Round 2 1/350 refit enterprise build tips/advice/quiet musings

Miketastic

Jr Member
HELLO EVERYONE!!

Considering the fact that I have hyjacked (unintentionally) a few posts with pics of my most recient Refit build, I thought I'd go ahead and start a thread on it. I have already finished it, but I'd just like to share my build process and offer some tips and advice to my fellow modlers who, like me, have struggled with this kits eccentricites (nacelle droop, gaps, etc) thanks for looking, and I'll offer any advice and lighting tips as well. I dont pretend to be any sort of expert, and what I did with my kit, may not nessisarally be "cannon" but here are my feelings on "exact screen replicas". What we see on movies, are a dramatic representation. sometimes things are exaggerated or omitted for cost, and/or to get a good shot. I paint my ships as close to the filming models as possible, but as far as effects goes, I tend to try to go with a compermise between what we saw on screen, and what would "logically" be functional. there were a LOT of things that they wanted to do but couldnt due to limitations in budget and technology at the time. I build ships that incorperate some of those ideas that were scrapped for whatever reasions. That said, dont bash on me too bad if you see something "non cannon". its just my perception of how it MIGHT be in real life. Ok, now that the disclamer is done, on to what my goals were for this ship...

I have bult two other 1/350 refits and were not happy with the results.

2005: the beginning. Ok, the first one was deffinitly a prototype, I used grain of wheat bulbs, all lights were steady on, no effects, not even nave/strobes, no azecing, no warp grille illumintion. But this build was just built to teach me how to build the kit, and figure out all the greeblies. hehe. i have no pictures of this ship, tragically, she was lost due to a little brother and a car accident( little brother was fine, ship was destroyed) so i built refit 2.0...

2008 try try agian: I bought the Round 2 version of this ship and found the stand set up FAR superior, even though the stand location made my desgine of rlighting the deflector impossible, but i found another way, no worries. This was my first go with LED's, I bought the VoodooFX light kit for this ship, all lights were cool white LEDs, still though, the only effects were navs and strobes. every other light was steady on, no deflector change, engine modes, or weapons, ect. I learned a valuble lesson in assembling the Engineering hull that i will go into later on, but this kit still exists. The little bro who destroyed the first one, porudly displays this one in his home. the first pics are of this ship.

2012 Ultimate Refit: Ok i figure its time to pull out ALL the stops.... the ship I am about to describe, is the ship that this post is about. the Ultimate Starship Enterprise Refit. This ship is the ship I grew up with. When she graced the screen on STTMP i was as awed as Admiral Kirk, When she was struck by Khan in STWOK, I was outraged, When she busted her way out of spacedock in STTSFS, to escape the indignity of decomission, I applauded, and lastly when she gave her life over the Genesis planet, "to turn death into a fighting chance to live" i cried. Of all the starships that have graced our screens and inspired our dreams of the future, to me shis ship was the most tangible and eligant, yet powerful looking. she was a graceful lady. but I digress... I wanted to build a kit that expressed these things. to have something that when you looked at it, made you FEEL the things you felt when you watched the movies. In this build, incorperated a deflector control circuit that also powered different engine modes( deflector fades from a rose-copper color to blue) impulse engine fade on and off( impulse crystal glows orange with impulse power "on" and then blue iin warp mode, off when deflecot is in rose-copper or "low power mode) warp engines fade on and off. and when deflector is in low power mode, all fourteen RCS thrusters, flicker on and off in a random-ish pattern to simulate "station keeping" I have torpedoe effects using two 1.8mm leds, wite and red. those have multiple modes too. mode 1: armed( both tubes just glow red. mode 2: single fire. red tube ramps up, quickly followed by a white led "fire" strobe. mode3: battle mode: the torpeoes fire in a quick spread alternating right and left at different speeds for about 1 minute. and ofcoures yo ucan just have the red tubes off for "condition green" I incorperated a chasing landing light circut as well. But the real fun was incorperating the option of only having the interior lights on. no spot lights, no navi/stobes, engines, weapons, just interior lighting. just like we saw her in spacedock. incase i ever get a wild hair and build a 1/350 spacedock... wink wink nod nod...

anyway ill post updates on what i did to build this ship and add pics and answer any questions you guys/gals might have. I love my hobby and have been building models since i was 5 yesrs old( im 31) Like i said, i dont even much pretend to be any sort of expert,just a humble styrene junkie. the pics you seeon this post are from the enterprise i built in 2008 first, just as a refernce to the 2012 one.

thank you for reading my book haha!! always remember to enjoy your hobbie, for if you dont, then its stops being a hobbie :D
Michael

This is the 2008 ship, notice the round2 aztec deacls and incorrect color of strong backs...
1701 159.jpg
 
1701 044.jpg1701 053.jpg1701 018.jpg1701 055.jpg1701 056.jpgOk now on to the 2012 ship... I used the paragraphix photoetch parts as well as the DLM resin impulse part. much better than stock impulse deck here are some pics of what goes into a starship...
 
1701 064.jpg1701 071.jpg1701 073.jpg1701 075.jpgNext up was the engineering hull. now this section seems easy and straightforward enough, but dont be fooled ladies and gents... your entire model is hinged upon you assembling this seciton JUST SO. I'm sure if youve played arround with this kit, youve noticed the gaps between the pyon edges where the top and sides of the engineering hull (e-hull) go togehter. these are a HUGE warning if youre not aware... if you just leave those to "putty" in later, then i promise you, your ship wil have about a 1/4 inch nacelle "droop" as well as a 2 degree droop in the Saucer section (S-hull) but there IS a solution, And i have to give Mr. Boyd from Trekmoddler on youtube the credit for this. first step is to make sure, very very sure, that no paint is in any trenches where the E-hull bottom, sides, or top fits together. this is KEY. I lightblocked my E-hull on the outside even to make sure these parts stayed clean and cleaned off any overspray with some acetone. next, Boyds construction method is a little "unorthodox" and might seem backwars, but trust me, it works! first, where the pylons go into the E-hull top and sides, you will see two little "guide tabs" shave off about 1/8 inch (2-3mm) or so off the top of the tabs, leave just enough to make the holes of the pylons flush with the tabs. the reason you need to do this is because the tabs are TOO LONG, and help cause the nacelle gap. that gap not only is a pain to putty up, but it cuts down on the structural intregrity of the nacell mount and cause the nacelle weight to be hinged on the guide pins INSTEAD of the E-hull like its supposed to. the pins can not take the weight, so you get nacell sag first, then cracking seems next, then one day the model will just fall apart... seriously!! now to maximize structual intregity, build your E-hull in this order... first you glue the sides of the E-hull together to the bottom and place in a jig to keep the sides straight. WITHOUT THE SHUTTLE BAY OR ARBORIUM. appply a liberal amount of glue on the INSIDE of the E-hull along the seam wher the sides meet the bottom. let this dry for 24 hours. once it cures, this part becomes ONE, trust me, you can NOT seperate them. next, glue in your completed Arborium and slowly, carefully slide in your shuttle bayover the first bridge tab, carfully pulling sides apart to give you clearance to slide over ther rear bridge tab. i does work. its a B*&^ but it does work. (thats why you have to wait 24 hours between these two steps, stress from spresading sides can crack not cured glue) nex, have your WARP PYLONS already assembled, and wiring( if used) out both ends. and set them side down with upper e-hull and wire up whatever circuts/lights/ ect. then go ahead and glue on your assembled and wired NECK ont the upper E-hull. let this dry for 24 hours. once all assemblies are dry, go ahead and glue on the pylons to the TOP of the E-hull, and then glue the E-hull (quickly) to the sub-assembled lower Ehull. I let this dry for about three days before i removed any of the tape, and clamps. just to be sure. after that what you have folks is a fully assembled lower section that has the structuaral intregity to hold up the weight it was desgined to do! not to mention any added weaight of boards,wires, lights, hotglue, etc.
 
lookin good!

i would really like to build one of these with all the bells and whistles......lighting, photoetched parts, ect,ect. i dont know these kits that well, but ive been lookin around at the builds goin on here and you guys are doing some great work!

dumb question....but like i said i dont know these kits. is this the largest (styrene) model of the enterprise currently being made? at 1/350 seems like it would be very large. one day i will order one, and im sure i will have a million and 3 questions for everyone. if i do build one, i plan on doing alot of research to make it as "realistic" as i can....

keep up the awesome work!
cheers
bryan m
 
Do you have a link to an album of your finished build? Love to see it...

Also, I am currently looking for ideas on how to get an accurate look for the dome on the Lower Sensor Array.
So far this is what I have:
kgutd.jpg
 
Great work and insights so far sir! I will be following this thread as I also am in the middle of building the "A" version.

If you're interested 1701-A 2013 Photos by ColHero | Photobucket

Hi Colhero! thank you, and yes I have checked out your thread. the work youve done on your "A" is AMAZING! I'm great with electrical and construction, but do have some oppertunities to improve as far as final details go. But you sir, all I can say is WOW. You have the "A" color scheme spot on. and your dtails have a crisp clean look that I have trouble accomplishing. I'd love to get a few pointers from you on color selection and/or mixing. Awesomw job so far. I noticed you asked in another comment if i had a gallery of this ship completed, but no I dont yet. I only started this one to help other beginner modlers who want to try to tackle this ship, and try to avoid some of the traps that can mess one up later in the build. But ill post a lot of completed pics once i get done with the thread. I have a 1350 60's ship and a 1350 NX also coming down the pipe.... eventually haha thanks again sir. a complement coming from an obvious artist such as you is very appreciated!!
 
Do you have a link to an album of your finished build? Love to see it...

Also, I am currently looking for ideas on how to get an accurate look for the dome on the Lower Sensor Array.
So far this is what I have:
http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee230/ColHero/1701-A 2013/kgutd.jpg

I see what you mean, I have noticed the inaccurate piece, but havent attempted to tackle it myself. however it CAN be done. juts take a lot of sanding around the spot light housings to get the vents "shallow-er" as well as on the dome by the "tabs"/ then using either a scribe or sharp hobby knife, trim both the tabs and the forward light housing vents to the proper shapes, now on the dome, that would be the real challenge, you can do this one of two ways, you can contour putty the existing scribe lines and sand, or you can just sand, I would apply a light coat of putty over the line and sand. then go to hobby lobby or any place where they sell drafting equipment, and get a circle stensil, it has like 50 different sizes of circle stensils from 2mm on up to like 1 1/2" use that to mark the new ones and lightly scribe on the new details, but since in the pic from the filming model shows, the circles are very shallow, so you wouldnt want to scribe too deep. there is a modler who did this before. he posted his build on the culttvman.com website. under the enterprise section, or maybe the "on the bench" section, but this guy went so far as to mark amd measure ever little discrepency that the PL 1350 kit had comparing to the studio model. and he documented every detail. theres like 9 pages of infor of what he did to acurize his kit, just like you are doing. I cant remember his name for the llife of me, but check out that site. also im sure you know the impulse engines are TERRIBLE in the 1350 kit. i got the DLM resin upgraded impulse engines. oh what a difference that made!! great build, and thanks again!!
 
lookin good!

i would really like to build one of these with all the bells and whistles......lighting, photoetched parts, ect,ect. i dont know these kits that well, but ive been lookin around at the builds goin on here and you guys are doing some great work!

dumb question....but like i said i dont know these kits. is this the largest (styrene) model of the enterprise currently being made? at 1/350 seems like it would be very large. one day i will order one, and im sure i will have a million and 3 questions for everyone. if i do build one, i plan on doing alot of research to make it as "realistic" as i can....

keep up the awesome work!
cheers
bryan m


Thank you very much Brian!!

thats the point of me making this thread, just to share my insites of this kit and help beginners (to this kit) overcome some traps and challenges.

to answer your question, ( not dumb at all, no such thing) no this is not the biggest kit on the market. The deboer hull's 46" Enterprise refit/A kit is the biggest that i am aware of, but its not styrene, its resin if memory serves. they also are developing a Reliant to scale with the 46" Refit. should be fun..
 
thanks for the info mike, i have worked with resin before, but dont exactly care for it. it can be a huge pain at times. ive been building scale automotive/truck stuff for a long time, and ive used a few resin conversion bodies and wasnt enthused with it........styrene is alot more forgiving, and easier to work with, so when i do get to the enterprise (eventually) im gonna stick with a styrene kit. just because its what i know, and can work with the easiest. 1/350 is plenty big for me.

ill be watchin your build, and a bunch of others, gathering reference and info along the way so when i do mine i can pour all of that into it. keep up the good work!
cheers
bryan
 
oh i forgot to ask........where can i find the best refrence material on the enterprise?

thanks in advance
cheers
bryan m
 
Im really not too huge a fan of resin either. I had a bad experience a few years back on a large resin Jupiter 2 kit. but to be fair, Im not sure how much difficulty was with the resin kit, as much as my inexperience with resin kits to begin with. Im thinking of getting one, but i hear they are pretty pricy. Ive heard as much as 3-4 times the polar lights kit. thats a LOT to invest if one is not comfortable working with resin. I could very well be wrong, and if i am then anyone can please feel free to correct me, as i have only taken a passing glance at them. no worries :D i tend to stick to styrene myself. as far as refernce materials go, I get most of my lighting schemes and strobe/nav timing as well as deflector color from the films. but as far as still shots or info on the ship itself, Id say check out the post on culttvman.com i mentioned above, i need to go on there and get the link, but it should be easy to find, its in the "on the bench section" that guy goes into EXTREEME detail on not only acurate dimensions of the parts, but also colors and aztecing. you can also check out youtube and subscribe to Mr. Simon Mercs or TrekWorks. both are great guys who do a HUGE amount of 1350 refit kits. they also discuss and explain the aztec pattern and colors for all versions of the ship (star trek 1, star trek 2, as well as the "A" version) in star trek 2 ILM took over the special effects and painted over much of the star trek 1 aztec pattern. Also if you are doing the A version, you can check out the Christie's auction website as they reciently sold the filming model as well as other props. they took a HUGE amount of pics. but this would only be good for the A version. the colors were slightly different between the Refit and A. they had to repaint all that HORRIBLY innacurate dramitic "battle damage" from star trek 3 haha. I think ILM did both star trek 3 and 4. some other company did 5 and they trashed the model, but ILM did do 6 and fixed everything. so you might try ILM's webiste maybe too. I got my info from youtube and just random pics i could colect from google searches. like I said earlier, mine isnt EXACTLY what the studio model was, but I wasnt striving for that level of perfection, this time haha. I guess that means ill be doing another one in the next few years... i keep seeing others amazing work and saying to myself, " why didnt I do that??" haha
 
Thanks for the compliments Mike and keep up your own good work - which I wish I saw before I started work on my build... Im 3/4 done and am using the TrekModeller lighting. This is my first time seriously lighting a model and it has been a rocky learning experience!
 
Mike, have you got any pictures of how you managed to eliminate the panel gap and the potential nacelle drop? Its an issue I picked up on dry assembly of my kit and I can't quite visualise how shortening the retaining tabs solves the issue. I've sanded some styrene off of the pylon v connectors which has helped to reduce the panel gap slightly but I'm nervous of doing any more as I may weaken it.
 
You're very welcome Col, yes the lighting can be a challenge in itself. haha! The problem is, there are just so many ways to do some of the things seen on screen, and some things that were done on screen are impossible to replicate (some of the spots were actually achieved by an apparatus of one large light bulb and a bunch of dental mirrors... seriously) without either some creative light blocking or seriously modifying the kit. Also dispite the fact that this kit is pretty big, there really is not THAT much interior volume to work with. once you add in wiring and circuit boards, it can get tricky REAL quick... did you get ther trekmoddler kit with the light tubes or the updated one using LED tape? I swear by the tape. its so much easier to use and place, and if you spray a little satin coat over it, it gives the LEDS a wider more diffused "light arc" so you get more light" bouncing" without having to laod down the model with bulbs and excessive wiring. think of light as water, you want it to flow and spread, the more it can bounce arround in the kit (especially in the E-hull) the more AMBIANT light you get coming out of the portholes instead of just ports that look like spot lights. some peoples kits (not hating on them at all) look so bright that it looks like a JJ abrams production team went crazy... (lens flares hehe)
 
RossD no, unfortunatelly I did not take too many pics of that, but ill tell you what i can do, when I go home tonight Ill mock up some spare 1350 refit parts that i have lying around and take some pics of what I did. but ill try to describe it a little better right now too. Look at the E-hull top and sides, youll see the pylontabs, they have a sort of "stair step" desgin. what I did was to trim the top "stair" to where just about a milimeter is left of the top piece, the best way is to trim a little, fit the pylon, trim a little, fit the pylon. what you are trying to do, is to make the top "stair" be almost flush with the guide holes of the pylon. I had the same fear of weakening that joint, but it doesnt, the removal of plastic allows that joit to almost close completely, which allows the glue to seal this properly and the weight of the pylon and nacelle goes on the once gapped strut mount, insted of the pylon tabs. sicne the E-hull has a tighter fit around the pylons, it makes the pylons more secure. they dont move. At all. but the real key too is to make TOTALLY sure you remove any and ALL paint from any seam or glueing surface. that way the gue can make the molecular bond to the styrene. this can not happen of the styrene is covered in glue. and without that strong bond, the structure cant take the weight. but anyways, when I get home tonight Ill mock that up and take a few pics for you. Id post it tonight, but we just moved and I havent gotten my cable and internet switched on yet. :-/
 
thanks again for the info mike......im gathering reference now, on this and also the sulaco. i wanna build something, the enterprise is a sure thing, i will build it. but id like to do some scratchbuilding as well. i love to build from scratch. so now i have 2 new folders, that will be over flowing with reference!

cheers
bryan
 
Sorry I haven't gotten you those pics yet Ross, been busy at work. I mocked up an extra E-hull just now and have been tryig to upload the pics from my tablet, but AT&T is living up to it's repitubal stellar service and won't let me. So bare with me, I'll have you some pics in the morning :)

- - - Updated - - -

Anytime Brian, as always, I'm happy to help. :)
 
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