Message to "all" recasters (RESULT Page 18!!!)

[Pappy]

where's your beer man?

 

[Art Andrews]

I'll say this for closed registration. At least it weeded back the goons and allowed for some level of natural selection.

Ry, you know I love ya but we are just never going to agree on this point.

Making a statement like that is like saying "well, if you just chop off someone's head there will be a very low chance of them becoming a victim of cancer!"

Closed registration doesn't "weed out" anyone... it simply cuts off EVERYONE who isn't already here, ensuring that not only new troublemakers can't come in but also ensuring there is no new talent either.

In a system that does not allow for new blood, the only natural selection that takes place is the old slowly dying off, eventually resulting in the death of the community because those who have died (or moved on to other interests) aren't being replaced.

 

[Garthok]

Why can't we let this thread end. Some people have an opinion and have their arguments ready even before they have heard the other sides points. They can always justify their actions to themselves.

The post saying that because guy A creates an original piece, makes and sells only 10 copies but does not make much money proves recasters are not harming anyone is ridiculous!

Guy A worked his arse off, he invested time, probably years perfecting what he does. Do you think a car actually costs $30,000 to make? or do you think about the millions of dollars in research and then the time, and materials and the overheads. Do you understand why people can make cheaper cars, because they steal the ideas, they simple bypass the other guys hardwork and investment.

Its a bit of a stretch and a rant, but it really annoys me.

 

[defstartrooper]

Again, if the overall income of a run wouldn't cover the cost of a license, then that means that the recasters would not amass the "fortune" these propmakers are accusing them off by selling their recasted product. That's like saying "I barely sell 10 of these, but the recasters are making a fortune by recasting and selling 100's of the same product". If these recasters were really making a fortune by recasting said product, then that fortune would be more than enough to cover the fees required in applying for a license, so the propmaker should invest in the license since they believe that the recasters are making such a fortune.

If the studios is not interested in issuing the license, then obviously they do not feel that the product would of any financial gain, so obviously you can sell it commercially until they hand you a C&D, if they even do since they considered your product inadequate, which is the point where they recognize the value of your product. At that point you can re-negotiate. It would only be a win-win situation there because 1) it would allow you to sell openly until 2) the studios recognizes the value of your product and is willing to offer you the license or 3) demand you stop all sales, which at this point you would still have made a considerable amount more profit by the commercial sales compared to limited, restricted sales.

Really this is a genuine suggestion, there's an old saying look before you leap which means think about something before you act.
In this case think about what you've just written before hitting the submit button, nothing you say makes the slightest sense at all.

The people here are hobbiest they may work for months creating a piece and then they'll sell a small number of copies, it's purely a hobby not a business for most.
A recaster spends zero time creating anything they just copy the original item they've purchased and sell and sell and sell not just one piece but multiple copies of multiple items.
They treat it purely as an income.

I'm not even going to cover the stuff i bolded because that's such a mass of crap it would make Einsteins head pop trying to make sense of it, you clearly have zero idea of how copyright,IP, and licensing works.

 

[defstartrooper]

Ry, you know I love ya but we are just never going to agree on this point.

Making a statement like that is like saying "well, if you just chop off someone's head there will be a very low chance of them becoming a victim of cancer!"

Closed registration doesn't "weed out" anyone... it simply cuts off EVERYONE who isn't already here, ensuring that not only new troublemakers can't come in but also ensuring there is no new talent either.

In a system that does not allow for new blood, the only natural selection that takes place is the old slowly dying off, eventually resulting in the death of the community because those who have died (or moved on to other interests) aren't being replaced.

I'm with you Art on this closed registration is a bad idea.

Besides that i have a mind of my own i can decide who i think is a complete cock i don't need some automated software to decide for me.

 

[teecrooz]

But at least with the closed registration and periodic sign ups, there was a controlled influx of necro bumps, questions that could have easily been answered by ready the FAQs, and only a periodic thread about why recasting isn't supported here. The daily influx of this activity is starting to push people who did contribute away.

I agree with Art that it is good to get new blood and fresh talent, but the arguments above are hard to ignore also.

 

[micdavis]

I thought the metered sign up was fine. Although I honestly hadn't notice the difference.

Seems the normal amount of ignorant newbies (not that ALL are), sockpuppets and the occasional new talented builder.

 

[tommin]

Whoohoo! I got post #600!

Would someone living in the Atlanta area please go slap dualedge in the balls for me?

 

[dualedge]

Ry, you know I love ya but we are just never going to agree on this point.

Making a statement like that is like saying "well, if you just chop off someone's head there will be a very low chance of them becoming a victim of cancer!"

Closed registration doesn't "weed out" anyone... it simply cuts off EVERYONE who isn't already here, ensuring that not only new troublemakers can't come in but also ensuring there is no new talent either.

In a system that does not allow for new blood, the only natural selection that takes place is the old slowly dying off, eventually resulting in the death of the community because those who have died (or moved on to other interests) aren't being replaced.

I'll toss these thoughts in just for some further insight. And because I'm hoping to get to post #700 tomorrow. Besides, I'm not talking about recasting so I'm not recasting the recasting discussions.

I've given it a lot of thought and it seems to me from my years here and my staff time that most of the folks that have left probably would have left anyway. Some left when registration was completely closed, some left when it was partially closed, some left when it was completely open.

Oftentimes the reason someone leaves is really just the "the straw that broke the camel's back" and not the entire reason they left. It's just the one they tend to talk about the most. That's just my personal take from a general standpoint and not referring to any particular case.

Folks just burn out and sometimes it's their own fault because they got distracted by hobby politics, factions, rules and personal conflicts rather than what the hobby is supposed to be about... which just so happens to be the enjoyment of props and chatting with fellow prop fans.

So what it all boils down to is that I've developed a bit of a fatalistic viewpoint. Those that will stick around will stick around. Those that will leave will leave. It's not a good reason to deny new users entry. And the waves of new users will likely reach some manner of equilibrium eventually.

Personally, I probably wouldn't push the baby bird out of the nest quite as quickly as Art but I naturally tend to be more conservative toward such things and need a good push myself once in a while.

And, Tommin, thanks for quoting that. It's nice to see Nic Cage with his bird hair again. I've heard it's a very good argument invalidator.

Rob

 

[knightone]

Is the argument invalid because of the bird hair or is the argument invalid and also he has bird hair?

 

[dualedge]

Is the argument invalid because of the bird hair or is the argument invalid and also he has bird hair?

Yes.

 

[tommin]

And, Tommin, thanks for quoting that. It's nice to see Nic Cage with his bird hair again. I've heard it's a very good argument invalidator.

Rob

I'm just jealous that I didn't get to be the one to post the flag on #600!! :lol

 

[SithLord]

So what it all boils down to is that I've developed a bit of a fatalistic viewpoint. Those that will stick around will stick around. Those that will leave will leave. It's not a good reason to deny new users entry. And the waves of new users will likely reach some manner of equilibrium eventually.

I realize this is veering off topic with additional discussion of registration but would you prefer it to occur in waves or a continual torrent?

I think with the dynamics of a forum like this, it is good to have breaks from registration so that things can, as you say, equilibrate. I think of the breaks between registration periods as sort of recovery from a communal periodic learning curve.

 

[Rylo]

Of course, Art. We're fine on a personal level and I agree 100% that we just don't agree on this point.

I also think we're getting a good glimpse of that new membership you're talking about; those who are stepping up to replace those who have moved on. Some might even suggest, a number of those who are stepping up are motivating some to leave.

Look, there's no denying the mood is indeed different, here. We're seeing a complete rehash of dead topics and zero respect for an established membership that has skin in this game. Many of us have dedicated years developing the climate of this forum.

Having periodic membership separated those who really wanted to be here from those who now join on a wim. It once took a little vigilance to join the RPF. One had to care to some small degree at least to become a member here.

A tempered membership allowed more time for the new guys to mix with an established forum. It made for a smoother assimilation. With no gap between old and new members you'll see more and more threads like this. We're seeing a swarm of people who really don't understand what this hobby is about.

This is overwelming and tries the patience of such a close, established community.

There's zero adjustment time for this many new members and the playground logic permeating from some of these threads is insufferable.

Again, I hope it all works out. :thumbsup

-Rylo

Ry, you know I love ya but we are just never going to agree on this point.

Making a statement like that is like saying "well, if you just chop off someone's head there will be a very low chance of them becoming a victim of cancer!"

Closed registration doesn't "weed out" anyone... it simply cuts off EVERYONE who isn't already here, ensuring that not only new troublemakers can't come in but also ensuring there is no new talent either.

In a system that does not allow for new blood, the only natural selection that takes place is the old slowly dying off, eventually resulting in the death of the community because those who have died (or moved on to other interests) aren't being replaced.

 

[rollerboi]

I agree with Rylo. I prefer to see waves of enrollment, it allows people to lurk and read old posts while waiting for the window to open again, gives them a sense of familiarity before jumping in.

[Edited for clarity; this is mic's statement I was agreeing with, but not his second: "I thought the metered sign up was fine."]

 

[Rylo]

I believe more than a few of our established members echo the sentiment.

-Rylo

I agree with Rylo and mic. I prefer to see waves of enrollment, it allows people to lurk and read old posts while waiting for the window to open again, gives them a sense of familiarity before jumping in.

 

[tommin]

I agree with Rylo and mic. I prefer to see waves of enrollment, it allows people to lurk and read old posts while waiting for the window to open again, gives them a sense of familiarity before jumping in.

But the real kicker happens when a message board sports a title such as the one indicated above. ...and the 'community' has a rogue pilot sockpuppeting another board with his/her blind anger. Think about all the other 'pilots' out there following the beacon....

"Hudson may be right..."

 

[fettster]

I agree with this statement completely. I tried everything to join here when registrations were closed but to no avail. It really was a happy day when membership opened.

It also stops the idle shopper who just see this place as an alternative to ebay

Of course, Art. We're fine on a personal level and I agree 100% that we just don't agree on this point.

I also think we're getting a good glimpse of that new membership you're talking about; those who are stepping up to replace those who have moved on. Some might even suggest, a number of those who are stepping up are motivating some to leave.

Look, there's no denying the mood is indeed different, here. We're seeing a complete rehash of dead topics and zero respect for an established membership that has skin in this game. Many of us have dedicated years developing the climate of this forum.

Having periodic membership separated those who really wanted to be here from those who now join on a wim. It once took a little vigilance to join the RPF. One had to care to some small degree at least to become a member here.

A tempered membership allowed more time for the new guys to mix with an established forum. It made for a smoother assimilation. With no gap between old and new members you'll see more and more threads like this. We're seeing a swarm of people who really don't understand what this hobby is about.

This is overwelming and tries the patience of such a close, established community.

There's zero adjustment time for this many new members and the playground logic permeating from some of these threads is insufferable.

Again, I hope it all works out. :thumbsup

-Rylo

 

[Qui-Gonzalez]

As an older member (If 8 years ain't older, then what is?) I have to say that a lot of the other older members may well be forgetting what I forgot: Open registration was a thing when we joined too.

Now, times have changed and this hobby has become fraught with more and more ne'er do wells. They join, wait their time and then the crap starts. They use the JY as their eBay. A way to "avoid" being on the main screen of some studios. They then push their crap on people. Some folks receive the garbage, rally and the guys are banned.

Now, JY garbage is not exclusive to new members. We have lost some older members to bad deals as well.

Rollerboi, you can either side with Mic or Rylo. Mic says he hadn't really noticed a difference. Rylo sees it plain as day. I take it for what it is...not something I can control. So, I do not let it bother me much. I've railed over it, exchanged PMs with Art over this less than stellar idea. We agree to disagree and again, since he has the final say, I just shrug and move on.

 

[rollerboi]

Qui - you're quite right. Edited for clarity. Thanks.