ANOVOS issues (ANOVOS ONLY discussion)

[Mara Jade's Father]

The track record is not good. Every company that has taken up the high-end costuming license has either failed or spent years recovering -- to any degree -- from having it. I feel like there's a lot of BTS stuff we're not privy to that makes that one in particular such a fraught license. Everyone's obviously gone into it with the best intentions, and just as obviously fallen short of what they thought they'd be able to accomplish, and the 'why' of it remains elusive. I feel like if it was as simple as communication or QA or whatever else has been proffered, it would've been licked several licensees ago.

And I also have to ask... If ANOVOS give up the license, have it taken away, or go out of business entirely, who do y'all think is left to take up the license? Who would want to, after seeing what it's done to Icons, Master Replicas, Museum Replicas, the Propstore, ANOVOS, eFX...?

IMHO Museum Replicas is the only who has really done high end costuming replicas. Everyone else tended to fall under prop replicas (things that were meant more for display and not for Cosplay although things like the ABS efx helmets I would consider meant for costuming. But for the most part, before that, it was only Rubies (not high end) for costuming.

To be fair, I didn't think Master Replicas was a problem. It wasn't till at the end when Corgi bought them and just sort of lost interest and did not want to renew the license a year later. For what ever reason Corgi bought MR, it is obvious it was not because they had the Star Wars license. For the most part, I was pretty happy with the items I got from MR prior to that point.

Remember there seems to be a few different licenses out there that cover different products. eFx=prop replicas, Anovos=Costuming/Cosplay, Hasbro = High end electronic collectibles. I just mention that for discussion purposes.

I think someone with an existing history of product development, working with manufactures and production schedules, and retailing would be ideal. Let's say Hasbro or a company similar in type or size. They would be able to handle all those aspects. The important thing is that such a company would need to ensure that the right people were in place to develop and design products. People that were in synch with what the community wanted in both product, quality, and function. Just image if you had the people developing product for Anovos and the experience and business practices of Hasbro.

My other thought is that Disney/LFL should just take it on themselves. They seem to be able to come up with great products for their Disney Stores and Park Gift Shops. Why not just go all out?

 

[cboath]

You can look back through this thread and i'm going to come off as a big Anovos defender. That said...things have taken a dive the last couple or so years. At this point, you now have multiple things multiple years late, you're seeing terrible product (the jyn gloves), you have next to no customer service, and people are waiting extremely too long for a refund.

Of all that, the one that bothers me most is ignoring people on refunds. Should be a big no-brainer. Someone wants to cancel an order, fine, let them. Give them their money back and let everyone move on. I can see a week delay in there. Two if something goes wrong in the process. Beyond that, completely unacceptable. There's only one reason i can think of they don't handle refunds better, they don't have the money to pay them, so better to just ignore you and any level of customer service.

I can accept delays when they're explained to some extent. Putting stuff off years and only getting a cheesy notice saying it's pushed back (repeatedly) isn't good in any sense of the word.

I got a number of their stuff out of the gate and never had an issue. I got a refund about 3ish years ago and while it took longer than it really should (7-10 days as i recall), i had no real issue. But from what i've seen lately, i have zero confidence in getting anything i order in any thing short of 3 years. I'd love to get the Royal Guard, but not under the current state of things. Maybe i'll go EE, i don't know. Maybe RS if they have one, i've heard great things about them I don't have worries that Anovos will go under or anything, but buying something when the delivery date is basically 'eventually'. My guess is they won't guarantee you anything inside of 5 years.

I understand getting in over your head to start, or not fully understanding how china production/shops are going to work., But it's been 5-6 years now. That ship has sailed. There is no excuse any longer for delay after delay and non-responsiveness.

 

[Fett_Ish]

I remember, and personally was involved in the beginning of the end for MR. coincidentally it was helmets. Sabers they did fine, very few quibbles, once helmets happened-issues-both with quality and refunds/cancellations. My MR Vader helmet was months late and arrived with a big 'ol thumbprint right on the front grill. Took a month to get them to take it back for a replacement, I assume because at the time there were many,many QC issues. Then after a year of waiting for a replacement it took me six weeks and many phone calls emails to cancel and get a refund, which they issued twice, I returned the check as they had credited my CC even though I asked them not to do that as the card was at zero balance and they would have to cut me a check. The 501st Clone helmets were a huge debacle as well. QC issues galore and then they went from limited ed., to "whatever" because they didn't make the plaques and instead of numbering plaques and giving those they just sent generic ones.
I'll also add this tidbit-anybody here remember Marco Enterprises? way before the internet? Their 'catalog" could be ordered from the back of Starlog magazine back in the day. You want disappointment? Buy a Luke lightsaber from there at 15. Save up the $150 send it off, wait 2-3 months, get a hunk of chromed resin with a light in the end and a speaker that buzzez. I can still smell that resin.
I limited my collection to things I can build/finish myself, mostly models, some props (graflex ANH Luke Saber, TOS and NG ST tricorders) which is why I bought Anovos TK and now FOTK suits. I like the making part and finish quality is no ones fault but mine. with 3D printing, the market Anovos is after is getting even smaller than it was and I fear only those with really deep pockets and love of SW, not props or the artistry of said props, will be buying this stuff at even higher than now prices. Whats my point? all kinds of stuff, but A) it wasn't all peaches and cream before Anovos and wont be after and B)the way things are made, bought,sold is changing greatly, and I don't think places like Anovos will be around much longer regardless.

As soon as I can afford the 3D printer I want, I'm never buying another model or prop as I have the 3D training and can make whatever the internets can provide me good refs of. Until then, I hope Anovos turns this around.....

 

[Inquisitor Peregrinus]

Fett_Ish, I can understand that. I, too, remember Marco Enterprises. I was saving up for the Stormtrooper armor he was offering (what we now call the FX suit). So glad in hindsight I wasn't able to before it went away.

I, too, like to build my own, where appropriate. Or source from small-scale unlicensed vendors for one or another piece. When I want something with lineage, I'll go with RS or ANOVOS. When I want something better (mostly OT stuff, or Trek), I either make it myself, in collaboration with someone, or use a commercially-available item as raw material to build on. I'd rather spend a hundred on a Hasbro Black Series Stormtrooper helmet and its symmetry, and build it up to my standards from there, than three hundred for a screen-derived replica and all of its wonkiness.

I'm doing a lot of 3D printing now. Not much design work -- not enough time or energy to learn the requisite skills. But when I want something measured, scanned, or cast from original props I'll go with the offerings that are out there. Yes, even if there are issues. I don't know where my hard-no limit on company issues is, but apparently between ANOVOS and eFX, given I'll still pre-order things from the former and keep working on my many other projects, but have never and will never order anything from the latter. *shrug*

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

And I also have to ask... If ANOVOS give up the license, have it taken away, or go out of business entirely, who do y'all think is left to take up the license? Who would want to, after seeing what it's done to Icons, Master Replicas, Museum Replicas, the Propstore, ANOVOS, eFX...?

This question also reminds me of another issue I have been wanting to talk about...

I feel that there is an untapped merchandising opportunity that has yet to be pursued by anyone but yet is in high demand. That is what I call the casual prop replica. These are replicas that are made for cosplay and/or collectors. I feel that a lot of the stuff made by Icons, MR and eFx are these untouchable replicas. And what I mean by that, is that you spend so much for the collectibility, the case, the plaque, you are afraid to touch it or use it as part of your costume. I think Anovos has helped in the costuming part of it. They are making costumes and helmets that are met to be worn. You don't have the added expense of displays and plaques but they are displayable if you want.

Why is it almost everyone thinks you need a stand and a plaque in order to own a replica? Look, if Disney and Hasbro can make a FX lightsaber and sell it for around $150, they why can't they make a static belt hangar hilt from decent quality materials for $100. No fancy case, no plaque with stand, no limited edition, no COA, just a simple box or blister pack? Why not do this with all these replicas. Where are the sabacc cards, kyber crystal necklaces, Gaffi sticks, hilts, etc... Look at Noble Collection and some of the items they offer and the prices for their licensed franchises.

 

[Psab keel]

Fan made has been and will always be better. The failure of most of the companies that held and subsequently lost the license to me is proof enough of that.

 

[mluder]

So the idea of confronting Anovos reps at their booth at Star Wars Celebration has been mentioned a few times... The typical understanding is that you will get the same canned responses and maybe even an escort from the event...

Well, Anovos just made a huge mistake. They have announced they will be taking part in a "Lucasfilm Collectibles Update Panel" on Friday April 12th 1:30 to 2:30 PM on the "Twin Suns" stage. Anyone want to ask some questions during the Q/A? Because, it says Brain Merten who is a rep from Lucasfilm will be there leading the panel.

Have fun!
Steve

 

[darthjones]

So the idea of confronting Anovos reps at their booth at Star Wars Celebration has been mentioned a few times... The typical understanding is that you will get the same canned responses and maybe even an escort from the event...

Well, Anovos just made a huge mistake. They have announced they will be taking part in a "Lucasfilm Collectibles Update Panel" on Friday April 12th 1:30 to 2:30 PM on the "Twin Suns" stage. Anyone want to ask some questions during the Q/A? Because, it says Brain Merten who is a rep from Lucasfilm will be there leading the panel.

Have fun!
Steve

Ohhhhh WOW -

ANYONE here who is subject to the "Anovos experience" PLEASE craft some good questions and SPEAK UP AT THIS PANEL!!!! HOLY WOW!!! Make sure you get across to Lucasfilm what a raw deal we've all gotten. And film it for posting here!!!!!!

The main thing is STOP TELLING CUSTOMERS TO EXPECT PRODUCTS IN WEEKS WHEN THEY ARE STILL YEARS OUT!!!

Thank you so much, mluder!!!!!!

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

Fan made has been and will always be better. The failure of most of the companies that held and subsequently lost the license to me is proof enough of that.

There is a lot of issues with that statement. First of all "better" is subjective. Are you going tell me you like everything fan made on eBay and Etsy better than eFx, Anovos, etc..? Also, "better" to an individual is based on a person's wants and means. If you are on a limited budget, someone might consider a licensed prop with 90% accuracy at $200 is better than a 93% accuracy prop at $600. Or they like certain material over the other.

Also, we are talking about getting prop replica products to the consumer and the need to have 1000s of units made available. Some of these fan made items are maybe limited to 20 units. Hardly answering the demand of a huge fan base.

The fan made items I have in my collection are fantastic. I've often sold off licensed items so i can buy what I consider a "Better" fan made item. Even if there is plenty of new licensed products to come, I know I will still also be adding fan made items as well. There will always be (or at least should be) a place for fan made items. There are things that will never get made by a licensed company for different reasons. There will always be that demand for an item to be made differently because they think to do it differently is "better" and others will agree and some will not.

Also, there is a huge part of the Star Wars fandom not so much into the accuracy of prop replicas as much as they are into the collectibility of licensed products. They will choose a licensed replica over a fan made replica every time no matter if the fan made items is popularly considered better.

The other thing is that none of the previous companies had problems with selling their items. Icons and MR items were still in demand. MR under Corgi did not choose to renew their license, so it neither failed or was lost. I do not know the background behind Icons or Museum Replicas. As far as i am aware, neither had the license pulled. They may have either choose to not renew or outbid. But I am almost certain it was not because their products failed to sell.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

Well, Anovos just made a huge mistake.

 

[Psab keel]

I never said that their products were bad. Nor did I ever say that the demand or desire from fans (casual or hardcore) shouldn't be fulfilled by officially licensed products. I just think mass producing an item often leads to a dip in quality because there's no way to physically deliver the kind of accuracy hardcore fans desire at an affordable price point and keep that quality consistent. Almost every single mass produced item has some aftermarket add on or mods done to it to make it truly accurate.

Even MR had to make their props limited editions to keep the quality up to par. Do I wish that a company could deliver a reasonably priced item you wouldn't worry about carrying / wearing to a convention? Of course! Who wouldn't!? But efx tried it with their static lightsabers and they either didn't sell or they were very limited.

And no I wasn't referring to the vast majority of cheap garbage being sold on ebay or etsy when I was talking about fan made items. Believe me there is a lot of it and it's often sold not because the quality is good or accurate but because it's affordable and they can make a quick buck. I guarantee that a lot of it is made with cheap materials that won't hold up to regular use. That's not to suggest that it's all like that, but a LOT of it is. Neither am I knocking someone for trying to make a few bucks profit but if that's the only reason you're doing it and offering crap to your buyers then to hell with you.

I get that not everyone who wants to get into this hobby can't always afford the best stuff but I just get frustrated that too often people get screwed by buying three of the same inferior products when they could spend a little more upfront for one good quality item that would last them longer.

I was talking about the limited runs of items crafted by talented makers here on theRPF or other fan made or one offs or custom commissioned pieces as being better than mass produced items that hold a Lucasfilm stamp as often being far superior.

I personally don't care too much for officially licensed stuff because it always pales in comparison to what can be made by a fan who knows their stuff better than any company would or by me when I can make it myself. Not to mention that for me to use a licensed item in a finished costume I often feel that I am using a toy rather than a real prop.

Again it's just my take on it.

 

[oblagon]

It's not your place to tell other customers what they are or are not comfortable with.

God, you're insufferable. I'm not telling anyone to feel anything; you need to re-read what I wrote as nowhere does it say "you must".

 

[Inquisitor Peregrinus]

I can 537% guarantee ANOVOS knows customers are unhappy and a nonzero number with be at Celebration. Has anyone submitted to attend the panel? ReedPop are doing a lottery system for at least some of the panels. Not sure all. Sold my passes. This "Celebration" is looking like anything but, for me. So, not gonna waste my money. But I still catch notifications from the groups, and that was one thing mentioned.

Regardless, ANOVOS have to figure at least a couple irate customers will make it in to the panel. So if they don't have a proper update and at least semi-apology prepared to anticipatorily head off complaints at the mic, I'll be surprised.

 

[darthjones]

I so wish I was going to be in that room. I promise you I would get myself ejected from the room and convention - intentionally.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

God, you're insufferable. I'm not telling anyone to feel anything; you need to re-read what I wrote as nowhere does it say "you must".

I stand by my post. At the very least it’s not insulting to anyone.

Can you hear me up here on the high road?

 

[OCDChad]

Nothing can happen to Anovos until there contract is up, And then who is it you want to replace them? Who is going to make a offer on the license? It’s not like there were a lot of people jumping at the the high end costuming license before. The only other high end Star Wars costumes were Museum Replicas and they only did a few costumes.

For the most part, most people are pleased with the quality. It’s their communication to customers and there willingness to accept prepayments so early in a product’s production cycle that is causing them so much grief.

Why can't Disney just allow a cottage license type of arrangement where the revenue based on their property limits it to small businesses?

Make and sell whatever you want just don't be a mass producer.

 

[Halliwax]

Why can't Disney just allow a cottage license type of arrangement where the revenue based on their property limits it to small businesses?

Make and sell whatever you want just don't be a mass producer.

Disney = greed... they are a terrible company

 

[OCDChad]

The fact that the delivery estimate for the Anovos Imperial Royal Guard helmet is January 1, 2020-March 31, 2020 alone makes me never want to order from them.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

Why can't Disney just allow a cottage license type of arrangement where the revenue based on their property limits it to small businesses?

Make and sell whatever you want just don't be a mass producer.

That seems like nothing but trouble for Disney or anyone dealing in licensed goods and not really the best value for their property. That’s ok for food items but probably a good reason you don’t see it used for such things.

Disney = greed... they are a terrible company

That’s your opinion. I for one do not share it. I for one think Disney’s acquisition of LFL was the best thing that could have happened to Star Wars.

 

[OCDChad]

That seems like nothing but trouble for Disney or anyone dealing in licensed goods and not really the best value for their property. That’s ok for food items but probably a good reason you don’t see it used for such things.



That’s your opinion. I for one do not share it. I for one think Disney’s acquisition of LFL was the best thing that could have happened to Star Wars.

Well Disney isn't getting any money from all the Etsy and Ebay stores using their property. Some of these stores have been up for years without getting taken down. It seems to me they don't care and might as well just come out and allow it, that way more of the prop and costume makers can be more public.