ANOVOS issues (ANOVOS ONLY discussion)

Jagjaguwar

Sr Member
Ok, so wild speculation it is, got it.

Not sure why you feel the need to fill in members who have been here for 6 years, as a member who has been here 6 months yourself. I think we both have a decent idea of the history here.

Not interested in being baited into whatever this is, though. Have a nice day.
 

r2019g

New Member
Ok, so wild speculation it is, got it.

Not sure why you feel the need to fill in members who have been here for 6 years, as a member who has been here 6 months yourself. I think we both have a decent idea of the history here.

Not interested in being baited into whatever this is, though. Have a nice day.
If you follow my posts, you'll see the proof. Your comments are speculative at best. I appreciate your tenure compared to mine, but to be fair that feels like a false justification for no real response from you, you're brushing me off where you provide nothing to justify your position. I've tried multiple times to track Rubies, NECAs, Anovos', and Korben's business records trying to follow the facts and be positive about the new company, but so far, it's not adding up.

I'm also not interested in being baited into whatever you're doing, so this will be my last comment to you since you can't be bothered post a cogent argument. May the force be with you.
 

ggriffaw

Sr Member
471 pages of complaints and yet there isn't a chorus singing Denuo Novo praises having filled long lost orders, you tell me


Nope, none at all (sarcasm)

Originally, Shoretrooper was going to ship 10, Sept. now maybe, November. AT-ACT 29, Sept. now November, supposedly.

I've shown you multiple that haven't. Show me hundreds (as they claim) that have
Where are these dates and screenshot from? I don't see any estimates for delivery on the DN site.

I have 8 unfulfilled Anovos orders. DN hasn't gotten to those products yet. It isn't reasonable to expect a new prop replica company to produce and deliver dozens of different products within a few months.

I am interested in hearing what experience customers have had with DN. The comments I have seen have been positive other than the defective Praetorian Guard helmet. I would like to see more posts and reviews about products received. I haven't seen much as far as complaints from people who actually placed orders so it is hard to know how well DN is performing. People are more likely to post complaints than positive comments. The lack of complaints about specific orders makes me think there aren't many actual complaints so far.

I am interested in knowing how DN handles the defective Praetorian Guard helmet. Dealing with issues is an important part of running a good business. If they don't deal with that situation well, that will be a concern.

I doubt anyone would start a business where they take on filling thousands of unfulfilled orders from another company and only fill a dozen orders. That makes no sense for a business plan.
 

r2019g

New Member
Where are these dates and screenshot from? I don't see any estimates for delivery on the DN site.

I have 8 unfulfilled Anovos orders. DN hasn't gotten to those products yet. It isn't reasonable to expect a new prop replica company to produce and deliver dozens of different products within a few months.

I am interested in hearing what experience customers have had with DN. The comments I have seen have been positive other than the defective Praetorian Guard helmet. I would like to see more posts and reviews about products received. I haven't seen much as far as complaints from people who actually placed orders so it is hard to know how well DN is performing. People are more likely to post complaints than positive comments. The lack of complaints about specific orders makes me think there aren't many actual complaints so far.

I am interested in knowing how DN handles the defective Praetorian Guard helmet. Dealing with issues is an important part of running a good business. If they don't deal with that situation well, that will be a concern.

I doubt anyone would start a business where they take on filling thousands of unfulfilled orders from another company and only fill a dozen orders. That makes no sense for a business plan.
If you're asking about my orders, that's from my account at BBTS. If you're asking for screenshots of things that have clearly been established in this thread and their press releases and their comments to social media influencers, I'll provide one.
1636121439810.png


Your comments about how to run a business are conjecture. I never stated they intended to start this business to not deliver and run it in the ground. My comments are based on the fact that their approach to delivering products leveraging Anovos (which I already addressed in a previous post) which is still a business, is setting Rubies and NECA up for failure. What makes them think Joe and Dana are going to do them any better than they've done us?

For such a large community globally, there sure is a lot of silence from people excited to finally get their products. Search theRPF for people confirming how much Denuo has delivered. Also I think there are 3 items on rebel scum. https://forum.rebelscum.com/threads...m-a-new-producer-for-star-wars-items.1148025/

And if you bought or sold on ebay or mercari, you'll see a conspicuous absence of things being sold since Denuo took over.

They claim hundreds (once again, I never said thousands), but I'm not seeing it.

This feels a lot like earlier this year when Anovos posted a pic of a stack of boxes claiming they were pumping stuff out and all we saw was basically a handful of shoretrooper helmets.

I'm willing to admit that they may be shipping a lot, but are you willing to admit that the lack of comments could because people are still waiting on items, so they can't comment?

Once again, this isn't about Denuo trying to get one over on people. It's about their approach to delivering products using Anovos.
 

Jagjaguwar

Sr Member
Once again, this isn't about Denuo trying to get one over on people. It's about their approach to delivering products using Anovos.
Ok, so it’s not about Denuo trying to screw people over like Anovos did. But one page ago:
If you follow my posts, you'll know that I was a huge proponent of Denuo, but it's turning out to be Joe & Dana taking peoples money 2.0.
So, which is it?

In both cases, though, I don’t really get the issue. Should Denuo not be working with Anovos at all, in order to produce a bunch of products that Anovos has prototypes for, and molds for, and manufacturing sites for already? Why would they not take advantage of that? Like the guy in the video said, do people want products they ordered, or to ensure that no one works with any former Anovos employees, at all costs?

And as for the theory that somehow the new company is simply a way for Joe and Dana to screw people over once again, the video you posted as “proof” quotes the brand manager as saying “No one from Anovos has any ownership in this company.” How would they be making money if they aren’t owners?

It’s worth being really skeptical about this new company until they have a long track record for delivering consistently good products on time, given how things ended up with Anovos. But really, speculation about some sort of nefarious conspiracy doesn’t get us anywhere here, I don’t think.
 

r2019g

New Member
Ok, so it’s not about Denuo trying to screw people over like Anovos did. But one page ago:

So, which is it?

In both cases, though, I don’t really get the issue. Should Denuo not be working with Anovos at all, in order to produce a bunch of products that Anovos has prototypes for, and molds for, and manufacturing sites for already? Why would they not take advantage of that? Like the guy in the video said, do people want products they ordered, or to ensure that no one works with any former Anovos employees, at all costs?

And as for the theory that somehow the new company is simply a way for Joe and Dana to screw people over once again, the video you posted as “proof” quotes the brand manager as saying “No one from Anovos has any ownership in this company.” How would they be making money if they aren’t owners?

It’s worth being really skeptical about this new company until they have a long track record for delivering consistently good products on time, given how things ended up with Anovos. But really, speculation about some sort of nefarious conspiracy doesn’t get us anywhere here, I don’t think.
They aren't mutually exclusive. You are putting words in my mouth. If you had any sense of running a business you would watch that video and understand that Denuo is working with Joe and Dana. I never said Joe and Dana had any ownership of Denuo. It's called subcontracting or a third party vendor. Denuo offering products trying to be a reputable company. The Joe and Dana 2.0 references that the situation can't improve if the root issue is still there.

Also, my comment from post #9,402 "...and I want the good Anovos employees gainfully employed...". But no, I don't believe Denuo should be doing business with Anovos.
 

Jagjaguwar

Sr Member
They aren't mutually exclusive. You are putting words in my mouth. If you had any sense of running a business you would watch that video and understand that Denuo is working with Joe and Dana. I never said Joe and Dana had any ownership of Denuo. It's called subcontracting or a third party vendor. Denuo offering products trying to be a reputable company. The Joe and Dana 2.0 references that the situation can't improve if the root issue is still there.

Also, my comment from post #9,402 "...and I want the good Anovos employees gainfully employed...". But no, I don't believe Denuo should be doing business with Anovos.
I’m not putting words in anyone’s mouth, I’m literally quoting past posts that seem rather contradictory. I don’t care what we talk about here, but what I’d quoted sounds like moving the goal posts of what the problem is. That’s all.

I don’t need any “sense of running a business,” the implication of what the brand manager is pretty clear- they have probably had no choice but to work with Joe and Dana, the people who owned Anovos, in order to get access to other employees, customer info, and manufacturing info. But there’s an important difference between inferring something from what is said (or unsaid), and hearing something directly stated.

They did not “admit” to Dana or Joe being involved. Is it extremely likely that Joe and Dana were or are involved to some degree? Sure. But is that an admission? No. Suggestion or implying are one thing, “admission” is something else. If you have something that proves how they are involved, that’s one thing. But a brand manager saying “we are working with former Anovos employees” when asked several times about their involvement does not equal a confirmation that they are involved, or have been involved.

That’s all I’m saying. I don’t blame you or anyone for not wanting Anovos involved in any way, if that’s how you feel. There are good reasons for wanting distance from them, though in my view it’s essential to work with them at least initially. All I’m saying is that we don’t know these things definitively, and saying that we do leads to suppositions being repeated as facts.
 

r2019g

New Member
I’m not putting words in anyone’s mouth, I’m literally quoting past posts that seem rather contradictory. I don’t care what we talk about here, but what I’d quoted sounds like moving the goal posts of what the problem is. That’s all.

I don’t need any “sense of running a business,” the implication of what the brand manager is pretty clear- they have probably had no choice but to work with Joe and Dana, the people who owned Anovos, in order to get access to other employees, customer info, and manufacturing info. But there’s an important difference between inferring something from what is said (or unsaid), and hearing something directly stated.

They did not “admit” to Dana or Joe being involved. Is it extremely likely that Joe and Dana were or are involved to some degree? Sure. But is that an admission? No. Suggestion or implying are one thing, “admission” is something else. If you have something that proves how they are involved, that’s one thing. But a brand manager saying “we are working with former Anovos employees” when asked several times about their involvement does not equal a confirmation that they are involved, or have been involved.

That’s all I’m saying. I don’t blame you or anyone for not wanting Anovos involved in any way, if that’s how you feel. There are good reasons for wanting distance from them, though in my view it’s essential to work with them at least initially. All I’m saying is that we don’t know these things definitively, and saying that we do leads to suppositions being repeated as facts.
I think you missed part of the answer.

1636129868541.png
 

Jagjaguwar

Sr Member
Maybe I am missing something, yes. Can you explain what you mean? Because that screen cap also just says “people from Anovos,” not Joe or Dana specifically. Unless the idea is that they are the only employees there?
 

r2019g

New Member
Maybe I am missing something, yes. Can you explain what you mean? Because that screen cap also just says “people from Anovos,” not Joe or Dana specifically. Unless the idea is that they are the only employees there?
So is your implication that the Anovos employees are sending goods to another company without Joe and Dana knowing?

Or

Joe and Dana don’t own Anovos?

Every time you ask me to prove something I back it up. You throw out more hypotheticals. So prove to me that Joe and Dana aren’t involved
 
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Jagjaguwar

Sr Member
So is your implication that the Anovos employees are sending goods to another company without Joe and Dana knowing?

Or

Joe and Dana don’t own Anovos?

Every time you ask me to prove something I back it up. You throw out more hypotheticals. So prove to me that Joe and Dana aren’t involved
No, I’m not saying either of those things. I don’t know what “goods” you’re referring to, but no, I don’t think Dana and Joe have been kept in the dark about whichever other employees are helping Denuo. And no, unless something has changed (which we haven’t been given any indication of), it’s reasonable to assume that the owners are still the owners.

What I’m saying, again, is that you keep talking about “backing it up,” as if there’s something definitive to these ideas, but it’s all just speculation. What we have is just speculation based on the limited information we’ve been provided. We don’t know who is helping, or how they are helping, or how long they will be helping for.

And lol, how precisely am I supposed to prove that they aren’t involved? My answer is the same as yours should be: I don’t know for sure one way or the other. But the onus isn’t on me to prove that something isn’t happening, it’s on you to provide some sort of solid evidence that it is.

It’s like if we were discussing aliens. Should the burden be on you to prove they exist, or on me to prove that they don’t? One of those is much simpler- proving a positive.
 

r2019g

New Member
No, I’m not saying either of those things. I don’t know what “goods” you’re referring to, but no, I don’t think Dana and Joe have been kept in the dark about whichever other employees are helping Denuo. And no, unless something has changed (which we haven’t been given any indication of), it’s reasonable to assume that the owners are still the owners.

What I’m saying, again, is that you keep talking about “backing it up,” as if there’s something definitive to these ideas, but it’s all just speculation. What we have is just speculation based on the limited information we’ve been provided. We don’t know who is helping, or how they are helping, or how long they will be helping for.

And lol, how precisely am I supposed to prove that they aren’t involved? My answer is the same as yours should be: I don’t know for sure one way or the other. But the onus isn’t on me to prove that something isn’t happening, it’s on you to provide some sort of solid evidence that it is.

It’s like if we were discussing aliens. Should the burden be on you to prove they exist, or on me to prove that they don’t? One of those is much simpler- proving a positive.
The fact that you can’t comprehend what goods and services are in business terminology is, shows you have no concept of what you’re talking about.

Prove that Joe and Dana aren’t involved
 

Jagjaguwar

Sr Member
The fact that you can’t comprehend what goods and services are in business terminology is, shows you have no concept of what you’re talking about.

Prove that Joe and Dana aren’t involved
Careful, don’t really need to be diving into comments on what people can “comprehend,” as this could be interpreted as calling someone stupid, which is probably frowned upon here.

Proving that they aren’t involved at all isn’t important to me, it wasn’t an argument I was making in the first place. All I said was that you couldn’t be completely sure they were involved, and to what extent.

I asked several times if there was something more than just the speculation and inferences, and it seems there isn’t, so I don’t think this is going to be a productive discussion going forward.
 

r2019g

New Member
Careful, don’t really need to be diving into comments on what people can “comprehend,” as this could be interpreted as calling someone stupid, which is probably frowned upon here.

Proving that they aren’t involved at all isn’t important to me, it wasn’t an argument I was making in the first place. All I said was that you couldn’t be completely sure they were involved, and to what extent.

I asked several times if there was something more than just the speculation and inferences, and it seems there isn’t, so I don’t think this is going to be a productive discussion going forward.
Fair point I don't want to call anyone names. Sorry if I hurt your feelings. But changed to a question, the point stands, you questioned with quotes what goods are.

Unless, you can prove that J&D are no longer at Anovos, I have proved their involvement being that it is their company. According to answer 4 in the video, Denuo is relying on Anovos to provide them backorders, not Denuo producing backorders.

You're right, this isn't productive. I wish you the best! Funny enough as I look back at previous conversations, we both said we weren't going to be baited in to this, so let's agree to end this back and forth.
 

Jagjaguwar

Sr Member
Discussions online can turn into this sort of thing for some reason, it’s no problem. (y)

I’m not sure that what was said by the brand manager was actually that Anovos was producing the back orders- I understood it to mean simply that Denuo has been working to transition over all of the orders (by which I mean customer info and whatever manufacturing partners/molds/scans there may be related to those items) from Anovos to themselves so that they (Denuo) can continue producing where Anovos left off. It certainly possible that what you said is what’s happening, though. I guess it shows that they really need to do more to explain themselves and what is happening, so that customers have a better idea.

But stepping away from those issues: is it weird to anyone else that they are producing a variant of the TIE that’s different from the single variant that Anovos made, and has been announced before both the Oxixo and the battlefront designs are shipping? I don’t remember off-hand if the Oxixo all shipped out, I do know some were delivered. I don’t think the Battlefront ones ever were made.
 

ggriffaw

Sr Member
I took the comments about working with people from Anovos to mean getting the order information, designs, molds, factory contacts, etc. I think DN is using the Anovos Texas facility to produce some of the items which makes sense since the Mando, Royal Guard, and Shoretrooper helmets were produced there. DN may have hired some of the same employees.

Joe and Dana may be involved to some degree. I don't think they are running DN in any way. I would think they are just providing info of some kind.

I don't know how accurate delivery estimates from third party resellers would be for these items. They may be accurate or they may be assumptions made by the 3rd party seller. We don't know.

I'm surprised by how few reports there are from people who have received items or from people who have not received items that DN has listed. If there were lots of people with orders for those items, I would expect to see more complaints about specific outstanding orders.

In my case, I already received several of the items from Anovos. I do not have outstanding orders for any of the items DN has listed so far.

If there are questions about timelines, I would recommend contacting Denuo Novo directly. They respond to questions pretty quickly.

If there is anyone on here with outstanding orders for items that have been listed on the DN website, please let us know when you receive the item or some kind of communication from DN. We all want to know how well they are doing with filling the backorders.
 

ggriffaw

Sr Member
But stepping away from those issues: is it weird to anyone else that they are producing a variant of the TIE that’s different from the single variant that Anovos made, and has been announced before both the Oxixo and the battlefront designs are shipping? I don’t remember off-hand if the Oxixo all shipped out, I do know some were delivered. I don’t think the Battlefront ones ever were made.

I was surprised to see the two TIE Pilot helmets on the DN site. Anovos did ship the ship the Vader Wingman (Oxixo) helmet. I received mine in Dec 2017. I don't know about the Battlefront helmet. Hopefully that gets added shortly.

I wonder where these are being made. Anything overseas could be slow to arrive.
 

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