I'd love to say more but I will wait for the post release thread. What I will say is Pegg is hardly one to lecture others as he has done.
Star Trek Beyond
- Thread starter Bryancd
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I'd love to say more but I will wait for the post release thread. What I will say is Pegg is hardly one to lecture others as he has done.
I'd like to see this review. Got a link?
Mola Rob
Sr Member
After the first two movies this is about what I expected, maybe a little bit worse than I expected. This will be the first Star Trek movie, if you can even call it that, ever that I will not see in the theater. I'd be sad if only for the fact that these movies are just throwaway cheap thrills summer nonsense and are Star Trek in name only. Pegg can rant and rave about what a huge fan he is but it's clear that he either doesn't understand Trek or was so constrained by the demands of Paramount that his input was worthless. I've never wanted a movie to flop so bad in my life.
Oh, that has a long tradition. In TOS they didn't look like Klingons either. :lol
Attachments
They don't talk about that in front of outsiders.
Yep, after reading that review let's revisit Pegg's comments and try to sync that with what he actually did when he had his hands on the Trek steering wheel....
http://hotair.com/archives/2015/05/23/simon-pegg-big-budget-blockbusters-are-infantilizing-us/
Before Star Wars, the films that were box-office hits were The Godfather, Taxi Driver, Bonnie and Clyde and The French Connection – gritty, amoral art movies. Then suddenly the onus switched over to spectacle and everything changed.
…
It is a kind of dumbing down in a way. Because it’s taking our focus away from real-world issues. Films used to be about challenging, emotional journeys or moral questions that might make you walk away and re-evaluate how you felt about… whatever. Now we’re walking out of the cinema really not thinking about anything, other than the fact that the Hulk just had a fight with a robot.
When the Internet’s reaction was less than positive, he then took to his personal blog with a mea culpa:…
It is a kind of dumbing down in a way. Because it’s taking our focus away from real-world issues. Films used to be about challenging, emotional journeys or moral questions that might make you walk away and re-evaluate how you felt about… whatever. Now we’re walking out of the cinema really not thinking about anything, other than the fact that the Hulk just had a fight with a robot.
The ‘dumbing down’ comment came off as a huge generalisation by an A-grade asshorn. I did not mean that science fiction or fantasy are dumb, far from it. How could I say that? In the words of Han Solo, “Hey, it’s me!”
While he goes on at great length about the rise of the summer blockbuster essentially keeping his generation from growing up to deal with the real world, ultimately he boils his point down to this:
I guess what I meant was, the more spectacle becomes the driving creative priority, the less thoughtful or challenging the films can become.
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Well, if thats how the final battle goes down and feel justified in not going to see it. I love Star Trek but havent been too enamoured with JJTrek and this one seems to seal the deal. How the whole universe can be sooo different from one evnet some 30 years previous makes no sense. If you wanted it to be sooooo different fine, start over but then why have original Spock in it at all. If it was just pull more number then thats a cheap shot. It seems to have lost its way and become a generic sci fi romp. Certainly not the front running franchise it use to be. I know things have to move on but really? This seems to be moving backwards not forwards, adding things for giggles like drunk frat boys thinking up pranks to play.
I think we need a board of independent movie goers, a Sci Fi Council if you will that can put their approval stamp on movies. Not essential for movie makers but to give them some credibility and something we can rely on to know that they havent just thrown something together as a cash grab and actually cared about and listened to the fans. Their ideas and concerns, take some ideas in board and actually make something everyone can be proud of.
Ahhhhhhhh what a wonderful Sci Fi world that would be..... if only.
I think we need a board of independent movie goers, a Sci Fi Council if you will that can put their approval stamp on movies. Not essential for movie makers but to give them some credibility and something we can rely on to know that they havent just thrown something together as a cash grab and actually cared about and listened to the fans. Their ideas and concerns, take some ideas in board and actually make something everyone can be proud of.
Ahhhhhhhh what a wonderful Sci Fi world that would be..... if only.
SmilingOtter
Master Member
Great. Now Kirk's comment "Let's make some noise" makes sense. Horrible, ludicrous sense... :wacko
I've seen every ST movie in the theater, with the possible exception of TMP (I was nine when it came out) and don't want that streak to end, but I also don't have any excitement about seeing this one...
I've seen every ST movie in the theater, with the possible exception of TMP (I was nine when it came out) and don't want that streak to end, but I also don't have any excitement about seeing this one...
Kind of the same here. When I moved the US for Sweden as a teenager in the 80s, Trek was virtually unknown here. I had a few Trek VHS tapes with me that I had to get converted from NTSC to PAL (which cost a fortune back then) so that I'd have something to watch. I had to travel to London to see Generations! So when they finally started showing all the films here, I made it a point to see every single one. But now I'm kinda torn. I want to see Trek in the theater and while I think the nuTreks are kinda fun-but-dumb action romps, I also don't want to support the current dumbing down of Star Trek.
I was just looking at NASA's Juno page... then I went and looked at the local newspapers to be met with the total contrast of human progress and existence. The Trek of yesterday was so clearly inspired by the former, whereas nuTrek caters to the latter.
A lot of folks (not me) thought Insurrection was boring, but if you compare it to nuTrek it was still very in keeping with established themes in Roddenberry's universe. Even Nemesis, which flirted with action-blockbusterism (no doubt due to Stuart Baird's past as a second unit action director), still contained more old-school Trek themes than these new ones do.
So I don't know what I'm going to do yet.
glunark
Sr Member
So way star trek films have ended.
1 with a glowing space hug.
2 because the bad guy never moved his ship up or down
3 by kicking someone off a cliff
4 by whale song
5 by firing a photon torpedo at god
6 by Scotty shooting someone
7 with stock footage from the last film
8 with Data smashing a tube
9 **** blows up, Data is a flotation device.
10 bad guy throws himself on a spike, after two space ships collide with neither of them exploding
2009 enterprise pulls away from a black hole by jettisoning its warp core
STID Kirk fixes warp core by kicking it, dies briefly.
Tell me again how playing music loudly to explode other ships is worse than anything we have seen before?.
1 with a glowing space hug.
2 because the bad guy never moved his ship up or down
3 by kicking someone off a cliff
4 by whale song
5 by firing a photon torpedo at god
6 by Scotty shooting someone
7 with stock footage from the last film
8 with Data smashing a tube
9 **** blows up, Data is a flotation device.
10 bad guy throws himself on a spike, after two space ships collide with neither of them exploding
2009 enterprise pulls away from a black hole by jettisoning its warp core
STID Kirk fixes warp core by kicking it, dies briefly.
Tell me again how playing music loudly to explode other ships is worse than anything we have seen before?.
Wow, Beyond reviews are killing it at RT, 90% for all critics and top critics. Looking forward to this.
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_trek_beyond/
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_trek_beyond/
Solo4114
Master Member
Literally laughed out loud at this. Particularly "Dies briefly."
Well played, sir. Well played, indeed.
7. Stock footage from the last film FTW!
Amateur.
1. Glowing Space hug.
- Yeah, it was pretty random and made little to no sense.
2. because the bad guy never moved his ship up or down.
- That's a point that you cannot call worse than what Beyond does. That resolution helped illustrate how there will always be a disadvantage when you play against your opponent's strengths. Khan has commanding the Reliant for what, a few days? How long has Kirk commanded the Enterprise? Also, you left out Spock's sacrifice.
3. By kicking someone off a cliff.
- That totally fits in with Star Trek. Kirk always finds himself in a hand-to-hand fight quite often.
4. By whale song
- As silly as it might sound, the whales actually worked in this case because it focused on what we still don't know about whales. We know they can save the day, but we don't know exactly how they do it. The film is very aware of this and thankfully managed to not make it worse by adding in subtitles to the Whale Songs that the studio execs wanted. Plus whales being extinct in the future was a good way of illustrating the differences between the past and present times of humanity in Star Trek.
5. By firing a photon torpedo at god
- First, Sybok tried to give it a therapy session. Second, it wasn't god. Third, the torpedo didn't do it in. Fourth, it was a weaker Klingon Bird of Prey Disruptor that did it in, manned by Spock no less. That's not defending Star Trek V mind you. Just making the point that the film is a lot dumber than you're giving it credit for.
6 by Scotty shooting someone
- What about Spock and McCoy trying to rig a torpedo to chase gas before the Enterprise gets destroyed? What about Kirk heroically jumping high in the air to save the President of the Federation from a sniper? Or Kirk's speech about how different societies being frightened of having to deal with each other? Scotty shooting West was more of a "Oh, one last thing" and was by no means the big finale. Cripes, West was aiming for a one-shot character for crying out loud.
7. With stock footage from the last film
- I think "Going back in time for a fist-fight rematch with an old man on a catwalk" is more damning than using stock footage. And if you're still hinging on the battle with the Bird of Prey to be the film's ending battle, just go with technobabble. When the Enterprise has weapons that could stop a Borg cube for a minute, there is really no reason to technobabble your way out of fighting a century old design ship that has less mass to it than one of your ship's nacelles.
8. With Data smashing a tube
Not before Picard smashed his little ships.
9. **** blows up, Data is a flotation device.
- I got one that's better. The technology hating hippies win.
10. bad guy throws himself on a spike, after two space ships collide with neither of them exploding
- THE WHOLE MOVIE.
2009 enterprise pulls away from a black hole by jettisoning its warp core
- Not before Kirk risked the Enterprise to kill Nero when his ship was already being destroyed by said black hole. Surprised Kirk didn't say "If we kill Nero before the black hole does, we get an achievement!"
STID Kirk fixes warp core by kicking it, dies briefly.
- You do not give NuKirk credit for his not-so sacrifice and not bring up Spock's sacrifice in TWOK. And come on. Khan may not have gone up or down in TWOK, but at least he didn't demand that the Enterprise send him TORPEDOES. Also, sacrifice moment is ruined by a forced "KHAAN!" shoutout and a fist-fight.
Because when Star Trek does stupid, it's the kind of stupid that only Star Trek can do. Mars Attacks, which was a parody that played this tactic for comedic effect. Is Star Trek really going to sink to that level that we have they have to resort to plot devices from parodies?
I haven't seen the film yet so I have no idea if the execution will be or if the film will be good enough in general that I just won't care. I think it will be the latter since that's the impression I'm getting from the reviews.
I have seen em all, and reading through that list I now realize I really don't remember them well, AT ALL.
Costco has a blu-ray set of all of them... I gotta throw down 40 bucks and have a watch.
Funny as a kid I would watch "Battle Beyond the Stars" over and over, but you couldn't get me to sit through Wrath of Kahn. Just tried rewatching BBTS and I couldn't do it.
I'm sure Trek will fare differently.
Costco has a blu-ray set of all of them... I gotta throw down 40 bucks and have a watch.
Funny as a kid I would watch "Battle Beyond the Stars" over and over, but you couldn't get me to sit through Wrath of Kahn. Just tried rewatching BBTS and I couldn't do it.
I'm sure Trek will fare differently.
KrangPrime
Master Member
we all know classical is key music in star trek lore. they should have played Beethoven or something.
#7 did get a laugh out of me though. it was a **** poor way to send off the great duras sisters with stock footage.
normally you can make something that sounds terrible on paper work great on film, especially if you have a good movie surrounding it to distract you.
but having the universe saved by
The Beastie Boys?
add to that the rest of the stuff the JJ verse gets wrong, and it just adds to the angst ;o).
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