ghostryder
Legendary Member
Oh man that's awesome...
Star Trek Into Darkness (Post-release)
- Thread starter Vivek
- Start date
nickytea
Master Member
This actually brings up an important point: most of Khan's backstory that's being critiqued here is openly deceptive in its presentation.
But I guess it's not surprising that Jeyl, ironically, doesn't know what an "unreliable narrator" is.
Admiral Marcus had a model of the Vengeance displayed in his bloody office. You're not really doing a good job at keeping it a secret from Starfleet personnel if you have it displayed. And again, why couldn't Harrison just beam onto the Vengeance if he knew the exact coordinates with his transporter device?
Y'know, your point was made with the first part of the post. There was no need for the second part.
If you want a good laugh regarding someone's hilariously faulty logic in arguing, I have a link for you. As an aside, the thread started out as a debate over who Gene Roddenberry would rather kill for "crimes against Star Trek." The choices were Berman & Braga (for Voyager) or JJ Abrams (for Star Trek). There was one guy by the name of 3D Master who was rather... passionate... about his beliefs and refused to back down despite all of his arguments getting shredded. One of his first arguments was that JJ Abrams' Star Trek was a racist film because... brace yourself... Sulu used a katana. It only got worse from there (My own responses are under the name "Eagle One").
Here's the link, conveniently set to his first post in the thread (WARNING: NSFW for language):
One pissed off Roddenberry, two buttons, and three potential victims | Page 2 | SpaceBattles.com
MooCriket
Master Member
HahahahahHahHHa! That was an epic read! Thank you good Sir!
Nickytea, I would appreciate it very much that you stop making derogative comments about me in this thread. I came in here to talk about Star Trek Into Darkness, not to be the target of openly snide comments.
And yet there's really nothing in the film that refutes their points. Khan says Marcus is using Kirk, Marcus says Khan is using Kirk. Both are right. Khan says that Marcus is a bad man. He was right. Marcus says that Khan is a bad man. He is also right. Marcus calls Khan a war criminal. Doesn't sound very deceptive when you see Khan commit to acts of murder and city wide destruction. I'm really not seeing how either character is "unreliable" in describing the back stories of each other.
Plot Induced Stupidity?
He wanted his crew far more than he wanted the Vengeance. The more I think about it, the more I believe that he deliberately did what he did to put himself into a position where he could take control again. Given that he would have his men AND the most powerful ship in Starfleet, and that the Federation would be in all out war with the Klingons (thanks to the Enterprise being caught in Klingon space), Starfleet would be too busy to deal with him. Khan would then be free to do whatever he liked, from settling a planet to teaming up with the Federation to fight the Klingons. Given what we know of Khan, the second option seems more likely, as it would make Khan a war hero, and the people would embrace him, paving the way for him to rule again and to start his campaign of genocide.
It wasn't until he believed that Starfleet had killed his fellow super-people that he really flew into a rage and targeted Starfleet headquarters. If that was his goal all along, he could have very easily done it from orbit, and the Enterprise wouldn't have been able to do a thing about it.
ghostryder
Legendary Member
...and why the hell didn't Nero just warn Romulus after he went back in time 
Felgacarb
Sr Member
Yikes- That pretty much totally nails it... good call.
nickytea
Master Member
I'd appreciate it if you hadn't tainted the last 5+ years of discussion here with your straw men arguments and complete lack of respect or acknowledgement for those that disagree with you; bending what is said to suit whatever you feel inclined to talk about, regardless of the flow of conversation.
At least you're being honest with yourself. You're here to talk. Not to have a discussion.
"I grow fatigued again."
Don't worry Jeyl; as it's clear my hopes of an elevated conversation here this time around were misplaced, you won't have to suffer any more comments from me, of any kind ... for the time being. Jeyl, you task me. You task me and I shall have you. I'll chase you 'round the moons of Nibia and 'round the Antares Maelstrom and 'round Perdition's flames before I give you up.
For the love of Zeus, BOTH of you shut up!
Astrokid248
Well-Known Member
Is there a way to eject the both of them from the thread? I'd like to discuss the film now.
OFF TOPIC: On the note about Sulu using a katana being racist: he has a point and yet he doesn't, because fencing does not work with a katana, but Sulu isn't using a katana anyways. He's using something known as a ninjato, which isn't really a historic weapon at all, in conjunction with some sort of very flippy martial art that isn't fencing. So maybe it's racist in that labelling a very complicated Japanese-inspired martial art "fencing" is ignoring a lot of facts about how martial arts evolved in both Asia and Europe, but it's honestly just as racist to label a straight-bladed sword a katana. Which is ignorant, not racist. So yeah. Nice try, but ultimately a fail.
I have a question. Who's bright idea was it to have hidden torpedo launchers on the Enterprise's secondary hull? They're not really making a persuasive argument against the militarization of Starfleet if this Enterprise has more weaponry on it than all the other previous Enterprise ships combined. What did they think that torpedo launcher on the neck and aft section of the ship was for? Can the Enterprise not fire those torpedoes in rapid succession or in a dispersal pattern? This was just overkill.
newworld
Sr Member
Saw it last night. What a piece of crap. If you liked it, good for you. I didn't and here's why:
Wrath of Dhan Prop Blog
Wrath of Dhan Prop Blog
Lost21stJedi
Well-Known Member
I personally do not have a problem with the Federation ships being more heavily armed than they were in TOS. Using ST09 as a starting point, they have faced bigger dangers than they originally had so it would make sense that their ships would have more offensive and defensive weapon systems.
IMHO, that doesn't necessarily make them more militaristic, just more cautious about what they will face exploring strange new worlds (provided of course they ever get around to doing that again).
IMHO, that doesn't necessarily make them more militaristic, just more cautious about what they will face exploring strange new worlds (provided of course they ever get around to doing that again).
Brent M
Sr Member
Never been a Star Trek fan, but loved the '09 film and thought this one was even better. It erased the sour taste in my mouth from the disappointment that was Iron Man 3.
I'm have very high hopes for JJ and what can do with Star Wars....hopefully he will succeed greatly at unf**king what Lucas ***ked up with the prequels.
I'm have very high hopes for JJ and what can do with Star Wars....hopefully he will succeed greatly at unf**king what Lucas ***ked up with the prequels.
Andy I think it's more about telling the story across different platforms like comics, film, games, etc and he couldn't do that because of the shared rights. I don't think it was about the cash.
I just found out that you can preorder the Bluray now from Amazon and it comes with a Qmx phaser. Might get this one.
Amazon.com: Star Trek Into Darkness Starfleet Phaser Limited Edition Gift Set (Blu-ray 3D Combo Pack): Chris Pine, Zachary Quinto, Zoe Saldana, Benedict Cumberbatch, Alice Eve, Karl Urban, Simon Pegg, Leonard Nimoy, Anton Yelchin, John Cho: Movies &
Similar threads
