1860 Colt Army: matching a Denix "stunt" to a firing "hero"

[Treadwell]

Ages ago, I bought a Denix 1860 Colt Army,

with the intention of converting it into a Captain Harlock Cosmo Dragoon.

Typically, I never did start on that project (wrong model gun anyway), but that turned out for the best, because this year I'm going to be shooting a short film set during the Civil War, and a Union sidearm features prominently.

The Denix would be okay for the most part (especially for a scene in which the gun is knocked out of a hand and goes tumbling across the ground), but in the film the gun is actually fired, so I needed a prop able to fire a powder load. So I used it as an excuse to buy my first "prop" that can fire real bullets (or lead balls, anyway):

Oh, yeah, this is going to the range! :love

So now I had a hero and a stunt. Next step: make the stunt look like the hero!

Here again is the Denix in its original state (or, rather, a pic of another one I swiped off the web, given that I forgot to take a pic of my own):

First, I used an emery board to sand off the diamond-shaped Denix logo. Then, with higher grades of sandpaper, I sanded off what I could of the chemical aging. Then I took it apart:

(At that point it would've been a good idea to take a photo of how the trigger and hammer mechanisms go back together. Would've been... :cry)

Next: Adventures With Aluminum Black

 

[Treadwell]

Re: WIP: Denix 1860 Colt Army mods

Next, I used some noxious Birchwood Casey stuff to strip the rest of the paint/bluing/black/whatever. Used it on the grips, too. Then some degreaser to remove THAT. Then water to remove the degreaser. Dried it off in the oven. Then dipped all metal parts in Aluminum Black, blotted dry, then worked in some 3-in-1 oil with a rag.

After oiling three of the parts:

Note how nasty the parts look before oiling.

Part of the grip frame and trigger guard are supposed to be brass. So I masked it off for painting:

After more oiling and the "brass" painting:

Above shows the hammer post-weathering with sandpaper, and the part in the middle was blotted with the remover stuff again to get rid of some of the finish.

Filled the screwholes in the grips with JB Weld...

sanded, and stained:

The filled holes are evident but I'm going to live with it.

Next: screws

 

[Luke Skyvader]

Re: WIP: Denix 1860 Colt Army mods

You're going to love the Uberti. Their a lot of fun to shoot.

 

[Treadwell]

Re: WIP: Denix 1860 Colt Army mods

Yup, looking forward to it. I originally bought a Pietta, but discovered it has stamping all along the right side of the barrel. Wouldn't do for the film (although few people would even see it or know it wasn't supposed to be there). Returned it, found an auction for a used Uberti...and it was a Pietta. Returned THAT, and the third time was the charm.

I have powder and balls and cleaning supplies, etc...just need to get out and shoot.

 

[Luke Skyvader]

Re: WIP: Denix 1860 Colt Army mods

Look into making paper cartridges before you go. It will speed up your loading time at the range.

 

[Treadwell]

Re: WIP: Denix 1860 Colt Army mods

The Denix lacks several screws in the grip frame. Three around the trigger, one on the bottom the grip fame...

...and two on the back under the hammer.

I found a good cosmetic match for the bottom one, but could not find anything in two hardware stores to match the others.

So I used nail heads. I turned them down:

...filed grooves across them, cut them off the nails, and blackened them.

Drilled shallow holes for them in the Denix:

And epoxied in the nail heads:

...as you can see, my eyeballing approach to symmetry left something to be desired.

See the square indentation at the bottom of the grip on the real one? It's for mounting a stock. I wasn't about to try to mill out a matching shape by hand, so I drew a square with a sharpie. Hard to see due to glare in the pic above.

The Denix hammer lacked a notch (which serves as a rear sight), and the knurling was different for the back part. I added a somewhat rough notch, and started to file additional lines into the knurling, when I realized I could never match the real one due to it not having horizontal lines like the Denix. So I just stopped after making two diagonal lines:

No biggie. This is a stunt prop, after all, not to be seen closeup.

 

[Treadwell]

I cleaned the charges out of six copper caps for use in firing the real one, and epoxied them to the nipples. The gun is supposed to look loaded. Later, I'm going to find some plastic marbles of the right size, paint them a dull grey and "load" them into the chambers. I will do the same for the real gun for any closeups it gets, rather than have it actually loaded (too dangerous). For shots in the film that show it firing (powder only!), I'm thinking about inserting photocopies of lead balls in there. :lol

I gave everything a shiny clear coat, sanded that back down a little in places, and put it back together.

Comparison to hero:

It has engraving on the cylinder that I cannot duplicate. I've considered drawing a simplified version of it on with a sharpie, though.

My "brass" paint doesn't really look it, but it is what it is. Denix does make a version of this gun with a brass trigger guard and a color scheme closer to what I had to recreate here, so someone go back in time a few years and tell me to order THAT one. The brass on the real one will develop a patina, though, which will match better.

Watch for clips with these guns in them during the next Academy Awards. :love

 

[SonOfPumpkinhead]

This is supposed to appear to fire lead balls and not bullets correct? Is there a similar or same model pistol that uses bullets? I'd love to find something like that...

 

[reaper63]

Jay, GREAT job on the pistol! Very nice!!!

One thing, I think you can avoid the Marbles, since I think they used to put Grease or wax over the chambers to keep the powder dry. You would never see the ball itself. But someone who knows period black powder better then I can confirm that.

As for a bullet firing version, the short answer is yes, there is. Many Civil War era Cap and ball pistols were converted to fire bullets. I believe the Colt Army was converted into a .38 Long Colt revolver with a change of the cylinder, a change the the cylinder back area to allow loading bullets and the replacing of the bullet press with a shell extractor, similar to the Colt Peacemaker.

 

[projectthx138]

AWESOME JOB!!!!! :love

 

[KramStaar]

A really interesting build thread - thanks for sharing. You have done a terrific job with the matching and I've no doubt you will be mightily and justifiably satisfied with the result…

The problem with the DENIX models in general is their 'soft' edges. For some reason they have been especially sloppy in the tooling and it shows around the sharp corners.

If I might make one or two suggestions??

Since you have already sprayed the brass paint onto the frame, it might be a good idea to get some 'rub and buff' and work over that area. Its not the most durable finish but it certainly will enhance the brass parts with a far more appealing finish. Since your paint will become the undercoat, if the Rub and Buff does rub off, its unlikely you will notice for a good while.

Another suggestion is the blued finish to the weapon. Surprisingly, the DENIX models take Blue Wonder very well and it will result in a really rich blued finish. Where you need to match the original its possible you might will be able to remove the blue down to the steel with some gentle sanding with a VERY fine paper. The blue is prone to scratching but in this case, I believe it will get your stunt stand-in looking really the part..

Regards

MARK

 

[Treadwell]

I used Aluminum Black because I had it on hand. I guess if I had to do it again I might spring for some Blue Wonder, but to do it now I'd have to start over from step 1. Not gonna! :lol FWIW, the hero is more black and charcoal than blue anyway.

Might do the rub n' buff thing, thanks!

Ed, yeah, I was aware that people today do the grease thing, what I wasn't sure of is if that was something they did back then. If it is, so much the better. But I'd need to find a way to create the greased look without using actual grease that could be rather messy in a prop that never gets fired.

 

[Matt009]

Cool thread, and very informative.

 

[wolfwalker]

They do make conversion cylinders for about all the black powder cap and ball revolvers (under the names R&D and Kirst Cartridge conversions). One is even made for the 1858 Remington (Pale Rider) that makes it look like its still a cap and ball but you can fire catridge blanks(for cowboy and civil war reenactors). Even ones for the big Walker and Dragoons in .45 long Colt.
I love these old guns. They're loud, messy but so much fun to shoot.

Sent from my SCH-S738C using Tapatalk

 

[Treadwell]

Ah, nice to have this bumped!

I did end up using rub-n-buff over the gold paint, it helped a bit.

I did take it to the range and enjoyed shooting real balls out of it prior to filming. Nice feel of power out of it...POW! Shot the short two years ago, and it hasn't been fired since those powder-only firings for the film.
I do want to get a conversion cylinder one day... it's fun at first loading it old style, but it's time consuming and a little dangerous, especially if you have to clean out a loaded chamber that didn't fire.

Here's the trailer for the short, but you won't see the stunt pistol. It's only in three action shots in the film that aren't in the trailer. We aren't making the entire film public yet, doing the festival thing.
Ocean Pond trailer 1, ver B on Vimeo

We took the two lead actors to the range to become familiar with firing weapons (a musket and a shotgun are also fired in the film). Here are they are firing the Colt: