STAR WARS Rebels new animated series!

[Bryancd]

Same here.

A lot of this is our own assumptions. Personally, I assumed that the rebel base was on yavin 4. I assumed that was the entire rebel fleet.

But by return of the jedi, I assumed that they created an alliance with the Mon calimari. Hence, the size of it and all the new fighters.

But that is just how I saw it.

Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk

yeah, and just because a single Mon Cal engineer built the B-Wing and is introduced here in Rebels doesn't mean he represents his entire species. It's entirely unclear when the Mon Cal's join the actual Rebellion and that has no bearing on when the Rebellion began to mass produce Quarrie's design. And guys, of course the character is named after Ralph.

 

[Inquisitor Peregrinus]

Also, A-Wings seem best suited to being interceptors, and we know B-Wings are overgunned capital-ship killers... Both of those seem more fleet-based roles than the multirole X- and Y-Wings, so I'm fine with them being off with the Rebel fleet during ANH and ESB (there'd be a nice addition to the final scene of the latter -- A-Wings on picket duty along with X- and Y-Wings...). Also, even with the A- and B-Wings appearing a few years earlier than people previously expected/thought, X- and Y-Wings still precede them by a goodly bit. I don't mind a little massaging of the timeline.

West End Games also had the Storm Commandos developed by the Empire post-Yavin, in response to the success of the "hit-and-fade" tactics of the Rebels. But the Republic Commando video game, the Clone Wars microseries, and Dark Horse's Star Wars: Republic comics all gave us commandos being part of the Grand Army from the get-go -- first Aggressive Reconnaissance and regular Republic Commandos, later merged into Imperial Commandos... with Storm Commandos working nicely as a later evolution on that theme, rather than coming out of whole cloth. And I didn't see anyone whinging about how the RC video game (for instance) introduced commandos way earlier than they were supposed to show up in Republic/Imperial forces.

Mon Calimari still develop the B-Wing in secret. I'm willing to bet, if and when it comes up, Jan Dodonna will still be the person responsible for the A-Wing. Both just earlier than previously assumed. It's all still true... from a certain point of view.

--Jonah

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

The great thing about star wars is that there was never any conversation about the tech. Other than the death star, no one was ever introduced to new tech. There was no techno babble.

They let the story and characters stand on their own without further exploration or justification. I'd say that the first time they ever did that was with the midichlorians. And we all cringed. Not just for absurdity, but because they were trying to give a backstory for something we just accepted.

Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk

That's another reason why I hated the old EU. So much technobabble in the books.

 

[Wolfsburg]

And as we already explained and proved... It's not.

Sure it is. I would be absolutely shocked if GL intended in 1977 for the Yavin 4 rebel base to be merely one "cell" and not the main Rebel base of operations, as is stated and implied numerous times in the movie.

I have a passing familiarity with the films and can't for the life of me recall any canonical aspect which spoke to the dispensation of ships in the Rebellion.

That's because there isn't. We're now forced to try to connect dots and fill gaps to try to explain away why some fighters, like the A-wing and B-wing, weren't at Yavin 4 because Filoni and the presumably the Story Group have decided to alter things for the sake of this show. They've taken something very simple and contorted it to fit their whims. Yavin 4 was the Rebel base and and A-wings and B-wings weren't there because they didn't exist yet. Just as simple as that. If we're just making stuff up, the idea that they were developed and acquired later as the Rebellion grew is a far better explanation than the ridiculous notion that some old Calamari guy built the B-wing (for example) in his back yard 5 years before ANH. Now to make any sense of why they weren't at Yavin 4, now the Yavin 4 base is merely "Dodonna's cell" and they were somewhere else. Dumb.

 

[Bryancd]

Sure it is. I would be absolutely shocked if GL intended in 1977 for the Yavin 4 rebel base to be merely one "cell" and not the main Rebel base of operations, as is stated and implied numerous times in the movie.



That's because there isn't. We're now forced to try to connect dots and fill gaps to try to explain away why some fighters, like the A-wing and B-wing, weren't at Yavin 4 because Filoni and the presumably the Story Group have decided to alter things for the sake of this show. They've taken something very simple and contorted it to fit their whims. Yavin 4 was the Rebel base and and A-wings and B-wings weren't there because they didn't exist yet. Just as simple as that. If we're just making stuff up, the idea that they were developed and acquired later as the Rebellion grew is a far better explanation than the ridiculous notion that some old Calamari guy built the B-wing (for example) in his back yard 5 years before ANH. Now to make any sense of why they weren't at Yavin 4, now the Yavin 4 base is merely "Dodonna's cell" and they were somewhere else. Dumb.

So you acknowledge it is no where in the film. You choose to have a specific interpretation and then become obstinant and obtsuse when those actually in charge of crafting the canon provide an actual backstory. That's dumb. And GL himself created a much more expansive version of the Rebellion in ROTJ because he had the $ and technology to do it, so he did with no explanation. One wasn't needed, it was completely superfulous to the story he was telling. And since you are also throwing a fit over electro staffs blocking lightsabers I can only assume you are pedantic as well.

 

[JoeG]

Dumb.

Its only dumb if you decide every little detail has to be explained. Thats just how you feel. Star Wars was never about spending time doing that. Heck, the story started off bringing the audience right into the middle of a galactic civil war. Except for the crawl there was very little explanation of everything that was going on. You just took it at face value and went along with the story. It wasn't until the EU came along that started attaching stories to every little background character and explaining why certain details happened the way they did.

 

[Bryancd]

Wolfsburg you clearly have a major beef with the story group and Dave Filloni based on your posts. I don't know if you are disgruntled EU fan or what but Dave Filloni is a huge asset to Star Wars and has created some wonderful content most fans are really enjoying. And I appreciate the Story Group for cleaning house and giving us finally a cohesive narrative.

 

[JoeG]

Thats kind of the stereotypical fanboy thing, isn't it? They come up with this idea in their head of how things should be and then cling to it as if its gospel. Then, when the story doesn't pan out that way, its the creator\storytellers fault. They're bad.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

Sure it is. I would be absolutely shocked if GL intended in 1977 for the Yavin 4 rebel base to be merely one "cell" and not the main Rebel base of operations, as is stated and implied numerous times in the movie.

That's because there isn't. We're now forced to try to connect dots and fill gaps to try to explain away why some fighters, like the A-wing and B-wing, weren't at Yavin 4 because Filoni and the presumably the Story Group have decided to alter things for the sake of this show. They've taken something very simple and contorted it to fit their whims. Yavin 4 was the Rebel base and and A-wings and B-wings weren't there because they didn't exist yet. Just as simple as that. If we're just making stuff up, the idea that they were developed and acquired later as the Rebellion grew is a far better explanation than the ridiculous notion that some old Calamari guy built the B-wing (for example) in his back yard 5 years before ANH. Now to make any sense of why they weren't at Yavin 4, now the Yavin 4 base is merely "Dodonna's cell" and they were somewhere else. Dumb.

No, dumb is thinking that intentions are canon.

Lucas had a lot of intentions as he continued to develop his saga and he changed them as he got new ideas or decided which way made the best story. But he never locked himself into settling for ideas just because they were first. For example. Lucas had Splinter of the Minds Eye created to be a low budget sequel during the filming Star Wars (A New Hope) fearing that he may have to fund it himself. But since A New Hope was a success, he could do another big budget film. So by your line of reasoning, since Splinter was intended to be the sequel to A New Hope, that intention makes it the canon sequel and The Empire Strikes Back is stepping all over the canon.

Intentions are not canon no matter who says or thinks it. It may give us insight to what the story developers were thinking and what other aspects of the Star Wars universe might be like, but until they insert it into canon material such as a movie, TV show, novel, or comic, it is not canon.

 

[astroboy]

Sure it is. I would be absolutely shocked if GL intended in 1977 for the Yavin 4 rebel base to be merely one "cell" and not the main Rebel base of operations, as is stated and implied numerous times in the movie.



That's because there isn't. We're now forced to try to connect dots and fill gaps to try to explain away why some fighters, like the A-wing and B-wing, weren't at Yavin 4 because Filoni and the presumably the Story Group have decided to alter things for the sake of this show. They've taken something very simple and contorted it to fit their whims. Yavin 4 was the Rebel base and and A-wings and B-wings weren't there because they didn't exist yet. Just as simple as that. If we're just making stuff up, the idea that they were developed and acquired later as the Rebellion grew is a far better explanation than the ridiculous notion that some old Calamari guy built the B-wing (for example) in his back yard 5 years before ANH. Now to make any sense of why they weren't at Yavin 4, now the Yavin 4 base is merely "Dodonna's cell" and they were somewhere else. Dumb.

I really get the impression in Jedi that it is a newly formed alliance with the calimari. And considering their capital ships, those guys bring a lot to the table. It makes perfect sense that the a-wings and b-wings are part of that. They aren't necessarily new ships. Heck, they look just as worn out as the x-wings

 

[Bryancd]

Well, when it comes to this stuff I understand the desire to see the story unfold in the manner you imagine but it's an impossible task to accommodate that. The Story Group has to craft a narrative that makes sense and is interesting and new. There is NO ONE on this planet currently who is more versed in what GL had in mind for the post prequel Satr Wars than him. He sat at George's side for 6 years of Clone Wars and went to Star Wars school with George as the professor.

- - - Updated - - -

I really get the impression in Jedi that it is a newly formed alliance with the calimari. And considering their capital ships, those guys bring a lot to the table. It makes perfect sense that the a-wings and b-wings are part of that. They aren't necessarily new ships. Heck, they look just as worn out as the x-wings

Yes,and like I mentioned, just because a Mon Cal developed the B-Wing doesn't mean the Mon Cal race had any ownership over it. That's an assumption and construct solely based on the EU.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

I really get the impression in Jedi that it is a newly formed alliance with the calimari. And considering their capital ships, those guys bring a lot to the table. It makes perfect sense that the a-wings and b-wings are part of that. They aren't necessarily new ships. Heck, they look just as worn out as the x-wings

Yes. Or they could have been part of the alliance for a while but simply operating away from other Rebel Fleet assets. Return of the Jedi could mark the first time the Calimari cell fought side by side with cells such as Leia's. However I would be very surprised if we do not see how the Calimari are brought into the rebellion during Rebels. It may not happen soon, but I would speculate it will happen in the series.

 

[Bryancd]

Yes. Or they could have been part of the alliance for a while but simply operating away from other Rebel Fleet assets. Return of the Jedi could mark the first time the Calimari cell fought side by side with cells such as Leia's. However I would be very surprised if we do not see how the Calimari are brought into the rebellion during Rebels. It may not happen soon, but I would speculate it will happen in the series.

Or in ancillary material like books or comics. I think Rebels has a short shelf life and won't go much beyond 3 Seasons. And that's not a criticism of the show, I think Disney wants to keep moving around the cartoon timeline.

 

[astroboy]

We also have to realize that there's a couple of years between each movie

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

Or in ancillary material like books or comics. I think Rebels has a short shelf life and won't go much beyond 3 Seasons. And that's not a criticism of the show, I think Disney wants to keep moving around the cartoon timeline.

I expect it to go for a while.

 

[Wolfsburg]

So you acknowledge it is no where in the film. You choose to have a specific interpretation and then become obstinant and obtsuse when those actually in charge of crafting the canon provide an actual backstory. That's dumb. And GL himself created a much more expansive version of the Rebellion in ROTJ because he had the $ and technology to do it, so he did with no explanation. One wasn't needed, it was completely superfulous to the story he was telling. And since you are also throwing a fit over electro staffs blocking lightsabers I can only assume you are pedantic as well.

My "interpretation" is largely influenced by the movies. I agree an explanation wasn't needed. I always thought it was pretty self-explanatory what was going on but I guess you guys are proving me wrong and need someone to make up something for you.

Its only dumb if you decide every little detail has to be explained. Thats just how you feel. Star Wars was never about spending time doing that. Heck, the story started off bringing the audience right into the middle of a galactic civil war. Except for the crawl there was very little explanation of everything that was going on. You just took it at face value and went along with the story. It wasn't until the EU came along that started attaching stories to every little background character and explaining why certain details happened the way they did.

I'm actually just the opposite. I don't want every little detail explained and find a lot of the explanations we're getting to be pretty silly.

@Wolfsburg you clearly have a major beef with the story group and Dave Filloni based on your posts. I don't know if you are disgruntled EU fan or what but Dave Filloni is a huge asset to Star Wars and has created some wonderful content most fans are really enjoying. And I appreciate the Story Group for cleaning house and giving us finally a cohesive narrative.

I'm not a fan of the EU stories per se, and am frankly not someone who wants to have everything explained, but a lot of the longstanding EU background explanations for some of this stuff is far better than what Filoni and the Story Group have come up with so far, in my opinion. It made more sense to me anyways. That said, the fast majority of my "interpretations" have been from the movies themselves. I know he has some fanboys here that will unquestioningly swallow whatever he feeds them but Filoni is a very mixed bag and nothing terribly special. He has moments of brilliance but generally all he's done is muddled waters that should've been left alone. He seems to have difficulty creating narratives that don't interfere with existing canon. He takes something that is perfectly clear and immutable, from my point of view based on what we see or even don't see in the movies, and leans far too heavily on the "true...from a certain point of view" angle to try to milk content for story material. I am sure he could say that X-wings are pooped out by celestial unicorns and some of you would gobble it up like he's some sort of SW savior. That's fine but I will continue to have my opinions on the matter.

No, dumb is thinking that intentions are canon.

Lucas had a lot of intentions as he continued to develop his saga and he changed them as he got new ideas or decided which way made the best story. But he never locked himself into settling for ideas just because they were first. For example. Lucas had Splinter of the Minds Eye created to be a low budget sequel during the filming Star Wars (A New Hope) fearing that he may have to fund it himself. But since A New Hope was a success, he could do another big budget film. So by your line of reasoning, since Splinter was intended to be the sequel to A New Hope, that intention makes it the canon sequel and The Empire Strikes Back is stepping all over the canon.

Intentions are not canon no matter who says or thinks it. It may give us insight to what the story developers were thinking and what other aspects of the Star Wars universe might be like, but until they insert it into canon material such as a movie, TV show, novel, or comic, it is not canon.

Well then, I would far rather respect what GL intended back then, even if it wasn't spelled out, like some of you apparently need.

Thats kind of the stereotypical fanboy thing, isn't it? They come up with this idea in their head of how things should be and then cling to it as if its gospel. Then, when the story doesn't pan out that way, its the creator\storytellers fault. They're bad.

Well, the movies are "gospel" as far as I'm concerned and my "idea" of how things should be are from simply watching the movies themselves. It really isn't anything more than that. I'm a guy that much prefers the KISS explanation of things. Less is more and all that. Yavin 4 is THE rebel base in ANH, Luke was the very last of the Jedi in ROTJ, etc...That sort of thing. That's much more in keeping with the mythological nature of the saga.

I really get the impression in Jedi that it is a newly formed alliance with the calimari. And considering their capital ships, those guys bring a lot to the table.

I agree. That's my impression too and it's a very logical one, in my opinion. Considering we'd never seen the Mon Cals or their cruisers before ROTJ, it's pretty obvious that is what we're supposed to infer, but some here need to have everything spelled out and have guys like Dave Filoni formulate some convoluted or ill conceived tale of what "really" went on. That's fine but it just surprises me how much they apparently need him.

 

[astroboy]

Frankly, none of these ships should be new. I never understood why we didn't see x-wings used in the prequel trilogy. And by the time of rebels, we should see proper at-at's and at-st's rather than these mcquarrie concepts.

 

[Mara Jade's Father]

...Well then, I would far rather respect what GL intended back then, even if it wasn't spelled out, like some of you apparently need.

...I'm a guy that much prefers the KISS explanation of things. Less is more and all that.

We do not need it spelled out. We simply are willing to take in new information and except that some thing we previously thought were simply assumptions on our part. However you hold a grudge against people or organizations who dare go against your narrow vision of the Star Wars universe.

I'm starting to understand the reason why you need a story to be kept simple. Maybe the old Ewok cartoons are up to your speed. :lol

 

[Wolfsburg]

No grudge here! You need things explained to you and that's fine.

KISS is always the best.

 

[Bryancd]

We don't need to have everything explained, we afford the storytellers the opportunity to tell their story without throwing a hissy fit. It's a car more nuanced and thoughtful position...and really a much more clever. And Dave is creating new stories kids and parents alike are enjoying and ensuring the future of the franchise, you're just complaining on the Internet.