Marvel's Eternals

So the director of Nomadland was given a Marvel movie? Sure. Why not. What did I just almost sleep through? Was Angelina Jolie in the movie? Couldn’t really tell from the lack of any dialogue from her. Don’t want to say much else cause I just don’t care enough. Next.
 
Just saw it today, so, is the MCU based on the "religion" of Scientology? Between Eternals and the Thanos stuff, it seems a little too close to me.

Thought of this image while watching:
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No. "The ancient gods were aliens" is a sci-fi trope going back probably a century. It can be argued to be the core essence of Lovecraft's Elder Gods, though there's a lot of magic mixed in with the sci-fi elements. Hubbard's take in that book was that, when the Earth was forming, an evil warlord dumped millions of rebellious conquered enemies into our planet's primordial volcanoes, and their death-agonies were imprinted on us as we rose to sapience. Scientology is based on the notion that purging these alien "memory engrams" allows us to achieve our full potential to stop ageing, communicate telepathically, teleport, etc. It's one step along the cobbled path of "ancient alien visitors" stories, coming in 1950, barely a step ahead of Arthur C. Clarke's "The Sentinel" (1951), and followed by Star Trek, Chariots of the Gods?, Stargate, and a whole raft of other variations.

In the Marvel comic universe, there are a host of quasi-related cosmic entities. The Celestials and Galactus pre-date the present incarnation of the universe, in different ways. Both have created, directly or indirectly, empowered beings roughly on our scale down through the ages. In the comics, Ego the Living Planet wasn't a Celestial. That's one I still want to see ironed out in the MCU. As far as Titans and Eternals and Deviants... While the Marvel comics managed to keep things a lot more internally consistent than DC, there are still some problems. I'll get to that in a second. I do not envy the production team the task of clearing up some of the inconsistencies. For those who stayed for the mid-credit scene, they showed that they are tackling this head-on with Eros/Starfox showing up saying flat-out he's Thanos' half-brother and somehow an Eternal, despite the film showing us the Eternals are constructed beings. So that's a thing we can look forward to. There are questions I am left with that I am wanting answered.

Also from the comics is the notion of the Celestials planting seeds/embryoes in the cores of suitable proto-planets, and the intelligent life that arises are a sort of immune system to protect it while it's incubating. This is what gave rise to all the powered entities on the Marvel Earth, from the subtle like the FF and Bruce and Tony to the overt like the mutants. I have always loved how the Celestials have been depicted in the comics, and didn't like all the dialogue Arishem had in this movie. Here's the best slug at capturing their essence:
In the great void, emptiness reigns. Save for the unknowable, inexplicable life that somehow exists without homeland, without sustenance. Voicelessly uttering secrets that would destroy our sanity. The Celestials. Created of the First Firmament. Witnesses to the birth of all. They watch each civilization, from primordial to transcendent. They test. They prod. They observe. And then, as voiced by the most coldly impassionate of their member, Arishem... they pass judgment.
It's a niggle, but in the comics, the Celestials so very do not have anything like a uniform appearance. We saw the red six-eyed dude in Guardians of the Galaxy. It's Eson the Searcher:

main-qimg-bcfb31433efd25da8304c40820795ba7.gif


...Who looks very different from Arishem. I mean, much moreso than above versus who we see in the Eternals. There's a lot to reconcile, and I don't know if they can... In the comics, when the First Host came to Earth a million years ago, they created the Eternals and Deviants out of hominid stock, as well as introducing the X-factor gene, all to see which would prove most viable down the road. When the Second Host visited eons later, they destroyed the Deviant kingdom of Lemuria and sank Atlantis. The Third Host forced the submission of the Gods of Earth -- extradimensional aliens worshipped as deities, including Athena, Hephestos, and Hermes (Mercury). There are the classical Greek Titans and Olympians (Hercules -- who should be Herakles, but whatever -- becomes an Avenger, after all), as well as the alien Titans (named after the moon of Saturn where they're from, in the comics) and the Eternals who are analogues for many of the Olympians and with where we are currently, that's a whole big mess of contradiction that I'm curious to see if they can find their way out of (of course, I'm still waiting for an explanation of how the ancient Norse had Loki in their mythology, despite MCU Odin not finding baby Loki until after the last time the Asgardians visited Earth). Bit of a difference to have the Celestials create a hundred Eternals from homo erectus stock a million years ago to live among us, are reborn when they die, et cetera... versus sending ten constructed, basically, bio-androids here a mere seven thousand years ago.

Ultimately, I'm hoping this is the beginning of a decade-long road to the Coming of Galactus.
 
No. "The ancient gods were aliens" is a sci-fi trope going back probably a century. It can be argued to be the core essence of Lovecraft's Elder Gods, though there's a lot of magic mixed in with the sci-fi elements. Hubbard's take in that book was that, when the Earth was forming, an evil warlord dumped millions of rebellious conquered enemies into our planet's primordial volcanoes, and their death-agonies were imprinted on us as we rose to sapience. Scientology is based on the notion that purging these alien "memory engrams" allows us to achieve our full potential to stop ageing, communicate telepathically, teleport, etc. It's one step along the cobbled path of "ancient alien visitors" stories, coming in 1950, barely a step ahead of Arthur C. Clarke's "The Sentinel" (1951), and followed by Star Trek, Chariots of the Gods?, Stargate, and a whole raft of other variations.

In the Marvel comic universe, there are a host of quasi-related cosmic entities. The Celestials and Galactus pre-date the present incarnation of the universe, in different ways. Both have created, directly or indirectly, empowered beings roughly on our scale down through the ages. In the comics, Ego the Living Planet wasn't a Celestial. That's one I still want to see ironed out in the MCU. As far as Titans and Eternals and Deviants... While the Marvel comics managed to keep things a lot more internally consistent than DC, there are still some problems. I'll get to that in a second. I do not envy the production team the task of clearing up some of the inconsistencies. For those who stayed for the mid-credit scene, they showed that they are tackling this head-on with Eros/Starfox showing up saying flat-out he's Thanos' half-brother and somehow an Eternal, despite the film showing us the Eternals are constructed beings. So that's a thing we can look forward to. There are questions I am left with that I am wanting answered.

Also from the comics is the notion of the Celestials planting seeds/embryoes in the cores of suitable proto-planets, and the intelligent life that arises are a sort of immune system to protect it while it's incubating. This is what gave rise to all the powered entities on the Marvel Earth, from the subtle like the FF and Bruce and Tony to the overt like the mutants. I have always loved how the Celestials have been depicted in the comics, and didn't like all the dialogue Arishem had in this movie. Here's the best slug at capturing their essence:

It's a niggle, but in the comics, the Celestials so very do not have anything like a uniform appearance. We saw the red six-eyed dude in Guardians of the Galaxy. It's Eson the Searcher:

View attachment 1511101

...Who looks very different from Arishem. I mean, much moreso than above versus who we see in the Eternals. There's a lot to reconcile, and I don't know if they can... In the comics, when the First Host came to Earth a million years ago, they created the Eternals and Deviants out of hominid stock, as well as introducing the X-factor gene, all to see which would prove most viable down the road. When the Second Host visited eons later, they destroyed the Deviant kingdom of Lemuria and sank Atlantis. The Third Host forced the submission of the Gods of Earth -- extradimensional aliens worshipped as deities, including Athena, Hephestos, and Hermes (Mercury). There are the classical Greek Titans and Olympians (Hercules -- who should be Herakles, but whatever -- becomes an Avenger, after all), as well as the alien Titans (named after the moon of Saturn where they're from, in the comics) and the Eternals who are analogues for many of the Olympians and with where we are currently, that's a whole big mess of contradiction that I'm curious to see if they can find their way out of (of course, I'm still waiting for an explanation of how the ancient Norse had Loki in their mythology, despite MCU Odin not finding baby Loki until after the last time the Asgardians visited Earth). Bit of a difference to have the Celestials create a hundred Eternals from homo erectus stock a million years ago to live among us, are reborn when they die, et cetera... versus sending ten constructed, basically, bio-androids here a mere seven thousand years ago.

Ultimately, I'm hoping this is the beginning of a decade-long road to the Coming of Galactus.
I need to watch the film again but I'm sure Phastos said that the Eternals draw cosmic power from the Celestial Arishem. I took that as a nod to Galactus and his ability to imbue the Silver Surfer with the Power Cosmic. Perhaps in the MCU Galactus will be a Celestial with an insatiable hunger who goes rogue from the Celestial's set plan of seeding worlds as mentioned in this film.
I'm looking forward to the possibilities of what is to come.

Regarding Starfox he could be Thanos' brother in the same way Gamora and Nebula were sisters or Loki and Thor are brothers, that sort of found family rather than a direct blood link. Especially as mentioned the Eternals are constructed rather than born biologically.
 
My point about Scientology was the use of related imagery and concepts. I know it's not a direct copy of scientology, but the volcano image is heavily associated with it (as in the Dianetics book cover I posted), and Thanos's response to overpopulation is similar to Xenu (alien "god" of Scientology) killing people, and sending their "thetans" (souls) to earth's volcanos has definite similarities to events in Eternals.

I realize these tropes have been around in sci-fi and comics for a long time, but the presence and proliferation of Scientology in Hollywood begs the question of if there was some conscious decision to draw from Scientology, either to help support it or mock it, from the creative forces behind the Marvel movies. I'm not saying there is, just that it reminded me of Scientology, so it's possible others felt the same way, whether it was intentional by the creators of the films or not.
 
Eternals didn't say they created humans only guided them.
As I understand Scientology humans were placed here by aliens.
 
It's how he spent the last part of his life floating around the world in a yacht with a bunch of beautiful women. Not a bad gig if you can con people into it.
It's not just that he "conned" people, he manipulated and abused them into forced labor. I know you're making a joke, but I find it in poor taste to say there's anything good about what he did.
 
I’m actually getting kind of tired of the reoccurring trope that all the villains that need to be defeated or either gods or demons!

When I was in the theater watching wonder woman, the first one, not 1984 which I have never seen, I remember thinking really, another God as the villain?

Then when I heard that justice league was basically fighting more demons and demigod, I decided not even to waste my time.

I miss the good all days when Batman used to fight homicidal clowns, geniuses with a psychological bend towards evil, and mutants that like to eat fish!

If this is what Marvel has in store for the future, I will mourn the passing of Tony Stark, and leave it at that!
 
I’m actually getting kind of tired of the reoccurring trope that all the villains that need to be defeated or either gods or demons!

When I was in the theater watching wonder woman, the first one, not 1984 which I have never seen, I remember thinking really, another God as the villain?

Then when I heard that justice league was basically fighting more demons and demigod, I decided not even to waste my time.

I miss the good all days when Batman used to fight homicidal clowns, geniuses with a psychological bend towards evil, and mutants that like to eat fish!

If this is what Marvel has in store for the future, I will mourn the passing of Tony Stark, and leave it at that!
The Justice League power imbalance has always been a thing for me. Originally, the DC heroes were in their own isolated realities. There was the occasional "what if" style team-up/crossover, but those were isolated from their main realities. It wasn't until Marvel's shared universe in the '60s that DC wanted to jump on that bandwagon, but they've faced the problem since of: If a villain is powerful enough to be a challenge for Superman, what the hell can Green Arrow do against them? And if a villain is a challenge for Green Arrow, Superman won't even break a sweat. They've never satisfactorily resolved that.

Marvel sort of has that problem, but, in a way, less so. The whole thing since the get-go has been, boiled down to its essence, ordinary people finding themselves empowered in extraordinary ways. Be it through radiation or technology or magic or whatever. The "weakest" Marvel heroes, people like Hawkeye or Black Widow, would still wipe the floor with me. I've got some martial arts, from aikido to period fencing to shooting. I am no weakling and have above-average reflexes, eyesight, and situational awareness. But they have trained rigorously nearly every day for a good chunk of their lives.

So the villains need to be on par. In the first Iron Man film, and ignoring the Ten Rings for the moment, Obadiah Stane was just a businessman with an armored suit. And, it can be argued, Tony's real adversary was himself (which continued into Iron Man 2). But because the heroes are empowered above baseline humanity, their adversaries have to be, too. And, basically, as the heroes "level up" from their experiences, the threat level of their opponents has to elevate, too. But it can be done in ways that aren't over the top, that keep the fight personal.

My biggest beef with the first decade is that the stories got bigger, but they didn't give them the expanded screen time that required. Iron Man 3 needed to be two films. Age of Ultron needed to be two films. Infinity War and Endgame needed to be three. A lot of important character development and universe expansion got glossed over for fight time.

Phase Three ended with literally every hero and all their support structure to that point having to team up to take down Thanos, which is more or less what happened in the comics covering that story arc. Now we're in a selah moment -- Hebrew for "pause and consider". Everyone is still shooketh from the fallout of the Big Snap and its reversal. Wanda had to work through some stuff. Peter had to work through some stuff. We got Natasha's life flashing before her eyes. Sam and Bucky had to work through some stuff. And now we're into the next slow build. Whatever cosmic threats Our Heroes face going forward, they will be defeated in human ways, because that's what Marvel was always good at, even with their missteps. Even if we get powerhouses like the Phoenix or Silver Surfer in the MCU, their victories will be because of their humanity, not their power level.

That's why I'm looking forward to what's next. In the Eternals, it wasn't about whether they were strong enough to defeat a Celestial -- but whether they were strong enough to defeat, essentially, their programming. Some were and some weren't. It was a very human and humbling story. Could've taken out the Celestial's Emergence and replaced it with any other crisis. The point was how each of them responded to it.
 
So an Eternal builds a deaf robot? Really? What they didn't include a blind one? The movie just had to include a gay character? They left so many other agendas out. Pathetic. Such generic "bad guys" all CGI. Lazy, predictable, and boring.
 
So an Eternal builds a deaf robot? Really? What they didn't include a blind one? The movie just had to include a gay character? They left so many other agendas out. Pathetic. Such generic "bad guys" all CGI. Lazy, predictable, and boring.

What's wrong with a character being deaf?
Sign language is just another form of communication.
And why does a character being gay bother some people.

Why are some people always so offended by these things? It's strange.
 
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