Ms Marvel - Disney+

NeoRutty

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
As far as I'm concerned this is the best TV Marvel has produced...

Hoping it keeps it up... I dunno if it's getting kickback from whiners about it being "woke", but holy... the cultural stuff is handled in such an interesting way, it actually helps move the story rather than feel like it's shoe-horned in.

Now looking to pick up a collected run and see what the comics were all about.
 

Sluis Van Shipyards

Legendary Member
I can't stand woke stuff, but I haven't seen anything like that in this show. I would say "woke" would be something like Rey in the SW sequels where they make a female character awesome when there's zero reason for the audience to believe that. Well that's my interpretation/example. I really like Kamala in this show. I don't see it as being woke, she's just a character who is also Muslim.
 

cboath

Master Member
After watching the first one last week I expected articles about people attacking it like every time star wars includes a non white male star these days. There's more stuff about being Muslim in the first episode than nearly all other mavel shows combined showing reference to any other religion. That's not a complaint mind you, but an observation. I figured the haters around the country/world would simply attack it simply because it showed something Muslim. I guess it's a testament to Marvel and those making the show they've done it so well people aren't complaining like that. That was surprising - not that Marvel did it well, but that that haters didn't come out of the woodwork.

The little musical bit was great and really put out a big 'people are basically the same' vibe :)
 

Sluis Van Shipyards

Legendary Member
Well part of the problem is how the media is portraying the people that have a problem with this stuff. Yeah there are the racists, but most people are just PO'd when they make a poorly written *cough*Rey*cough* character/story just because they go "Look our star is a woman/POC/LGBTQ so if you don't like the show, you're a misogynist/racist/homophobe/etc.". When they make a character like that, but it's well written, most people don't have a problem with it. It's the "If you don't like our steaming pile of crap, you HATE XYZ group!" that most of the media tries to pull in the last 10 years or so that makes people mad. Most people don't have a problem with non white male characters if they are well written. Like I said before they didn't start out going "Watch our show about a MUSLIM super hero, she's MUSLIM!!!!!" they said "Watch this show about a new superhero who just happens to be Muslim". That's how you do it. Treat it like normal, like most real people actually do in their real life interactions with people around them.
 

cboath

Master Member
Well part of the problem is how the media is portraying the people that have a problem with this stuff. Yeah there are the racists, but most people are just PO'd when they make a poorly written *cough*Rey*cough* character/story just because they go "Look our star is a woman/POC/LGBTQ so if you don't like the show, you're a misogynist/racist/homophobe/etc.". When they make a character like that, but it's well written, most people don't have a problem with it. It's the "If you don't like our steaming pile of crap, you HATE XYZ group!" that most of the media tries to pull in the last 10 years or so that makes people mad. Most people don't have a problem with non white male characters if they are well written. Like I said before they didn't start out going "Watch our show about a MUSLIM super hero, she's MUSLIM!!!!!" they said "Watch this show about a new superhero who just happens to be Muslim". That's how you do it. Treat it like normal, like most real people actually do in their real life interactions with people around them.
You're right, but that is my point. Even when it's done right, the haters and racists come out the woodwork just to trash it and through out their diatribe. They're not this time. Being done well is irrelevant to that group, hence my surprise that with the amount of stuff about being Muslim in it, i've not seen anything negative. I'm not saying it's too much either, but compared to everything else they've done, there is a surprising amount of it and it's not gotten and blowback i've seen. I'm very surprised. That's all.
 

renaissance_man

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Screenshot_20220622-092537.jpg

Laura Karpman's great score for episodes 1-3 are available to listen to.
I love what Laura has done blending traditional orchestral score with eastern elements.
 

renaissance_man

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Another great episode, I bet the wedding was fun to film, it was certainly fun to watch. I'm loving the music, both Laura Karpman's score and the songs.
Nice to get some backstory in this episode too.
 

jts1031

Well-Known Member
After watching the first one last week I expected articles about people attacking it like every time star wars includes a non white male star these days. There's more stuff about being Muslim in the first episode than nearly all other mavel shows combined showing reference to any other religion. That's not a complaint mind you, but an observation. I figured the haters around the country/world would simply attack it simply because it showed something Muslim. I guess it's a testament to Marvel and those making the show they've done it so well people aren't complaining like that. That was surprising - not that Marvel did it well, but that that haters didn't come out of the woodwork.

The little musical bit was great and really put out a big 'people are basically the same' vibe :)
It could be that no one is attacking it because no one has seen it. I'm being facetious, but viewership numbers for the first week are about half of the next lowest viewed MCU series. Part of that could be the lack of promotion for the show, of which I don't recall seeing any.
 

JoeG

Master Member
RPF PREMIUM MEMBER
Sounds sketchy to me. If Disney doesn't publish those numbers how would anyone else get them? None of the streamers give that info out. Anyway, don't want to further derail this thread. Personally I love the show. Marvel doesn't disappoint, whether it's the big screen or small. Iman Vellani is fantastic and I can't wait to see her in Marvels.
 

Sluis Van Shipyards

Legendary Member
What I really love about this show is just how freaking JOYFUL it is overall. I had the biggest grin on my face for the entire wedding sequence.

Also, I love the new origin for Kamala's powers. It's super-interesting and I'm incredibly interested to know more.

I agree. It's nice to have a show that is well written and just fun unlike others *cough*Kenobi*cough*. I also thought the cover band name, Brown Jovi, was pretty clever. I hope they are real.
 

animator

Sr Member
What I really love about this show is just how freaking JOYFUL it is overall. I had the biggest grin on my face for the entire wedding sequence.

Also, I love the new origin for Kamala's powers. It's super-interesting and I'm incredibly interested to know more.
I completely agree! I love that it has it's own personality and style. It's pure fun to watch.
 

Bloop

Sr Member
That was less directed at you than a general observation. We've had several shows from Marvel now which have shown us that they're favoring measured reveals of mystery over the whole of a shows runtime. Some have been more successful than others, but that is the definite pattern. Judging an entire show, even one that only runs 6 episodes, from the opening episode is not going to yield an accurate result with these things.

Again... it's totally cool if the story and visuals aren't landing for you, but that's more a matter of taste than a failing of the show itself.

I DO hope that you're willing to give it another couple of episodes, but that is entirely your choice. No one is going to hold a gun to your head and make you watch something you're not enjoying... and, hey, maybe you'll find it's a situation like my husband had with WandaVision where he just was NOT digging it until he was able to watch all of the episodes and see the progression of the story without the weekly wait.
I've kept watching, just finished the third episode. It has definitely improved and I'm enjoying it much more than the first episode. The second episode was much better than the first as some the issues I mentioned have improved. The characters are less cartoonish and characatures than in the first ep, particularly Kamala's family. I understand character development takes time, but I stand by my contention that they could have done a better job establishing the story and characters in the premiere ep. I assume the intention was to try to get more viewers, especially younger ones, on board by making things very basic and broad. I could see people possibly being bored or turned off by the pacing and content of the second ep, like all the Muslim history and generally slower story, with less gags and frenetic direction. I would've liked to have some of that in the first episode. I guess that may be one of the reasons why they released the first two episodes together. But since I was turned off by the basic nature of the first ep, I was reluanant to keep watching.

The direction has been much better in the second and third eps, which were both directed by Meera Menon instead of the team of Adil El Arbi & Bilall Fallah, who co-directed the first ep. I'm glad for the switch. I like they way Menon has handled her episodes - not only has the frenetic style been subdued, but the story and music seem much more representative of Muslim life, and the characters feel more "real." And Iman Vellani continues to do a great job bringing Kamala to life. Like I said before, she's part of why I kept watching.

So, yes, it has developed into something better than my initial observations, but I still think the 1st episode did a disservice to the show. I don't know if it was planned that way, or maybe Disney decided to switch things up after the first episode - maybe they didn't like the direction either. Anyway, looking forward the the next ep.
 

Bloop

Sr Member
A few specific things I liked in the 2nd & 3rd eps, compared to the 1st:

- Nakia addressing being viewed as "too white" by other Muslims and "too brown" by whites. The first episode made me think they just cast a pretty white girl to "balance out" having a brown girl as the lead, but now her character makes sense.

- Kamala's patents are no longer bland charactures. I liked he dad giving their oral history, her mom explaining to Kamala why she's concerned instead of just being a disapproving mom character.

- The anti-Muslim sentiment being addressed, and some of the misogyny that exists in the Muslim religion (and that it isn't just accepted by the women). Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing the Muslim faith, since misogyny exists in other religions too, I just liked that they're not just ignoring it. And they're showing more about Muslim and Pakiatani life than in episode one.
 

Bloop

Sr Member
I can't stand woke stuff, but I haven't seen anything like that in this show. I would say "woke" would be something like Rey in the SW sequels where they make a female character awesome when there's zero reason for the audience to believe that. Well that's my interpretation/example. I really like Kamala in this show. I don't see it as being woke, she's just a character who is also Muslim.
The word "woke" has become a political buzz word often used by people to try to justify their hatred of increased representation of people that are different from them. I'd caution against using it, even if you try to explain it. It can undercut any argument you may have. There's also a rule against political posts on The RPF, so any use of the word here could be a violation of the terms of use we all agreed to.
 

Sluis Van Shipyards

Legendary Member
The word "woke" has become a political buzz word often used by people to try to justify their hatred of increased representation of people that are different from them. I'd caution against using it, even if you try to explain it. It can undercut any argument you may have. There's also a rule against political posts on The RPF, so any use of the word here could be a violation of the terms of use we all agreed to.

One, I'm well aware as I've been here quite a while. Two, let the mods do their job, they have no problem letting people know when they are displeased. Three, you can't stop people using a word by putting your own interpretation on what they meant by using it. So don't imply my use was intended as anything other than exactly what I posted.
 

Bloop

Sr Member
One, I'm well aware as I've been here quite a while. Two, let the mods do their job, they have no problem letting people know when they are displeased. Three, you can't stop people using a word by putting your own interpretation on what they meant by using it. So don't imply my use was intended as anything other than exactly what I posted.

Mods don't read every post. You're complaining and using a politically charged word to do so. You're using the word "woke" to speak derisively about inclusion. It's not my own interpretation of the word, it's how you used it. I'm not stopping you from using the word, just advising you of the consequenses you face by choosing to use it, both by the mods and by anyone that reads your posts (like I did). It's your choice, just like it's my choice to tune out anyone that uses that word to complain about inclusion.
 

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