Joker (origin film)

[CT1138]

I like where this is going. I also like that it's not an adaption of The Killing Joke. We've seen that. We've seen it animated, we've seen it in film, we don't need to see it again. I think this looks like an amazing take on the Joker origin story. In 1988, you created the Joker by dropping him in a vat of chemicals. In 2019, you create him by dropping in into society.

 

[CB2001]

Honestly, I kinda wish that they'd release like five different Joker origin movies. That'd be the kind of thing that fits the Joker the best (considering that even he doesn't remember his past and even he's unsure of what would be the truth). The audiences would be like, "Wait... What?" And that'd be a brilliant joke on them. XD

 

[Mr Webber]

Was excited for this from the start and the trailer solidifies it even more. Part of my love of the Nolan trilogy came from it being more grounded in reality than fantasy and this follows that path and even the cinematography is similar based on the trailer. Phoenix creeps me out and I just hope that we get a good amount of time with him as full blown Joker and not just all lead up to it.

 

[Psab keel]

I just watched the teaser again and in that short peek I empathized with the character. I think it will be a cool take by having a story told from the villain's point of view. Seeing him suited up with the make up made me think of those exciting moments in traditional comic book origin movies where we see the hero put on the suit/make up for the first time and that rush of excitement when you know they are going to kick ass. Having the roles reversed though will make for an interesting watch.

I mean we all love to see the Joker mess with people and outsmart them, but imagine being able to almost root for him? I'm getting amped for this one the more I see that teaser. I just hope they keep the release trailers just as restrained because I just saw a slew of previews the other night for movies that looked great but I don't need to see them now because the trailers told the whole story.

I think this movie might be a surprise run away hit and it will come out of left field considering how much of a miss the DC material has been of late. Save for Wonder Woman which was fantastic and did very well.

 

[DeLano80]

I am pretty much comic booked and Star Wars(ed) movied out...
That being said, I think Joaquin Phoenix is one of my favorite actors. I will see this movie just to watch him. I am thinking and hoping it will be great.

 

[Egon Spengler]

I don't know how I feel about this. It looks pretty good, yeah, but I don't know how I feel about a sympathetic Joker film. I generally don't like films that make you feel bad for the villain.

 

[laellee]

Just me, but I hope it is horribly brutal to him the whole movie, defining a character. We'll get history defined, VERY specific (yeah we're all waiting for the cut) moments explained.... And honestly it will be teasing, but it might go the whole movie of him being brutalized until ONE MOMENT where he is the villain. Now roll that around for a second, think of the hundred ways that could could be tied into canon. That, I think, would be awesome.

 

[Strikerkc]

eh, empathizing with a villain is the signs of a good villain. Believing how they're dealing with what they've gone through ultimately being wrong or inappropriate, is still just fine, even if you care for them as people. Based on the early clips released, I'm pretty sure he's gonna go dark, just too dark. stop being a human that's empathized with, and start being... something else

 

[Pikezer1337]

Yes, I agree. I see us empathizing with him because he'll be one of us at first. A misunderstood guy trying to make it through life. However, as you said eventually he'll go too far overboard.

Also, have to say I really love the quote that he's writing in his notebook. "The worst part about having a mental illness is people expect you to behave as if you don't".

 

[PantheraGem]

I'm getting strong Twisty the Clown vibes from "American Horror Story: Freak Show". It's no wonder they cast Frances Conroy as his mother. Much like in "Freak Show", that clown was terrifying, but I just knew they were going to make me weep for him.

This might be the most beautifully haunting trailer I've ever seen. It's a work of art in itself.

 

[George]

The first minute or so of the trailer,the initial impression was that of an arthouse movie.Heck did I know it was the joker standalone movie,but very well done.

 

[Psab keel]

I think that's a good indication that we might have something special here. It's not even made to be a "comic book movie." It's just a movie that happens to have characters from comic books in it. That's not to say lighthearted films like Marvel don't have their place because they certainly do.

Rather than go with the Hollywood notion that everything has to be dark and gritty, yet still stylized, it seems like the approach here is to just make it feel like these are real people. It's what set the Dark Knight trilogy head and shoulders above other comic book films of the time because it made that distinction. Hollywood mistook that sense of realism to mean that it had to be dark when that doesnt necessarily have to be the case and to me that's what made Wonder Woman work vs. Man of Steel. You can have characters who are optimistic without downplaying the realities they face.

To me it's partly what moves the art of comics from being "something kids read and collect" and makes it a viable form of storytelling that is just as valid as any other piece of fiction or film. Nolan did this brilliantly by treating Batman like a crime drama vs. a typical superhero movie. There was a sense of practicality and rational thought on the character and his motovation other than just let's give him cool gadgets.

If this Joker is anything like that in tone then I am totally invested.

 

[JLeezy23]

I think this will be amazing, I love The Joker, I appreciate every Joaquin film, and this gives vibes that will make everyone understand the "Why" of it all. He is damaged and broken, now we'll see what actually set him off. It wasn't One bad day, it was a series of them, and he finally stood up against it all. Anyone can have bad days, not everyone takes a stand and fights agaisnt the world in response.

If you want to understand how a villain is made in an ordinary world, Michael Douglas gave a great way of telling that story

 

[Mr Webber]

I`ve seen a lot of complaints online about how wrong it is that they are trying to make people warm to such a terrible person like the Joker but John Wick is an utterly vile human being and the hero of the series and also a character most cheer for and I would`nt have it any other way. Cant wait to see this.

 

[Strikerkc]

well, those people are toddlers that don't understand the difference between understanding a bad guy, and condoning their actions.

Plus, John has the benefit of being a horrible person that has, thus far, only killed other horrible people in his movies. (who knows EXACTLY what he did prior to them though)

 

[Psab keel]

Not to mention being able to distinguish fictional violence in the service of story vs. actual violence.

 

[dascoyne]

The trailer looks startlingly good... I mean, really, really good.

I'm not a DC/Warner fan to begin with. The whole notion of a Joker-centric origin film just seems like another miscalculation. I always believed The Joker seemed best when he was an enigmatic foil to Batman's logic, psychology, intelligence, stoicism and personal dignity so an origin film made about as much sense as having The Joker festooned with tattoos and body piercings. And why portray The Joker yet again when he's been done to death multiple times while there's still a vast untapped rogue's gallery of Batman villains? It makes no sense. And why do The Joker again when Ledger seemed to put the definitive spin on the character? It makes no sense. Why not give the Batman franchise a rest when the public is still reeling after Batfleck? It makes absolutely no sense. I can't tell you how passionately "meh" I was about this film.

But then I was forced to watch the trailer when I went to see the last couple of MCU films. I have to say, "Wow."

Please just take everything I said about the Joker in the above paragraph and toss it completely out the window. This movie looks that good. Joaquin Phoenix's performance seems deep and rich and sincerely poignant and is wonderfully framed with the cinematography and apparently the story. A lot of this is speculation, of course, but based on a trailer I might already like him better than Ledger. I've not looked forward to watching any DC/Warner movie after Nolan and I'm an unapologetic MCU fanboy. But this is a movie I really want to see badly.

 

[Psab keel]

I didn't pick up on it until I rewatched the trailer with my friend recently and it looks like it takes place in 1970's Gotham with crime ridden streets. The clothing and period details just ooze of the era. I couldn't believe I didn't pick up on it until I recently rewatched it.

I had the same feeling as you dascoyne. Like verbatim exactly how you feel about the character, his interpretations, DC's mishandling of some of their later properties, etc. Though I was always on board with Phoenix playing the part because I admire him as an actor. That aside I too was very apprehensive about an origin story.

But that trailer sold me. Sold me to the fact that I am looking forward to seeing where they take this and honestly Jaoquin's performance might just be another film milestone for the Joker as a character.

 

[JoeG]

If this film paints the Joker as a sympathetic character without showing his true evil nature at the end, then it will have missed the mark by a mile. It needs to show that he wasn't the poor victim we all thought he was all along. That he's actually the villain of his story. I hope they don't screw this up.

 

[Ron]

Yup. I had the exact same feelings as you guys did. Anybody but the Joker. His enigmatic nature is part of why he's such a great villain opposite the world's greatest detective. And also DC just can't do anything right with their live-action movies.

But then I started wondering how would I make a Joker film and I eventually realized, as has been stated, you can't treat it like a "comic book" movie despite the Joker being the most "comic booky" of them all. The best way to approach it, as has also been stated, is to treat it like a character study. To not just make a checklist origin movie *cough Solo cough* but to really explore what would drive a man to turn into a homicidal clown.

Anyway, I didn't care. I knew it would be terrible. Then I heard Joaquin Phoenix was cast. That took it from a 0 to a 10 on the interest meter for me. One of my favorite actors. He's not the type of guy to just read lines, cash his check, and go home. He's memorable in every role he plays (the ones I've seen anyway). The Joker is a role that's right up his alley. You know he'll give it 110%.

I sat down to watch the trailer and holy moly I loved it! We've been burned by trailers before so I'm trying to temper my enthusiasm but it looks really good. It looks to be taking a proper approach to the character like it was made by artistic filmmakers with a narrative goal in mind and not bean counters in a board room trying to milk the superhero cow like Justice League and Suicide Squad.

People are iffy on Joaquin's look but I love it. I wanted to see "cleaner" makeup this time and while it's kind of trivial, I love how his suit is an actual purple and not violet.

People love Heath Ledger's performance and understandably so. It was brilliant. But he never quite felt like the Joker to me, at least not in the way that Jack Nicholson and Mark Hamill did and even Caesar Romero did. He was a great villain but to me he lacked the flair, the panache, the showmanship that we've gotten from previous Jokers. Obviously that was by design. You can't do a grounded Batman and have a zany Joker running around. It worked for the interpretation Nolan was going for but I missed a little bit of that zaniness. That's not to say Ledger wasn't charismatic, he was charismatic as hell. Or that he didn't have style. He absolutely did. But he had more of a subdued personality. Almost like he was a joker fanboy playing dress up rather than the actual Clown Prince of Crime. He was more Joker than JOKER. I'm just talking personality here. Obviously the writing and dialogue given to Ledger's Joker is some of the greatest of any villain in any medium. But with JP, there's something in the way he walks and moves, something in his facial expressions. There's a swagger there, a sense of showmanship and flair that was somewhat missing from Ledger. I always wanted to see a Joker that's somewhere in between Nicholson and Ledger and I feel like JP might've nailed it. We'll see.

Sorry for repeating points that have already been said but I hadn't read this thread until now and haven't really delved into discussing the trailer with anyone so I'm excited to see you guys had the same thoughts I did. I love Batman and the Joker and the DC universe and I really hope this movie delivers. I'm becoming more cynical as I get older and it was a nice feeling to get excited for a movie the way I used to.