Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Post-release)

So just saw the movie for the second time and the questions are arising:

1. How does Leia and Rey know one another? Chewie walks right by her and makes no acknowledgement of Han's death.
I thought this was more a continuity/editing issue. Chewie carries Finn out, we see him linger towards the base... then it looked to me as if he was mourning in the cockpit of the Falcon. (But, he may've just been in the Resistance Base).
 
Someone posted a theory on another board that I haven't seen here (though with 70 pages, and a few other threads, it's certainly possible) -



I like that theory, though it seems to me that Ren would probably have brought it up, or at least hinted at it, when he found her in the woods, or was interrogating her.

I heard the Making Star Wars podcast mention that theory. Problem is the book has a female voice saying to her "I'll be back, sweetheart" or something to that effect. So the film could go a different direction but it seems they initially intended it to be a woman. We'll see!
 
I heard the Making Star Wars podcast mention that theory. Problem is the book has a female voice saying to her "I'll be back, sweetheart" or something to that effect. So the film could go a different direction but it seems they initially intended it to be a woman. We'll see!

There's also the fact that he can't figure out why he can't read her mind on the Starkiller base. You'd figure if he knew who she was, he'd be like "Oh, right. You're that kid I dropped off."
 
Solo4114;3856159 Anyway said:
chooses[/I] to do in response to those feelings. So, Rey can let herself feel anger in her fight against Kylo Ren, but she's gotta know when to stop short of killing him, rather than just blindly giving in to her anger. It's not that "these emotions are bad," but rather, acting selfishly especially when based on these emotions is bad behavior, which will lead to a cycle of self-hatred that is ultimately redirected outwards at the galaxy, indiscriminately, a la what we see Kylo Ren do.

This exact thought was expressed in the concept art book. The production team stated that it was their view that Luke was an "entirely new entity" precisely because he was the first jedi to accept that his dark side was not separate from him: that it was a necessary part of himself, and that learning to integrate it into his person instead of ostracising it--as the Jedi do--was the key to achieving the "Balance" in the Force that had long been prophecied.

I expect Rey also has this ability, and it is why she behaved the way that she did. In the novelisation it was stated that at the moment she had Ren on the ground beaten, she heard a voice in her head which said: "Kill Him!" but she was able to choose to ignore that impulse and instead backed away. It was then that the ground between them split, not immediately as in the film.

I am personally very comfortable with this idea, and think that it is the only true way that there could be a real balance to the Force.
 
There's also the fact that he can't figure out why he can't read her mind on the Starkiller base. You'd figure if he knew who she was, he'd be like "Oh, right. You're that kid I dropped off."

I think the familiarity Kylo has with Rey is because they trained together at Luke's failed academy. That would make the most sense and would also inform why Snoke wanted her taken alive. They clearly know her power and likely parentage and want to control her.
 
I think the familiarity Kylo has with Rey is because they trained together at Luke's failed academy. That would make the most sense and would also inform why Snoke wanted her taken alive. They clearly know her power and likely parentage and want to control her.

That could be. I suppose his surprise could also be "Why aren't I powerful enough? I thought I was super powerful!"
 
Uh, Boba Fett captured Han Solo. He was an instrumental part of the plot of ESB. Phasma ACTUALLY did nothing. Well, she folded amazingly quickly to an old man and a kindhearted kid whom she knew was nonviolent. I guess there's that.

No, Fett followed Solo to Bespin, called Vader and 'he's here', vader sent a whole fleet to bespin and force Lando's hand, and Lando walked him right into vader's hands. Afterwards, vader gave the frozen solo to him as a thanks for finding him gift. So, technically, Fett did a little more, but not much.

They could easily have just used the same thing TFA did...have someone on bespin cozy up to a mic somewhere and say, 'this is fred to imperial command, have located solo/organa on bespin'...same thing accomplished.
 
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If you can't dispute what I've been posting, and can only try in vain to troll-up a personal flame war, all I can say is, "Move along, move along."
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I'm pretty sure gizmo WAS disputing what you've been saying....THAt is clear. What you ought to have said is "if you can't REFUTE what I've been saying.

I think the movie-going public have already done that.

As far as actors deserving nominations, that is a personal choice. The way that an actor makes us "feel" their performance is different for each of us. i personally found various examples of what i would classify noteworthy acting, because I BELIEVED the performances. It didn't feel like scripted lines to me...when Rey said "My Family will come back..one day" I FELT the heartbreak in her speech as she thought to herself that it may never come to pass. Daisey Ridley made ME feel that. THAT is good acting. I could mention plenty of others...but there is definitely solid acting in this film.

Ben is right. :thumbsup
 
This exact thought was expressed in the concept art book. The production team stated that it was their view that Luke was an "entirely new entity" precisely because he was the first jedi to accept that his dark side was not separate from him: that it was a necessary part of himself, and that learning to integrate it into his person instead of ostracising it--as the Jedi do--was the key to achieving the "Balance" in the Force that had long been prophecied.

I expect Rey also has this ability, and it is why she behaved the way that she did. In the novelisation it was stated that at the moment she had Ren on the ground beaten, she heard a voice in her head which said: "Kill Him!" but she was able to choose to ignore that impulse and instead backed away. It was then that the ground between them split, not immediately as in the film.

I am personally very comfortable with this idea, and think that it is the only true way that there could be a real balance to the Force.

Same here. I always thought that "balance in the Force" -- especially in regards to how the PT Jedi handled it -- was meant to mean that the Jedi stop trying to deny their own emotions, and instead learn to process them.

I'm not certain if Lucas himself ever fully articulated this, but the way I see it, the Force is, to some degree, connected to through emotion and emotional states. This was why the PT Jedi ultimately lost their connection to the Force. If you look at the Sith and the PT Jedi, it's kind of like the struggle between unbridled passion and denial of emotion, or rather the denial of a certain range of emotion (the "bad" feelings of anger, hate, aggression, etc.). But the problem is, if you cut yourself off from that aspect of emotional existence, eventually you lose the ability to feel the "good" side as keenly (e.g., joy, love, contentment).

So, the PT Jedi attempted to deny the emotions by just...never feeling them or banishing them somehow. End result, they lose their connection to the Force. The Sith, on the other hand, are like little kids who simply indulge in every passionate whim, with zero regulation. This is why Anakin was so easily manipulated by Palpatine. He was this ball of pent up rage, sadness, etc., and the Jedi trained him to just...tamp that down or deny it altogether. In Anakin's case, that meant that it just snuck out some other way, to destructive effect. After this, his self-loathing, his regret, and his rage -- both with himself and his circumstances -- fueled his power with the Force.

In the end, true balance can only be attained by learning how to feel the full range of emotions, and still control yourself. So, sure, you feel rage, but you don't indulge in it because you recognize the harmful impact of doing so. But you also recognize that, unless you feel the "bad" side of emotions, you'll never be able to reach the same highs on the "good" side. If you don't know the pain of sadness, you'll never know the pleasure of happiness.


If this is how the new team is handling the Force (not in these explicit terms, but with this overall concept lurking behind the scenes), then I think it's awesome. I really, really hope that we'll see that more fleshed out in the films and other materials. You can even begin to do things like rehabilitate the notion of midichlorians by simply stating that midichlorians are force sensitive organisms that congregate as a result of intense emotional states, rather than entities that create the Force. In essence, you treat the PT Jedi theory as mistaking correlation for causation. Likewise, you say that the PT Jedi were simply wrong about what the best way to handle the Force was. It worked for them...until it didn't. And when it didn't, it went spectacularly awry. To guard against that, you need to adopt the path of balance. There will always be those who challenge that, usually by wanting to indulge in the more passionate side (dark side), but the best path is the one where you allow a full emotional existence.
 
So just saw the movie for the second time and the questions are arising:

1. How does Leia and Rey know one another? Chewie walks right by her and makes no acknowledgement of Han's death.
2. Is Snokes a hologram or a projection of a spirit? When he disappears he fades out rather than blinks out from past holograms. Also his signal seems to be very strong if he is a hologram meaning he may be nearby.
3. How can Rey summon up The Force when she has someone bearing down on her with a lightsaber and be able to suddenly be able to counterattack with as much strength as Kylo who has been using The Force far longer.


1. Not sure yet. Han, Chewie and Leia each gave looks to Rey at one point or another that hinted that they knew her or knew who she was, but were keeping Mum. perhaps we will see in the next one.
2. I think that he is a hologram, because I'd like to think that non-Force sensitive types would not be able to see a spirit projection (HUX)...but who knows?

3. I believe that it is the WILL of the Force. The Force itself (or at Luke's direction) was giving Rey the power and guidance that she needed because she had opened her heart and mind up to it. When she closed her eyes and said "The Force..." she was reaching out with her feelings: making herself available to the Will of the Force, and it galvanized her. That's my take, anyway.
 
Uh, Boba Fett captured Han Solo. He was an instrumental part of the plot of ESB. Phasma ACTUALLY did nothing. Well, she folded amazingly quickly to an old man and a kindhearted kid whom she knew was nonviolent. I guess there's that.

Phasma didn't do any less in this really than Boba did in ESB. And it has been stated that they have big plans for her going forward, so time will tell who ends up being the ultimate badass.
 
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I'm pretty sure gizmo WAS disputing what you've been saying....THAt is clear. What you ought to have said is "if you can't REFUTE what I've been saying.

I think the movie-going public have already done that.

As far as actors deserving nominations, that is a personal choice. The way that an actor makes us "feel" their performance is different for each of us. i personally found various examples of what i would classify noteworthy acting, because I BELIEVED the performances. It didn't feel like scripted lines to me...when Rey said "My Family will come back..one day" I FELT the heartbreak in her speech as she thought to herself that it may never come to pass. Daisey Ridley made ME feel that. THAT is good acting. I could mention plenty of others...but there is definitely solid acting in this film.

Ben is right. :thumbsup

Yeah, I mentioned that above. I think the performances in this film were much better than what we've seen before. The actors were really invested in their roles, rather than just going through the motions.
 
What's pushing TFA now as best picture is it being a Disney production, since so many Academy voters are connected to that Hollywood behemoth. TFA will pull many tech nominations like VFX, sound design, sound editing, production design and such and may win them due to it being a box office smash. The biggest sci-fi genre competition is Mad Max: Fury Road, and I think it will be awarded more than TFA due to its excellence. Can't see any acting noms...even Adam Driver in a supporting category would be a stretch. Hollywood always acknowledges a big hit, so a best picture (production category) nomination for TFA is very possible.

Don't think that's it, but I do believe disney is a part of it.

Lucas, for example, didn't care about the hollywood establishment or pursuing the awards. I want to say I read something that said they (LFL) opted not to pursue an acting nomination for McDiarmid in ROTS (whether anyone personally agrees is irrelevant) and basically said 'if it happens it happens'. Meanwhile, pretty much every other studio is working the system to get their people recognized. Disney will participate in the system, i have no doubt. I don't believe they'll resort to 'you owe us' or inimidation factors to do it though.Perhaps that wasn't what was meant, but like I said, I think they'll definitely work the system. I don't think a nomination will make much difference at the box office, but a win, that, i think will definitely pad the box office for them - hence their motivation.
 
Someone posted a theory on another board that I haven't seen here (though with 70 pages, and a few other threads, it's certainly possible) -



I like that theory, though it seems to me that Ren would probably have brought it up, or at least hinted at it, when he found her in the woods, or was interrogating her.


Hmmmm.... I like this theory, too. I had been wondering at the fact that he seemed not only to know who she was, but also to be reacting so strongly that she was mucking up his plans. I could see it that he was too "weak" in the dark side to put her down when she was young, and instead hid her from Snoke so that she would not be continuing evidence of his "weakness".

that seems to fit, and makes the story bigger rather than smaller. Almost like a "I KNEW I should have taken care of you when I could have" --OR-- "This Girl brings out the light in me... which I DESPISE, so i've got to turn her".
 
Some great points from the Tell 'Em Steve Dave podcast (mostly from co-host and Impractical Joker Brian Quinn), a lot of what I mentioned quite a while ago in this thread. There's a bit of strong language.

http://moviepilot.com/posts/3703808

I liked the movie for the most part - saw it for the 4th time last night. I don't think that excuses a lack of critical thinking about it all... some quotes I think summed it up best:

"Now when you watch Jedi you're gonna know that Luke's gonna -- up and get a bunch of kids killed."

"I'm not even complaining that the Empire is back, with a slightly different name, and they have a Death Star and nothing they did in the first three movies matters at --- all, at this point. Because even Darth Vader's redemption meant nothing because his --- grandson is out there still doing --- evil -- in his name... Nothing -- matters. Everything they did. Every victory they won was pointless."

"Everything that happened was organic in 1977. No one was told to go outside and --- line up around a block to watch a movie... Now every --- minute detail is micro-managed and planned to the point where nothing is legitimate... The studio is like, 'If we do this, the sheep will do this.'"

"It exists less as a meaningful extension of its world than as a fan-service deployment device." (this was actually from Slant, but quoted in the article).

These are the kinds of thoughts that remind of what is wrong with this movie and it makes me wonder if this was truly a movie processed and serviced to the fans - pandering or even selling out. It's a given that this movie is tremendously successful and very popular... it seems that it was designed that way, manufactured rather than organic or even artistic.

That doesn't mean it doesn't work, it just means that we are simply buying the product we're meant to buy.
 
Well in that case, I feel my money was well spent. I've seen it three times already and haven't begun to be tried of it or stop thinking of it. I am still pondering and wondering... and THAT is a sign of a good film, in my view.
 
Yeah this film definitely wasn't farm raised and feed all natural wheat grass, ***** ****ing hipster ******.

I know what type of film I was watching. It was definitely way above the tripe that is completely "inorganic ", artificial and , fake. I'll give you an example: All the Transformers, Fast & Furious, AVP, TMNT, Transporter. That's just a few. They churn them out, and their isn't even fan service in them. Hell, fan service isn't a bad thing. If you can't go back to what's strong in a franchise maybe it's a weak ass franchise.

Also, Boba has what a lot of characters have, backstory. Perhaps Phasma will be built up to what Boba should've been
 
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