Is Sting too big? (Or the viewpoint of a props owner)

[Psmith]

I don't know why this has been rambling around my brain for the last couple of years, but it has finally left the background and come staggering forward and insisted I share and get the input of fellow fans/prop and replica lovers.

I think the replicas of Sting that I have seen, from Noble, to United Cutlery, to Weta are too big. Don't get me wrong, they all aim to replicate the sword from the films, the Weta one perhaps being the most accurate as I think it is bases directly off of the prop, but the problem for me arises out of the fact that they are (I believe) replicating the real world object that is in Martin Freeman's (or indeed Elijah Wood's) hands in the movies. Neither of whom are 4 feet tall. So we end up with a prop that is much too big for the actual object as it is meant to exist in it's fictional world.

It is the latter that I would be interested in. I would be most interested in Sting at the size that it appears in the films. I suppose, to me, it feels like more of an artifact or carries more of the romance of an item for a prop to maintain it's fictional world semblance. I'm not hardcore about it or anything, but I definitely lean heavily in that direction.

I know there are other schools of thought and other viewpoints, so with that in mind, I would love to hear from anyone who is interested in this.

 

[Darth Detori]

"More of a letter opener really" -Dwalin

I agree all of them are woefully oversized.

 

[SVTStingRay]

i need to lose some weight..........lay off me already

 

[Treadwell]

They're oversized if you think of them as relics from a real era. But if you want to pretend you're hobbit sized, then they're correct.

 

[Lunaman]

I don't know why this has been rambling around my brain for the last couple of years, but it has finally left the background and come staggering forward and insisted I share and get the input of fellow fans/prop and replica lovers.

I think the replicas of Sting that I have seen, from Noble, to United Cutlery, to Weta are too big. Don't get me wrong, they all aim to replicate the sword from the films, the Weta one perhaps being the most accurate as I think it is bases directly off of the prop, but the problem for me arises out of the fact that they are (I believe) replicating the real world object that is in Martin Freeman's (or indeed Elijah Wood's) hands in the movies. Neither of whom are 4 feet tall. So we end up with a prop that is much too big for the actual object as it is meant to exist in it's fictional world.

It is the latter that I would be interested in. I would be most interested in Sting at the size that it appears in the films. I suppose, to me, it feels like more of an artifact or carries more of the romance of an item for a prop to maintain it's fictional world semblance. I'm not hardcore about it or anything, but I definitely lean heavily in that direction.

I know there are other schools of thought and other viewpoints, so with that in mind, I would love to hear from anyone who is interested in this.

Um, have you handled any of these props? The Noble Collection and United Cutlery Stings are tiny, since they are meant to scale correctly with the other weapons. People already thought of your concerns ages ago.

This is the sword in the film:

This is the sword you receive (photo is of Matt C, from the old Sword Buyers Guide forums, apologies if he does not wish the image to be posted here):

Again,
tiny.



Here's a size comparison between the UC sting (top) and the Noble Collection Sting (bottom). They are both miniscule.

What you probably want is the "Museum Collection Sting," which is, like the others, small-scale, but made with real silver accents and all of the bells and whistles. They are discontinued, but you can find one for a couple hundred bucks on ebay.
http://sbgswordforum.proboards.com/thread/2093


The only replicas that are made to 'actor' scale are the ones made by Weta, since Peter Lyon is making them exactly the way he made the hero props on the films--scaled for the actors to use. That's the main appeal of those replicas, that they are what was used IN the films, not that they match up with the reality of the mythical era.
http://www.wetanz.com/sting-the-sword-of-bilbo-and-frodo-is-here/

 

[Psmith]

What I mean is that the sword looks right in your hands. You look much the same as Martin Freeman and Elijah Wood. I'm also not saying this is incorrect. I am saying that I would prefer the sword to look the way it would in say Aragorn or Gandalf's hands. Even tinier. But again, that's just my own preference. Nice phots too! Good stuff.

- - - Updated - - -

Or maybe my perception is off. Maybe you are correct.

 

[DuneMuadDib]

I believe there are different scale props available, "real world" and "Hobbit scale."

The Noble Collection: Sting?, The Sword of Frodo

UnitedCutlery.Com: Sting - Sword of Frodo - UC1264

The former is listed as over 27" long, the latter as 22" long. So unless Noble and UC are using wildly different rulers there are multiple scales. I own the UC one I linked, and it's clearly a smaller scale than the props used by Elijah and Martin. The Master Replicas light up one from years ago was larger and in the scale of the props used by the actors.

 

[Psmith]

Hmmm...maybe 22 inches isn't too big. Which would render my particular pondering moot. It seemed a lot bigger when I measured it out with measuring tape. But maybe. Interesting.

 

[Lunaman]

I believe there are different scale props available, "real world" and "Hobbit scale."

The Noble Collection: Sting?, The Sword of Frodo

UnitedCutlery.Com: Sting - Sword of Frodo - UC1264

The former is listed as over 27" long, the latter as 22" long. So unless Noble and UC are using wildly different rulers there are multiple scales. I own the UC one I linked, and it's clearly a smaller scale than the props used by Elijah and Martin. The Master Replicas light up one from years ago was larger and in the scale of the props used by the actors.

Ah. I'd forgotten about Noble's older sting prop.

Let me be clear. The scale props (that is, sized for an actual hobbit) are around 22" long. This includes all of the United Cutlery Sting props and the Noble Collection's "Hobbit" sting.
The Noble Collection: STING

The actor-sized props (like those used in the films) are around 27" long. This includes the Weta Stings and the Noble Collection's old "Frodo" Sting.
The Noble Collection: Sting?, The Sword of Frodo


Hope that makes things more understandable.

 

[Psmith]

I guess it's a faulty perception thing. To my eye you don't look that much different than Martin Freeman holding it in the film. But then again, we're only talking about a height difference of about 2 feet. Maybe it wouldn't be dramatically smaller in a human sized hand.

 

[Lunaman]

I guess it's a faulty perception thing. To my eye you don't look that much different than Martin Freeman holding it in the film. But then again, we're only talking about a height difference of about 2 feet. Maybe it wouldn't be dramatically smaller in a human sized hand.

First of all, that picture is not of me, I specifically captioned it with proper idendification.

Second, are you telling me you really can't see that this sword:

Is substantially larger than this sword?

"Faulty perception" indeed.
It's the same proportional difference as a 5'10" human and a 4'9" hobbit. Or a 5'6" human (Elijah Wood and Martin Freeman's height) and a 4'6" hobbit (the height given for dwarves in the films, who operate on the same scale setup as Bilbo).

 

[Psmith]

My apologies for missing the photo ID. I seem to be really bothering you, and this was just me musing about this. You have given me pause for thought though.

 

[Lunaman]

My apologies for missing the photo ID. I seem to be really bothering you, and this was just me musing about this. You have given me pause for thought though.

It's bothering me because your posts come off as acting as if you're some special special snowflake and no one else besides you has ever considered the scale issue before and all of the prop makers are doing it wrong. When in reality this has all been mulled over and weighed and considered carefully for more than a decade.
And then you don't even bother to read my responses thoroughly.
So YEA. I'm bothered.

 

[Jedi2016]

You'd apparently have to see them in person to see the differences. I have two of them myself, the UC steel version and the MR plastic/light-up version. The MR version is scaled like the movie props (if anything, I'd say it's still too small), and it's noticeably larger than the UC version. Seeing them side by side in a picture, they don't actually look that different in scale, but when you hold them, there's a world of difference.

 

[Psmith]

I didn't mean to come across as special. I was just musing aloud. Sharing some thoughts. I also didn't mean to give the impression I thought I had discovered something new. It made perfect sense to me that they would make the replicas sized to look like the owner was a Hobbit. But at any rate, As I say, you have changed my thinking on it. No offense meant.

For the record, my tone and style were intended to be light hearted and jovial. I don't think it worked.

 

[Lunaman]

No worries, dude. Sorry for losing my cool.

 

[Psmith]

:facepalm

Seriously, now that I have been looking at a bunch of photos of Martin Freeman and then looking at Lunaman's photo of Matt C., I don't know how my measurements as I looked at them here at home seemed so off. Well, so much for that. Had I been correct though, I think it would've been an interesting discussion. A "what do you prefer?" sort of thing. To own a prop from the inside perspective (as though you were the character attached to it) or from the outside. As though it were sort of a found object.

But alas...I bolloxed it up proper. Ah well.

 

[Montagar]

[snip]Had I been correct though, I think it would've been an interesting discussion. A "what do you prefer?" sort of thing. To own a prop from the inside perspective (as though you were the character attached to it) or from the outside. As though it were sort of a found object.

I would think that if someone was doing middle earth cosplay, they certainly would need the items to be "full" size, but from a collecting and display perspective, it's way more interesting for the items to be the smaller size as though hobbits actually existed. Such as...

 

[Lunaman]

:facepalm

Seriously, now that I have been looking at a bunch of photos of Martin Freeman and then looking at Lunaman's photo of Matt C., I don't know how my measurements as I looked at them here at home seemed so off. Well, so much for that. Had I been correct though, I think it would've been an interesting discussion. A "what do you prefer?" sort of thing. To own a prop from the inside perspective (as though you were the character attached to it) or from the outside. As though it were sort of a found object.

But alas...I bolloxed it up proper. Ah well.

Don't even trip, dawg. We can still have that discussion.

I myself usually prefer to own a prop from the inside perspective, as if I were the character, rather than the outside perspective of "museum curator" or "finder of mythical object."
I once owned the official liscenced replica of a sword from a film (that of the Dread Pirate Roberts) but because it didn't feel right in my hand or connect to me personally, I sold it. Later spent a lot more money buying a less accurate, but more intricate and agile sword that felt like it belonged on my hip.

 

[Psmith]

That's very interesting. Not all across the board, but I am somewhat of the opposite. I am quite pleased now that I know that the Stings are properly sized. However, I am currently going to great lengths to get my Jack Sparrow Skull ring to fit properly on my finger. So it's not a hard and fast rule with me I suppose.

By the way. I like the idea of a museum-y or curator thing. I think that sums up most of my stance in the prop/replica area fairly well. As though I have somehow accumulated an assortment of fantastical objects from other times and/or worlds. But very loosely in this manner.

I hope to some day have shelves here and there about my house holding a great many lovely books, but also mixed in unobtrusively (i.e. not in display form but something more ramshackle and treasure like just strewn about my place) a Sting in a scabard here, a dinged up looking light saber there, Sonic Screwdriver propped against an old Jules Verne novel, A small jewelry box with several rings (Ring of Barahir, The skull ring, and others), Radagasts staff leaning in a corner.

You see what I mean.