Music Today: What happened? (Short Rant)

[Curmudgeon]

There's still plenty of good music out there, you just have to look a bit harder to find it.

Although it is frustrating to see the kind of things that are popular now..

 

[pengbuzz]

I don't know that it's an age thing now.

There was a time when to make it in music you had to have actual musical talent. Today, not so much. As noted above it's all about marketing and 'who you can sell'. If you're not attractive and you can't dance, you're odds of being signed are substantially lower. Hell, Milli Vanilli couldn't sing, period. They lip synced so someone else's voice, but they were signed, sold, and popular because of their looks and marketing.

Music would be better off frankly if it still just an audio format. Sadly to sell music, you have to have a visual component. Not sure what since 95% of all my music listening is done in the car or at work where there's absolutely no visual component at all.

Looks should have nothing to do with it. If you buy a CD or mp3 or whatever because the singer is hot, you're completely missing the point of music.

If the big blow up over Milli Vanilli had happened nowadays, it would have died in 5 minutes and they would still be performing and have their Grammys.

Foe me: if the lyrics stink, I will NOT like a song no matter how good a beat or how awesome. There are still songs today I won't listen to because of the lyrics.

 

[Laspector]

I wish rap would vanish a bit,

I wish it would vanish completely. God, I hate it--all of it!!! I remember when it first started, man I was hoping it would just be like disco and be a passing fad.

 

[rodneyfaile]

To be honest, the argument about 'actual instruments' puts me off. I wrote this on my tumblr not to long ago about that.

I used to be this pretentious ass who said music was only made with real instruments. So hardstyle, hardcore, trance and anything techno was fake music. I only listened metal, rock, numetal etc.

Oh how naive of me. I listen to all kinds of music now. From funk and jazz, to hardcore and hartstyle, hardrock and heavy metal. Every once in a while also rap.

You see… Music isn’t just made with instruments. Music isn’t just made with computers. MY DEFINITION of music has changed entirely. My definition of music is a rhythm, a beat, a sound. A composition of sounds and rhythm that makes me feel something, whether it is rage, energy, happiness or sadness. Music makes me feel. I can merge to the beat and dance all day Music is just that. No matter what it is created with, if it makes me feel something, then it is good.

And this is why I can enjoy Vivaldi and the Defqon.1 festival right next to eachother. (although it’s not the best combination.)



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You are right. I do like Daft Punk, Vangelis, and others. What I intended to say is I prefer music that actually contains music. A lot of what I hear from many big names sounds very simplistic. No depth or complexity at all, in the lyrics or musical composition. Frankly, there just isn't much to listen to.

 

[pengbuzz]

I wish it would vanish completely. God, I hate it--all of it!!! I remember when it first started, man I was hoping it would just be like disco and be a passing fad.

Just put a "c" in front of it, and you'll feel better....

 

[The Mad Professor]

What I want is to get a mess of vintage jazz and classical vinyls and play them on an old Victrola. Something about the tinny sound of a gramophone is just perfect to my ears.

 

[Axlotl]

I made it a point to expose my niece and nephew to good music from the time they were babies (I have no kids of my own).
They're HUGE fans of They Might Be Giants - bigger than me, even. Sing their songs constantly - know them all by heart.
Now they're teenagers.
Now my niece likes One Direction.
After supplying her with a lifetime of good music, and giving her all the tools she needs to identify and appreciate good music, she suddenly decided she likes One Direction because her friend likes One Direction.
I practically exploded like a volcano when she told me that.

What can you do? Kids will be kids. They're going to listen to crappy music just to **** us off.

*edit: And there is still good music being made. You just have to look for it. For instance, this happened a year ago this week:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6oXJus1ajIU

 

[The Mad Professor]

I made it a point to expose my niece and nephew to good music from the time they were babies (I have no kids of my own).
They're HUGE fans of They Might Be Giants - bigger than me, even. Sing their songs constantly - know them all by heart.
Now they're teenagers.
Now my niece likes One Direction.
After supplying her with a lifetime of good music, and giving her all the tools she needs to identify and appreciate good music, she suddenly decided she likes One Direction because her friend likes One Direction.
I practically exploded like a volcano when she told me that.

What can you do? Kids will be kids. They're going to listen to crappy music just to **** us off.

See, my response would have been something like this:

Niece: I like One Direction.
Me: That's okay sweetie. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, even if they are wrong.

 

[Solo4114]

The problem with modern music is it has too many notes.

Oh, hello, Emperor Leopold!

If the big blow up over Milli Vanilli had happened nowadays, it would have died in 5 minutes and they would still be performing and have their Grammys.

See, I actually wonder how that'd play out today. The issue with Milli Vanilli wasn't that they didn't write their own stuff. It was that they literally did not sing a note of it. It wasn't even as if they recorded in the studio and lip-synched live, which pretty much everyone does nowadays (particularly the people who do big dance numbers, or at least they overlay their natural voice with the studio version and some production magic from the booth). But those guys were just...faces. Faces associated with music recorded by other people and written by other people.

I think today, people would react similarly. What would be different is if, for example, someone let the unaltered feed go out from a live performance by XYZ popular act, instead of the manipulated version. That and if raw feed from the studio got out and proved that so and so couldn't sing AT ALL. I think even under those circumstances, modern audiences just wouldn't care that much, as long as it was in the person's actual voice.

Foe me: if the lyrics stink, I will NOT like a song no matter how good a beat or how awesome. There are still songs today I won't listen to because of the lyrics.

I'm mostly the opposite, actually. I LOVED Guns 'n' Roses, even as a kid. I remember my mom saying "Have you listened to the lyrics of this song?! This guy's a racist *******!" My response was "Oh, I know he is. But I'm in it for the guitars." That's within reason, of course. Plus, with One in a Million, you could argue that, no, Axl was making fun of racists, rather than agreeing with them.

I made it a point to expose my niece and nephew to good music from the time they were babies (I have no kids of my own).
They're HUGE fans of They Might Be Giants - bigger than me, even. Sing their songs constantly - know them all by heart.
Now they're teenagers.
Now my niece likes One Direction.
After supplying her with a lifetime of good music, and giving her all the tools she needs to identify and appreciate good music, she suddenly decided she likes One Direction because her friend likes One Direction.
I practically exploded like a volcano when she told me that.

What can you do? Kids will be kids. They're going to listen to crappy music just to **** us off.

*edit: And there is still good music being made. You just have to look for it. For instance, this happened a year ago this week:
in another way - m b v - my bloody valentine - YouTube

I don't think kids do this to irritate their elders. I think they do it to maintain social connections with their less discerning friends. That's part of being a kid, especially a tween or teenager: conforming to the herd while figuring out your own identity. All of which is why being a teenager sucks so much.

As long as she has the foundation in good stuff and still likes that, it won't really matter what else she takes on down the road. She'll never completely abandon the good stuff. And the faddy stuff will come and go and come again when it's resurrected 20 years later for the kitsch factor.

 

[kialna]

And yet, you can't force music down a kids throat. Eventually they will find a style they love on their own. And will keep discovering. I went from top 40 to trance, bon jovi-pop rock like stuff. Then to numetal. Powermetal, rock, modern rock, classic rock, classic metal, grunge, industrial metal, industrial techno, ebm, hardcore, hardstyle, hard trance, and along the way I picked up some soundtracks, jazz, funk, dance, indie-rock, etc.

Forcing a style on a kid is WRONG. They have their own lives and their own choices. You can only influence them so much. And you can question whether that's okay or not. If they start loving something for the wrong reasons, it won't last long. If they genuinely enjoy it; so be it. But never tell them their choice of music style is wrong, because different people like different things.

In already too many things parents try to force their own ideas and dreams on their kids, to become what they could not, so to let kids do their own music choice is a first step in letting them go and get their own lives.


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[pengbuzz]

True, kialna. While I wouldn't force something down another person's throat, I personally don't like rap.

 

[Werstrooper]

I did have some advice on how to find good new music but I deleted as it will only fall on deaf ears.

some pathetic opinions ITT.

 

[pengbuzz]

I did have some advice on how to find good new music but I deleted as it will only fall on deaf ears.

some pathetic opinions ITT.

Actually, I'd say some good ones. Just because you disagree does not mean they're "poor", anymore than your advice would necessarily "fall on deaf ears" because we hold opinions you do not agree with.

 

[Wes R]

You can only hope that the kids get their heads out of the sand as they get older and learn to like stuff that's older than them.

 

[kialna]

I just wonder why that's necessary. Not from an ignorant point of view. But them not liking older music doesn't mean they're bad people. If you judge people just on music taste, then really, what are you doing?
I will say something that will make people mad here.

I dislike Queen. I dislike Bohemian Rhapsody.

There I said it.

But I have my reasons why, and they include the following: It doesn't grasp me. It never did. They are 'too soft'. And I have been bombarded with the song ever since I was little and I got really, really sick of hearing it. I hear it EVERY YEAR as it tops the top 2000 list. And it pisses me off.

HOWEVER! All that doesn't mean, that I do not understand it is a great piece of music, which was very influential and has very interesting changes in style, and combinations of styles, which at the time, were new and revolutionary. I know people appreciate it because it IS a piece worth of respect. And there you have it. I don't LIKE it. But I RESPECT it.

Why is it so hard to respect people who like other music than you do? Because they are a different generation? And it hurts your ears? I don't know man, I stopped judging people for music a long time ago. It makes you look like a pretentious arse and music will forever change. Will there be classics from this era that will be played just as much and as long as the pieces from the 70's, 80's, and sometimes even 60's? Who knows, we will see in 20 years.

I admit that I haven't heard a lot of songs from the 90's and 00's return to the radio yet, but then again, I never listen to the top2000, and I just keep it with my itunes list and look at my last.fm recommendations.

 

[Mr Fett]

I know nothing about modern day Bieber pop music and have always hated rap. Honestly, 98% of all music I've chosen to listen to SINCE the 1980s has continuously been '80s Hair Bands.

 

[Jsimon999]

I think the problem is two fold: 1) our sabotaged education system which is turning out less than properly educated and literate students and, 2) corporatism that took over the music business in the early 80's.

I've listened to or read many an article where classic artists like Billy Joel, Elton John, Sting, Hall and Oates, The Eagles, etc. all said that in their careers they had many albums to find their sound and style. Record companies used to nurture and invest in developing hundreds of artists on their rosters. Today, they have a handful they concentrate on and they have one album, or maybe one song to re-coup that investment. If it misses, they're done and gone. The record companies no longer gamble. They have shareholders and quarterly statements to satisfy now.

Artists of yesterday, by and large, used to write and record and perform their own music. Today, there are "artists" with large teams behind them that we don't see who are essentially the real talent. The talent stables put together, by and large, only proven formulas. The songs are not allowed to deviate much from the formula. What we are left with is, to be kind, what we have today.

Finally, take a look at the youth today. I work for a number of people who have kids around 13-17. Very few kids are interested in a literate understandable song. Many would bust through walls to get out of a room that was playing a song that you had to think about. They want a hypnotic, droning ball of non-sense that requires no thought at all. And kids who listen to rap music are going to be mostly unemployable and eventually wind up in trouble since they cannot communicate properly with the rest of society.

I heard it said once that the sign of a healthy society can be seen in the quality of it's art and artists. Well, if that's true I think we're in some trouble.

Jon

 

[MFP 2020]

You guys made me think of this.

 

[AdamNightmare]

Threads like this one make me genuinely question the value of being a part of the RPF. What I used to consider to be a welcoming, interesting group of talented individuals seems to continually surprise me with it's ability to devolve into a close-minded group of old fogies, hell-bent on having the world return to the "good ol' days" of their youth, completely disconnected from the world around them. Perhaps that's why there's so much love for a group of movies that are now older than most of the users on this site, and such vitriol spit at any that are new or different. It makes me sick to my stomach that there isn't a week that goes by that there isn't another thread in this forum or the off-topic about how awful things are these days, and how great they used to be. Or how terrible everyone under the age of 40 is, and how America is going all to hell. Frankly, I'm tired of it, and every time I see one of these threads I find fewer and fewer incentives to want to be a part of this community.

Do you know why you don't like any music made after 1990? You gave up, because you're lazy. That's right, I said it - YOU are lazy, not those gosh-darn wasted-youth kids-of-today. You listen to the radio hoping to be introduced to something that isn't over-produced pop garbage, and wonder why you can't find it. I'll clue you in - radio is a dead medium, and the only stuff you'll find on there is either targeted directly at your old, technophobic ass, or specifically designed to be throwaway cash-grabs. If you want to hear good, real, honest music, you won't find it on the radio. You have to care more about it, and have a passion for it. Of course, it's much easier to say it doesn't exist than to seek it out, which is what you'll do, because like I said, you're lazy.

 

[cboath]

Still doesn't disprove the previous points.

It simply proves the corporatism a bit further. Corporatism has pushed those with any actual talent to the fringes where you have to work much harder to find it. The point you're missing is you shouldn't have to work hard to find good music. But, thanks to corporatism, you do. I started seeing it myself in the late 80's frankly except there wasn't really anywhere else to go to find it. You've got many more options today.

Sure you can go out on something like Pandora or Spotify and set up a list of your likes/dislikes and have them throw songs at you and you'll find stuff you like. Not everyone has access to it though.

The health of music today isn't as good as it was 30 years ago, but it's not on life support either. However, it won't return to a medium for real artists while corporations are in control. Why wait for something to evolve into something great when you can pay a team to create a formula and then just stick a pretty face on it? This is a time when you will get a RECORDING contract because you can dance or have a pretty face. That's a damning stat frankly. Keep in mind RECORDING has nothing to do with looks and dancing ability...

Again it's not to say there aren't current acts of this generation making good music. It's just not necessarily easy to find (when it should be) and is pushed to the fringes by the record companies.