make them work and have some sort of grounding, I have to establish the world, and the context in which my characters are living. This means giving them their own history.

A New Hope set up where Luke came from, who his father was, how Obi-Wan was teaching Luke, and why he was doing it. It established a history and backdrop for what was about to happen in the first film. Not to mention, a huge part of the magic that sold us on this fantasy was that it was filled with visual metaphors that reinforced the ideas of the story. Luke destroys the Death Star, a fire breathing dragon that destroys worlds, and from it's bowels, he'd earlier rescued a princess.

The prequels had no grounding on which to pin our characters. We know it was a time of peace. But even in peace time, there is still conflict of some kind or another. Why was Qui-Gon such a risk taker? Why was Obi-Wan so by the book? Why weren't the Jedi more intelligent thinkers? And that whole the Dark side clouds everything bs is just a lame excuse for poor writing. So what if it clouds their judgement. If Sidious was THAT powerful that he could get them to not think clearly, then why bother setting up a phony war that lasted decades, and just launch an outright coup on the republic as a pronounced Sith lord? He can make them all stupid, right? What was the main theme, and what were the exact visual metaphors that illustrated it?

For all of my complaints about Lucas, I think his lack of focus is his weak spot in the last few years. The man is a VISUAL GENIUS! I dare anyone to deny that. If you watch any of the extra features on any one of the films (all six) you can see that he clearly knows what looks right in his films, almost by instinct. And when you see the final design in the finished film, it looks distinctly Star Wars. The problem is that where in the past he had others around him to steer his imagination so that his strong visuals reinforced the themes of the stories he told, he no longer had people around him to help him focus that creative energy in a logical narrative sense. You have a LOT of disparate themes going on in the prequels, rather than one cohesive theme that weaves it's way through the trilogy to tie together at the climax of ROTS.

At least with the sequel trilogy, we have some hope that they will be good, especially because the preceding films have a strong foundation on which to create further adventures in that universe. The stage has been set. We have a history with which to ground the new stories.

Sorry. There was a lot of ground to cover since my last post. hahaha
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Having said all that, as nice as it would be to see these characters again, there's just no place for them in the upcoming sequels and I think it would be a pandering mistake to try and put them there. The Emperor, Vader, Boba, Maul, they are all dead and gone, destroyed beyond any hope of resurrection even in that galaxy where belief can be suspended for this or that. There is definitely room to expound on them though, in other movies to come, Vader and the Emperor at least, just not in VII and beyond...

Well, if The Clone Wars animated series exhausts their story lines the period between RotS and New Hope could be done. Then we would have Vader, Emperor, bounty Hunters... even Han and Chewie... I wouldn't mind the animated series starting up again with that time period.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

I hear you jme3,

Now that you mention it, it was a really cool build up for the Emperor to be mentioned in 4, given a creepy cameo in 5, and ultimately be defeated in 6. Ian MacDiarmid is such a high caliber actor too, and not to mention, extremely humble in real life.

I'm hopeful that 7, 8, and 9 will be good. Like I said in my earlier (book long haha) post, since we already have stories that preceded these, we have a grounding on which the new films can be framed.

But if they aren't good, then so be it. I mean I can't expect them to be the second coming. They might be far worse than the prequels. I guess what ultimately excites me is the prospect of seeing a brand new Star Wars Trilogy in the theater. In a lot of ways it would be really cool if they kept nearly every aspect of the trilogy secret so that when they get released the public could be genuinely surprised. The downside to living in the information age when it comes to movies is you can typically read all the spoilers before the movie comes out if you choose to. But one of the upsides is a thread like this where the fan-base can speculate. :popcorn
 
Last edited:
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Yeah, and there's other older films that lack the pacing or incidental music to help propel things, but still feature some AMAZING stuff. Try watching Howard Hughes' Hell's Angels some time. You wanna see some incredible aerial photography and stunt work...man that one's a stunner.
I've heard so many good things about Hell's Angels that it makes me wonder why it's not one of the more "well known" classic movies. I'm gonna' have to bump up it's priority on my Amazon Wishlist so I can actually see it. ;)


But that's the thing. It's in black and white (except for a few scenes). It's slow paced. The camera work for the non-aerial stuff is all shot like a stage play -- static camera, straight-ahead angles, etc. The music only pipes up at certain moments and the rest of the time it's just people talking and such. I expect a lot of kids would see it as really boring and wouldn't sit through it.

Unless you've grown up being exposed to a wide variety of stuff, I think, you can end up thinking that only new stuff is worth watching. Maybe not with everyone, but I think a lot of kids are like that these days. They never saw the old stuff, so to them, Michael Bay is a cinematic genius.
Sad, but true. I would never have seen many of my favorite movies if I had the mindset that old movies aren't worth watching.

...I have long, long since forgotten directors and titles (they are 'movies' to me, not 'films' :lol)...
Realistically, they stopped being "films" when digital photography and projection became the norm. :unsure
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

And herein lies the real problem with STAR WARS. Not the content, the "fans". :thumbsdown

To be fair I'm not really a fan. I like Star Wars though. Now what I am is a movie buff. And to me the problem is normally a combination of content and fans expectations. The fans get extremely excited their favorite movie is coming out, and the first piece of bad or annoying content they see just messes it all up. Same thing happened to me with Spider-Man. I thought I was going to hate the movie. But it turned out to be slightly decent. I wish everyone didn't know who he was including the entire police force and I could have done with less twilight looking... everything. But it was ok.

But someone mentioned earlier that they do have a huge line of books. I remember their books covered up an entire wall in a big building and they weren't all the same. So it should be something there after Darth Vader's death. But my money is there will be a school taught my Luke.
 
Last edited:
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Well, if The Clone Wars animated series exhausts their story lines the period between RotS and New Hope could be done. Then we would have Vader, Emperor, bounty Hunters... even Han and Chewie... I wouldn't mind the animated series starting up again with that time period.

That would be pretty cool so long as they don't fall into the same trap that the Clone Wars does and utilize every trope that we've seen used in the 6 movies. While I really enjoy the Clone Wars I do agree with a previous poster that they do have a bad habit of ignoring/breaking canon because they want to use something that we saw in one of the 6 original movies like Force ghosts, and carbon freezing to name two. So long as they don't do that then an animated series ala Clone Wars set between III & IV would be awesome.
 
Re: Star Wars Episode VII

I've seen a few silent films that have fx shots which, to this day, confound me as to how they accomplished them! :confused

One of my favorite moments from the "The Begining" documentary is Lucas sitting there in his office, watching Buster Keaton (if memory server) doing schtick on the top of a moving train. Lucas (ILMs daddy for chrissakes!) laughs and says "How did they DO that!?".
 
Back
Top