original ending for Return of the Jedi ? HUH?
- Thread starter nwjedidave
- Start date
Solo4114
Master Member
I don't think it's a turd. I mean, come on, it's infinitely better than TPM. THAT'S a turd.
I do, however, think that the film could have ended with a "happily ever after" style ending without descending into infantile shenanigans or insane merchandising efforts.
My vision basically would be that you replace Ewoks with Wookiees. You could still set up the cutesy kiddo wookiees who maybe start out looking like Ewoks, and thereby preserve your plush doll line and future TV specials. Hell, maybe you lift the concept from the old Marvel Comics that, like the Lahsbees/Huhks, Wookiees undergo a radical physical transformation around puberty. Anyway, you have the Wookiees be used as slave labor to construct the Death Star and/or shield facilities (which would be more than just a single bunker and a dish), and have some Wookiees leading resistance cells in the forests of their planet. You still get your Vietnam parallel, but without the improbabilities of cutesy bears turning out to be deadly warriors because NO. THAT IS WRONG AND STUPID.
Instead of 3PO being essential, you have Chewie being the essential one who convinces the escapees to fight with the rebellion instead of thinking only of themselves. At the end, Luke is a Jedi, Vader and the Emperor are dead, the Rebels have won, and the Wookiees have been freed from their tyrannical overlords. Same happy ending, much less infantile execution.
I do, however, think that the film could have ended with a "happily ever after" style ending without descending into infantile shenanigans or insane merchandising efforts.
My vision basically would be that you replace Ewoks with Wookiees. You could still set up the cutesy kiddo wookiees who maybe start out looking like Ewoks, and thereby preserve your plush doll line and future TV specials. Hell, maybe you lift the concept from the old Marvel Comics that, like the Lahsbees/Huhks, Wookiees undergo a radical physical transformation around puberty. Anyway, you have the Wookiees be used as slave labor to construct the Death Star and/or shield facilities (which would be more than just a single bunker and a dish), and have some Wookiees leading resistance cells in the forests of their planet. You still get your Vietnam parallel, but without the improbabilities of cutesy bears turning out to be deadly warriors because NO. THAT IS WRONG AND STUPID.
Instead of 3PO being essential, you have Chewie being the essential one who convinces the escapees to fight with the rebellion instead of thinking only of themselves. At the end, Luke is a Jedi, Vader and the Emperor are dead, the Rebels have won, and the Wookiees have been freed from their tyrannical overlords. Same happy ending, much less infantile execution.
Solo4114
Master Member
I think the phenomenon of hating on the ewoks comes more from my generation (I was 5 when it came out), and those who are younger. Basically, I thought it was great as a little kid, when I saw it in the theaters, and for years after on home video.
But when I revisited the films in my teenage years, and when I learned that they were originally conceived of as Wookiees, that was the point at which I felt like I'd been had, and I kinda wished we'd seen the Wookiee version. Which we kind of did in ROTS, and which was pretty awesome, actually.
I still generally enjoy the film, but I think it would've been improved with a slightly less "cutesy" approach.
RogueTrooper
Well-Known Member
Who knows what GL was thinking, but I'm going with the Kurtz angle..........dumb the film down several notches for the sake of toy sales. George is smart cookie
Solo4114
Master Member
I wouldn't even go so far as to say it was "dumbed down," exactly. It was made somewhat more infantile with the inclusion of the Ewoks. Otherwise, it was basically just a space fairy tale. The villainous sorcerer is slain, the corrupted father redeemed by the unconditional love of his son, the heroes triumphant, the end. I don't think that type of story is dumb by any stretch of the imagination. I just think that the particular execution in this case -- with the Ewoks -- was kind of infantile. Even so, it still mostly holds up. The space battle is awesome. The Jabba's palace sequence is cool, too. Luke's duel with Vader is appropriately climactic, as is his near-defeat by the Emperor. Honestly, I think if all you do is swap the ewoks out for more convincing warriors, you've basically got a solid wrapup to a fairy tale.
While it's pointless for me to initiate a TPM vs RotJ discussion I must say that TPM wasn't as violently offensive to me as RotJ was.
I recognize my opinion isn't universally appreciated and I accept that.
TPM wasn't completely awful (there were glimpses of cool stuff) but, to me, RotJ is a pile of poo poo.
I was 8 (and a half) when ROTJ came out. I remember my impressions at the time. It felt like Star Wars again... mostly. The first act I remember being alternately engaging and boring. I wondered why there was a dental drill among the Tydirium's controls. The Ewoks looked fake. Vader looked too shiny. Han grabbed Leia's boob. I loved the music (even Yub Nub). But I utterly fell in love with the Biker Scouts and Emperor's Guards and TIE Interceptors and B-Wings. That last skewed my overall rating of the film for quite a while until I realized I just liked elements, but the overall execution was off.
Later still, I realized it suffered most from George's Star Wars fatigue. He went from "if we keep making a film every three years, we'll have the saga finished by the year 2000 [note this was back in the "twelve episodes" days]" on one side of ROTJ to "I don't want to spend the rest of my life doing Star Wars, so I'm ending it here" on the other. So it ended up being four films crammed into one, with no single included story point getting the proper organic development and resolution it needed.
--Jonah
Later still, I realized it suffered most from George's Star Wars fatigue. He went from "if we keep making a film every three years, we'll have the saga finished by the year 2000 [note this was back in the "twelve episodes" days]" on one side of ROTJ to "I don't want to spend the rest of my life doing Star Wars, so I'm ending it here" on the other. So it ended up being four films crammed into one, with no single included story point getting the proper organic development and resolution it needed.
--Jonah
Dessa
Sr Member
I was barely a year old when RotJ came out. I probably first "saw" it when I was 3 or 4. And by "saw," I mean my parents called me out to watch the Ewoks when they were on screen. Other than the Ewok scenes, my only exposure to anything Star Wars was the Ewok cartoon and the 2 Ewok movies (which are STILL my favorite Star Wars movies). I didn't see a full SW movie until I was in high school, and it was RotJ. I had no knowledge of anything else from the series. I did watch the first two movies after that, and I did see the Special Editions and prequels in theaters, but meh. I love RotJ, I love the ending of RotJ, and the Ewoks and Ewok movies are still and always will be my favorite thing from Star Wars. Well, that and some of the early EU books. And no, I have no intention of touching anything that Disney puts out, because I refuse to ignore the EU.
More power to ya, Dessa!
I have never thought the Ewoks' cuteness was a problem. Not on principle anyway. If you want non-cute animals the first 1/3rd of the movie is packed full of them.
If the Ewoks weren't tough enough, that's a different issue. There are some cute/harmless looking animals in real life that could rip your face off & eat it. IMO the problem with the Ewoks was that they did too much damage to the Imperials while their actions were portrayed as too harmless.
That, and the Ewoks just got too much screen time in general. They were originally supposed to share the screen with tall gangly "Yuzzums" (costumed guys walking on stilts) but the Yuzzums were later axed for practicality and photographic concerns. That likely ended up giving the Ewoks more screen time than originally intended.
Han grabbed Leia's boob? I didn't remember that.
If the Ewoks weren't tough enough, that's a different issue. There are some cute/harmless looking animals in real life that could rip your face off & eat it. IMO the problem with the Ewoks was that they did too much damage to the Imperials while their actions were portrayed as too harmless.
That, and the Ewoks just got too much screen time in general. They were originally supposed to share the screen with tall gangly "Yuzzums" (costumed guys walking on stilts) but the Yuzzums were later axed for practicality and photographic concerns. That likely ended up giving the Ewoks more screen time than originally intended.
Han grabbed Leia's boob? I didn't remember that.
robn1
Master Member
Last edited by a moderator:
Nope. You can practically see Harrison realize he's just grabbed her by her supposedly injured arm, let go, and try to figure out where to put his hand. He almost certainly thought the director would call him on grabbing her arm and they'd have to do another take...
--Jonah
--Jonah
"There is a shortage of perfect breasts in this world. 'Twould be a pity to damage yours."
--Jonah
--Jonah
madmikeee
Sr Member
I can counter your saying it wasn't a turd with one phrase. "FRACKING EWOKS!" (Edited for the virgin ears)
Hell I CHEERED every time an Ewok Died when I first saw the movie...and I was frikkin 12. Simply put Lucas just plain SUCKS as a director and refused to actually listen to anyone else. I do like your idea of replacing the space bears with Wookies though, THAT would have made a HUGE difference. Not only in the battle scenes but to learn a little about Chewies species.
Similar threads
