Star trek: The next generation 25 anniversary

[Monster Dave]

I agree about the one final (get it right) TNG movie. Nemesis needs to be handled like Tokyo Drift (cut out). Frakes has always been a bit scraggly off camera. Which is surprising because he cleans up nice. Dorn has been bald for some time now. Marina is the one whose gone down hill the most - and that makes me sad. When I watch TNG I wish that she still looked like that. I had the biggest crush on her back in the 90s.

She was really pretty here:

But now this makes me sad:

 

[Dave Ward]

This show needs more love. I'm in my 30s, and it seems that a lot of sci-fi fans I know in their 20's never saw much of this - DS9 and Voyager always come up more in conversation.

 

[Jeyl]

But now this makes me sad:

...... I see happiness. And I'm thankful for the work she's done.

*salute*

 

[MooCriket]

When I last saw her at Far Point in Baltimore she looked Like someone you would see in the far corner of of dimly lit bar, waiting in anticipation for that poor guy who has one to many. She dressed way to young for her age too.

But, she was nice enough to talk to at the con, and I did like her character from season three on.

 

[Michael Bergeron]

I'm in my 30s, and it seems that a lot of sci-fi fans I know in their 20's never saw much of this - DS9 and Voyager always come up more in conversation.

That's a crying shame. Both of those pale in comparison IMO.

 

[Apollo]

Don't be.

I hung out with her in the early 90's when she first started doing Cons, she was the first one of the TNG cast to do them, and she is one lady with a lust for life, laughter, and fun.

One helluva Lady

But now this makes me sad:

 

[Jeyl]

This show needs more love. I'm in my 30s, and it seems that a lot of sci-fi fans I know in their 20's never saw much of this - DS9 and Voyager always come up more in conversation.

While I certainly agree that TNG deserves a more love and respect since everyone is just clamoring how awesome a rebooted TOS series is turning out, I've gotta say that DS9 is my "go to" series when I want to define something as Star Trek.

Gene's vision of Star Trek was always mucky and inconsistent. He says that children should never mourn the death of the ones closest to you, and that we've mentally evolved out of needs physical things. Yet more time than not, we have had the rudest, most a**holish human beings ever to grace the screen in Star Trek and we're still supposed to take that seriously. What made TNG unbearable was how it forced us to accept Wesley Crusher as the perfect human being who is so far ahead of every other character that he is destined for great things... Bah.

Star Trek Deep Space Nine on the other hand took the idea of a perfect humanity and threw all that out the window. Not to say that the characters can freely be jerks. Far from it. But the characters understood that nothing is absolute, and that at time the Federation's principles and interests can sometimes cause things to become even worse.

And I cannot stress this enough. Deep Space Nine has the best depiction of gender equality throughout the whole franchise. Men and women wear the same style uniform, they're treated with as much respect as any other officer, nobody brings up how women aren't capable of doing something that a man can do, and my favorite bit, they can be leaders!

TNG?.... If you're a woman on that show, look out. Tasha Yar I thought was a cool idea of giving a tough and extremely responsible job to a female character, but thanks to bad writing and poor execution, the actress lost interest in the show and Worf is now her replacement. It's like the series said "Oh, we're sorry that we put a female character in charge of security. We've decided to rectify that by replacing her with the most macho manly man alive who actually looks down on human women as weak and fragile". Ensign Ro? She turns traitor. Beverly Crusher? Of course all medics have to be women. Troi? Emotional anchor for Riker and is the worst counselor ever.

Voyager?...... Janeway is a psychopath and Seven never started looking great until that one episode where she actually wore a star fleet uniform. Enterprise? Ok, I give props to this series for retconning "Turnabout Intruder" where that episode said women aren't allowed to be captains (WRITTEN BY GENE RODDENBERRY!). T'Pol on the other hand... again, screw that dress. And props for Hoshi in actually fulfilling her part as a useful communications officer where in Trek09 Uhura's role is overshadowed by two other officers (Hannity and Chekov) and the fact that all she did was listen to nothing.

:thumbsup

Wesley: Sir, I know this may finish me as an acting ensign, but-
Picard: SHUT UP WESLY.

 

[Michael Bergeron]

Where on the flip side I find DS9 to be the least "Trek" of them. :lol

For me Star Trek is about exploration. TOS did it very well but without a budget. Voyager, although close, was all about getting home. It's my least favourite series. Enterprise was close as well and I enjoyed it but missed on some of the nuances I thought.

DS9, especially at the beginning, could have taken place anywhere and anytime. It could have been a show about characters at a trading post in the old West or a research station in the Arctic. Aside from a bit of technology there was nothing Trek about it. Now when the war started it got interesting but for me it was too late, I already had drifted from the show. It ranks as my second least of the various series.

TNG took what TOS started and added the budget it deserved. I can put up with a few bad Wesley episodes for the scores of gold that came from that series.

But the characters understood that nothing is absolute, and that at time the Federation's principles and interests can sometimes cause things to become even worse.

This comment I find odd as that theme is VERY present in TOS, TNG, and Enterprise.

 

[Monster Dave]

Though for me, TNG is my favorite, I really did like DS9. I think that what really drew me in was the impecable and often extremely strong role that Avery Brooks played. I've been impressed with Avery since the days of Spenser for Hire. Though I know he's a very well rounded and extremely experienced actor, I always felt that he conveyed a sense of passion and power in his role on DS9 that still impresses me to this day.

While I will forever love TNG, I never felt there was a performance of any single actor from TOS to Enterprise that ever came close to the level of power, passion, and poise that Avery displayed on screen.

 

[Michael Bergeron]

While I will forever love TNG, I never felt there was a performance of any single actor from TOS to Enterprise that ever came close to the level of power, passion, and poise that Avery displayed on screen.

:lol Man do I fly in the path of Trek fans here... I always found him wooden. My personal opinion is that Patrick Stewart was the finest actor to put on a Starfleet uniform in any series. He could be vulnerable and powerful at the same time.

Different strokes I guess! Live and let live I say.

 

[Monster Dave]

Everyone has their own view - and there's nothing wrong it that at all!!

:thumbsup

For anyone interested, check out this 2012 interview with Avery about his acting career in terms of Black History month:

http://technorati.com/entertainment/celebrity/article/black-history-month-the-words-of/

 

[AGxM]

:lol Man do I fly in the path of Trek fans here... I always found him wooden. My personal opinion is that Patrick Stewart was the finest actor to put on a Starfleet uniform in any series. He could be vulnerable and powerful at the same time.

Different strokes I guess! Live and let live I say.

Totally agree O_B.

Cannot get into DS9 as Brooks does nothing for me as a actor in terms of connection (same for Enterprise) Patrick Stewart is the best actor for sure to ever wear the captains pips.

 

[TheDoctor]

I've gotta say that DS9 is my "go to" series when I want to define something as Star Trek.

DS9 is my favorite Trek, but TNG is still the model I hold up when defining what Trek is. If we're working toward anything as a society/culture, it should be TNG.

And I cannot stress this enough. Deep Space Nine has the best depiction of gender equality throughout the whole franchise.

Ehhhh....I don't know about "The Best" but it was certainly better than TOS or TNG. My vote is still on Voyager for this one.

Tasha Yar I thought was a cool idea of giving a tough and extremely responsible job to a female character, but thanks to bad writing and poor execution, the actress lost interest in the show and Worf is now her replacement.

That's a nice way of saying "she got fired for posing nude in Playboy. :lol
The female characters in TNG were poorly written, but, to be honest, Doctor Crusher (and, my favorite, Doctor Pulaski) was far more interesting than Tasha ever was (and that's not saying a lot). I really didn't like Tasha (and I'm not a fan of Troi either.... her character just comes across as whiney most of the time.

Seven never started looking great until that one episode where she actually wore a star fleet uniform.

Can I get an amen? AMEN!!

Seriously, though, I don't know how they didn't learn their lesson with Troi. Seven should have been in a uniform from day one (or, at least, some 'interesting' civilian clothes...).

I didn't think Janeway was as bad as people make her out to be. I think it took her until about half way through the third season to find her footing, but after that I thought she was pretty good. True, she wasn't a Picard or a Sisko, but I thought she filled the role very well.

My only complaint about Voyager is that it wasn't a middle of the road show. It had some really good characters (The Doctor, Paris, B'Elanna, Seven [at times], and Janeway) some bland characters (Kim, Chakotay), and some terrible characters (Tuvok, Neelix, Kes, sometimes Seven). The writing also varied a lot from episode to episode. One week you'd get a really BAD episode that made you question why you watched the show, and the next you'd get a fantastic episode that could compete on the list of all-time best Trek. Overall, I think we got a decent series - there was just too much time spent figuring out 'who they were and what they were doing').

 

[Jeyl]

For me Star Trek is about exploration. TOS did it very well but without a budget. Voyager, although close, was all about getting home. It's my least favourite series. Enterprise was close as well and I enjoyed it but missed on some of the nuances I thought.

Exploration is all fun and good, but I don't think it should be treated as an absolute in how Star Trek should be handled. What happens after we've explored a strange new world and encountered new civilizations? What is our responsibility? What can we share with one another and how will that affect the Federation and the said civilization? With TNG and the other series, the episodic feel gives the overall impression that nothing anyone does really matters, like they're wiping their hands clean of the discovery and never bother to mention it again. Voyager was the epidemy of this with it's infamous reset switch.

Deep Space Nine was a show about what happens when we get involved with a new civilization. The show didn't have the luxury of moving on to something else like nothing had ever happened. There were long lasting consequences that can be traced from episode one of season one all the way to the last episode of the series. This was also one of the only Star Trek series where the human characters weren't always the focal point of the story, which I think is very important to Star Trek because it shows that other races who are not human are fully capable of carrying the show. It's not a Star Trek show about how humanity is so special, it's a show about everyone in the galaxy. Even Sisko isn't above saying how humanity is flawed in many respects.

"On Earth, there is no poverty, no crime, no war. You look out the window of Starfleet Headquarters and you see paradise. Well, it's easy to be a saint in paradise, but the Maquis do not live in paradise. Out there in the Demilitarized Zone, all the problems haven't been solved yet. Out there, there are no saints — just people. Angry, scared, determined people who are going to do whatever it takes to survive, whether it meets with Federation approval or not!"

Picard on the other hand will be more than happy to spout out lines from Shakespear about how humanity might one day become... and I'm not kidding here.... Gods!

"What a piece of work is man! How noble in reason! How infinite in faculty. In form, in moving, how express and admirable. In action, how like an angel. In apprehension, how like a god. I see us one day becoming that"

And that line from Hamlet was meant as sarcasm.
:facepalm

Yeah, TNG can keep it's self-entitled smugness.

 

[Jeyl]

Ehhhh....I don't know about "The Best" but it was certainly better than TOS or TNG. My vote is still on Voyager for this one.

Two words. Harry Kim. When you look at his track record, he starts the series as an Ensign.... and ends the series as an Ensign. In Deep Space Nine, we have a young Ferengi named Nog joins Starfleet in DS9's fourth year, and by season seven is made a Lieutenant. Yes, Janeway is more than happy to reduce Tom Paris in rank from Lieutenant to Ensign in one episode, and promote him back to Lieutenant seasons later. But Harry Kim? He always remains an ensign.

You know something isn't right on your ship when your seven year seasoned officer who has died in the line of duty on more than one occasion.... will be taking orders from a four year seasoned Ferengi.

 

[Jeyl]

I didn't think Janeway was as bad as people make her out to be. I think it took her until about half way through the third season to find her footing, but after that I thought she was pretty good. True, she wasn't a Picard or a Sisko, but I thought she filled the role very well.

The issue I have with Janeway is that she doesn't come off as a character who goes through any kind of meaningful growth. She just is. If you look at Sisko and Picard, you see a monumental character growth from their first season depictions all the way to the last. Picard is no longer a smug or child hating person, and Sisko is promoted to Captain and earns the respect of many of his alien comrades. Janeway starts out as the Captain who we must all follow orders from, and that is it. She commands respect, but doesn't really do anything that is respectful. Most of her justifications in doing things always boils down to rank and rank alone.

*When she orders the array destroyed even though there are numerous other ways of doing it that won't leave the crew stranded*
Torres: Who does she think she is to make a decision like that for all of us?
Chakotay: She's the captain.

*When Paris suggests warning a planet's population that will be destroyed in just days*
Janeway: You have no idea what the consequences will be.
Paris: Anything's got to be better than mass destruction!
Janeway: You are not to warn these people. That's an order.

No discussion, no reasoning and no common sense. Her holy bible is the prime directive, and nothing about it is ever wrong. An entire planet's population might die? Let them. If there's one thing that's worse than mass destruction, it's the thought of this human created rule book might be wrong. Because as humanity's history and Star Trek history has shown, humanity is NEVER EVER WRONG in anything, especially when it comes to it's rules and conduct! The only downside to Janeway's orders to allow this civilization to die is that it wasn't three civilizations. I know deep down she wants to beat Archer's record of allowing two whole civilizations to die.

 

[Treadwell]

That's a nice way of saying "she got fired for posing nude in Playboy. :lol

Not so sure about that. It was one of those "we had these pics on file so let's exploit someone who recently became famous" situations. She didn't run out and do it after getting the TNG gig.

 

[MooCriket]

I still feel that Stewart has eclipsed all as the best Captain. I will say, if you have not watched "in the pale moon light" from DS9, you are doing yourself a huge disservice. On of the best DS9 episodes. Avery Brooks really gives a fantasic performance, and it is a great story.

 

[SSgt Burton]

Picard on the other hand will be more than happy to spout out lines from Shakespear about how humanity might one day become... and I'm not kidding here.... Gods!

"What a piece of work is man! How noble in reason! How infinite in faculty. In form, in moving, how express and admirable. In action, how like an angel. In apprehension, how like a god. I see us one day becoming that"

And that line from Hamlet was meant as sarcasm.
:facepalm

Yeah, TNG can keep it's self-entitled smugness.

Wow. Talk about removing the context of a statement completely to put your own spin on it. :rolleyes

(For those who might not know...)

That monologue was from a verbal joust with Q who just so happened to be holding Picard's "The Complete Works of Shakespeare" book. Before that quote Picard himself said, "What Hamlet says with irony, I say with conviction." Meaning that Man is not the scurrying, self-centered, dim-witted animal that Q would like to believe and prove with his test of Riker. He also said it to "throw it in Q's face" that one day Man may obtain the Omnipotence that the Q already have. Picard won the arguement.



Kevin

 

[Jeyl]

That monologue was from a verbal joust with Q who just so happened to be holding Picard's "The Complete Works of Shakespeare" book. Before that quote Picard himself said, "What Hamlet says with irony, I say with conviction." Meaning that Man is not the scurrying, self-centered, dim-witted animal that Q would like to believe and prove with his test of Riker. He also said it to "throw it in Q's face" that one day Man may obtain the Omnipotence that the Q already have. Picard won the arguement.

Moments later in that exact same episode.

Riker: I could have saved that girl.
Picard: You were right not to try.

Yep. Totally not self-centered or dim-witted at all. A clear sign that humanity has evolved into something better when we give praise for not saving a child's life.

And after all those years and all those episodes where Picard tried to prove to Q that humanity is not what he thinks they are..... Q wins the argument. And the thing that brings Picard to his senses is not humanity's evolved sense of right and wrong or it's rising to the level of omnipotence, but a human refugee from a point in Earth's history that Picard continuously chastised.