George Lucas on the meaning of Star Wars

themes

ANH - Hero's Journey - Joseph Campbell
ESB - Raiders of the lost Ark - chase movie ... in space
ROTJ - shameless merchandising (Lucas before: "I'm sick of this franchise - let's see what I can get away with." -> Lucas after: "OMG they loved this thing, too. I clearly can't do anything wrong! This is awesome")

PM - ILM CGI showcase (Lucas before: "This can't lose. It's going to be better than ROTJ for sure. They love anything I do - plus I have great new FX to promote ILM." ... -> Lucas after: "OMG they hate me. This sucks!")
AOTC - ILM CGI showcase (Lucas: "let's just get this over with.")
ROTS - ILM CGI showcase
 
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I don't think George ever consciously phoned it in. I don't think he ever didn't care about what he was doing. To the contrary, I think all the films show that he cared a great deal about what he was doing, especially the prequels. The thing is, I think he got distracted by the whiz-bang tech he was using, and it ends up resulting in a kind of unfocused story that feels almost like a prologue, a first chapter, and then a middle and end chapter smushed into a single film. But I don't get the sense that he had a "Whatever, let's just get it over with" attitude, and I think he really took it to heart that there was such push-back on TPM. When he talks about fans falling in love with the "wrong versions" of his movies, or about how they're "his stories" and such, to me, that's a lot of defensiveness being directed at irate fans. And that tells me he cares. You don't get defensive if you don't care.
 
Not really a double-post, but to give you an idea of what I meant in my long post a couple above... Just the decompressing of Jedi back into four films. I went with a lot of the plot points we got, a lot of what was in earlier drafts and brainstorming sessions, shuffled around episode titles and even borrowed some from the EU*, some came from understanding the universe better than George does, and some is just a sense of what makes a good story honed by years of experience and practice.

[*Actually, my titles for nuEpisodes I-VI are: A Long Time Ago, The Approaching Storm, Agents of Chaos, The Clone War, Revenge of the Sith, and The Fall of the Republic. Y'all let me know if you want thumbnails of those, too. *heh* ;) ]

EPISODE IX -- RETURN OF THE JEDI
Leia, Lando, and Chewie concoct and enact a plan to bust Han out of Jabba's palace. It goes sideways. Leia and Chewie are captured. Lando can't act without getting himself captured or killed. Han is thawed in the process and thrown in the cell with Chewie while Jabba plans his next move. The droids show up, heralding the arrival of Luke, which comes as a surprise to Leia and Lando. Luke shows up wearing some of Obi-Wan's old robes to sell the Jedi thing. Rancor. Sarlacc. No Boba Fett. Sandsotrm scene. Han thanks Luke. Luke says he has to go somewhere else, and Leia says to hurry because the entire fleet should be assembled by now. Scene between Luke and Yoda, and Yoda's death, followed by Luke's conversation with Obi-Wan. Luke heads back to his X-Wing, where Artoo is borderline frantic, and projects a message from Leia saying there's bad news. It seems the Empire has been secretly building a new Death Star, purportedly bigger and more powerful than the first, and probably without the flaw that let them destroy the first one.

EPISODE X -- THE PHANTOM MENACE
Vader arrives at the construction site (aboard the Executor, thank you) to motivate them back on schedule, has Force-y conversation with Luke, who comes out of it in his quarters on the Rebel flagship in the middle of the briefing summons. General Madine is talking to a dozen or so spec-ops types, including Han and Leia. The General is saying they have a lead and need a commando team to go rendezvous with field agents to track down the lead and get what info they can back to the fleet. Rst of the film is something of a suspense thriller in space, if you will. Our Heroes' efforts ultimately yield a location and the fact that there are, in fact, two Death Stars being built -- one further along than the other. They escape back to the fleet. Many Bothans die. And the planning of the final assault begins.

EPISODE XI -- OUR MOST DESPERATE HOUR
The location gleaned at great cost is the next planet in from Coruscant, which has been kept as a nature preserve and former vacation spot in the waning days of the Republic. The entire system has been an intel black hole for years, hence why it took so long to discover this. The Empire is using Wookiees as slave labor for the heavy construction, holding their children hostage to force them to work. A two-stage attack has a commando team going in first to get the innocents out of harm's way and see to as many defensive systems as possible, then the fleet will jump in to do their own version of Base Delta Zero on the Death Stars and jump out again before the Imperial fleet can respond. Our Heroes free the Wookiee kids, who help them confound the garrisoned troops. Luke realizes Vader is close and can sense his presence, so turns himself in. The fleet arrives. It's a trap. I won't go into the twist. Narrow victory, but Luke is on his way to the Emperor's Palace. Leia doesn't want to leave without him, but they're about to get an Imperial Starfleet on their butts and have to bail.

EPISODE XII -- THE BALANCE OF THE FORCE
This one has more of a psycho-thriller feel. More time and thus more subtlety in the Emperor trying to twist Luke to the Dark Side, playing him and Vader off each other. Stuff transpires that's hard to get into here, but ultimately Luke resists, the Emperor starts slowly killing him, Vader intervenes at cost of his own life, Luke leaves with his father's body and sets the palace's power systems to blow. Poignant coda, as everyone wonders what's next for them. No Ewok celebration, which will please some and infuriate others. No crowds cheering in the streets across the galaxy, and certainly not on Imperial Center.

Kinda hard to get a proper feel from them from paragraph plot summaries, but hopefully that will at least convey the gist.

--Jonah
 
I don't think George ever consciously phoned it in. I don't think he ever didn't care about what he was doing. To the contrary, I think all the films show that he cared a great deal about what he was doing, especially the prequels. The thing is, I think he got distracted by the whiz-bang tech he was using, and it ends up resulting in a kind of unfocused story that feels almost like a prologue, a first chapter, and then a middle and end chapter smushed into a single film. But I don't get the sense that he had a "Whatever, let's just get it over with" attitude, and I think he really took it to heart that there was such push-back on TPM. When he talks about fans falling in love with the "wrong versions" of his movies, or about how they're "his stories" and such, to me, that's a lot of defensiveness being directed at irate fans. And that tells me he cares. You don't get defensive if you don't care.
You caught me in a moment of hyperbolic cynicism.
Of course you're right. I don't disagree.
I don't think PM was that bad. I think he did craft it with care.
I didn't feel as much of his voice in ROTJ, AOTC or ROTS.
And as critical as I can be I still love the man for what he's done.
 
The modern myth he was referring to is called The Heroes Journey. You can see it in Star Wars and within the trilogy itself.

http://www.thewritersjourney.com/hero's_journey.htm

No it is not. "The heroes journey" is what all mythology has in common according to Joseph Campbell who coined that description. George Lucas based his story on that concept when he found out that the story telling structure of a 1930ies serial did not work to his satisfaction. Look at the first drafts of Star Wars.

Describing it like he did in the interview is IMO a bit dishonest, since SW would not have been what we know and love without Joseph Campbell. And ESB would not have been what we know and love without Irvin Kershner and Leigh Brackett and Lawrence Kasdan.

The funny thing is that, although GL tried to apply the story telling structure of THJ to TPM, he fell back into his wayof old of just showing action after action after action like pearls on a string, and that is why we have that simpleton of a movie TPM.
 
*reads above post* Hm... Maybe I should post my thumbnails of the Adventures of Obi-Wan Kenobi, just to show what those six films could possibly have been... *heh*

--Jonah
 
Interesting comments Inquisitor Peregrinus (and stories also). Right you are with the work of Marcia Lucas, would be great if we could hear what she has to say about the films.
 
Interesting comments Inquisitor Peregrinus (and stories also). Right you are with the work of Marcia Lucas, would be great if we could hear what she has to say about the films.

And Gary Kurtz.

I always thought he was right about having Han die in ROTJ. The most selfish becomes the most self sacrificing.
 
You mean that he only did ROTJ to sell toys? Yeah, I doubt that was his motivation. I suspect it -- along with all the other MASSIVE amounts of merchandising (seriously, guys, if you weren't around then, it was INSANE. The late 70s and early 80s were all Star Wars, all the time, if you were a little kid) -- was a nice cherry on top of his work, but not his real focus.
 
Yeah I was a freshman in high school in '83 so not collecting toys but reading and following SW. And in the years since I have never read anything said by GL that would indicate merchandising even remotely was part of his creative narrative. It's an easy cynical view but that doesn't make it accurate.
 
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Pretty much everything has been written and I've never heard him say that toys were a focus. The only thing he ever said was it would be cool if they made a R2 cookie jar, Chewie mug, etc.
 
"But 1980 was also the year that Kurtz and Lucas realized the Jedi universe wasn't big enough for the both of them. "I could see where things were headed," Kurtz said. "The toy business began to drive the [Lucasfilm] empire. It's a shame. They make three times as much on toys as they do on films. It's natural to make decisions that protect the toy business but that's not the best thing for making quality films."
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He added: "The first film and 'Empire' were about story and character but I could see that George's priorities were changing."
 
Looking back, I think people lose track of how much SW was shaped by the time & place it came from. We all know there was the Joseph Campbell underpinnings, and the "used space" look was a new idea, and nobody had made a SW/Flash Gordon movie in a long time. But I don't think that is doing ANH justice.

ANH was a big loud statement at America in the early 1970s. America was a depressed dark place. The last 50-100 years had seemingly cut the cord with our ancestors. Suddenly we were living differently, inventing new stuff with all sorts of implications, dramatically changing our social rules, sending men off the planet itself, etc.

GL talks about ANH being an "experiment" to see if people still reacted to the Hero's Journey like they used to. I think what we miss today is that in 1973 he wasn't imagining his movie being a reminder to people that the old stuff still applied - he felt like it was an open question whether or not people would still react the same way as their ancestors. That's how much it felt like things had changed. That's the world that GL was in when he dreamed up ANH.
 
"But 1980 was also the year that Kurtz and Lucas realized the Jedi universe wasn't big enough for the both of them. "I could see where things were headed," Kurtz said. "The toy business began to drive the [Lucasfilm] empire. It's a shame. They make three times as much on toys as they do on films. It's natural to make decisions that protect the toy business but that's not the best thing for making quality films."
http://articles.latimes.com/images/pixel.gif
He added: "The first film and 'Empire' were about story and character but I could see that George's priorities were changing."

Yea, idk if anybody else feels this way, but Kurtz to me has always come across as a little bitter that he didn't get his way in the end and this sounds to me like more of that.
 
Yea, idk if anybody else feels this way, but Kurtz to me has always come across as a little bitter that he didn't get his way in the end and this sounds to me like more of that.

Yeah, again I have never heard GL himself imply that merchandising was driving his decisions.
 
No, it just seems antithetical to everything I have ever seen or read about the man and his production of all of SW. And if anyone would have dug out any evidence of that it would have been Rinzler.
 
I am of two minds on the idea of GL compromising the movies to sell toys.

On the one hand I think it totally goes against his creative principles for a studio to push that kind of thing on a filmmaker.

On the other hand I think GL would feel that he has every right to do that by choice, as the independent studio/auteur that he was.


Moe than anything else though, I don't think it mattered. GL's natural creative inclinations already lent themselves to merchandising better than any other filmmaker I can think of. He was brewing up billions in toy ideas just by doing what came naturally. He would have wanted SW filled with interesting spaceships & aliens & robots just as much even if there had never been a dollar in it for him.
 
I am of two minds on the idea of GL compromising the movies to sell toys.

On the one hand I think it totally goes against his creative principles for a studio to push that kind of thing on a filmmaker.

On the other hand I think GL would feel that he has every right to do that by choice, as the independent studio/auteur that he was.


Moe than anything else though, I don't think it mattered. GL's natural creative inclinations already lent themselves to merchandising better than any other filmmaker I can think of. He was brewing up billions in toy ideas just by doing what came naturally. He would have wanted SW filled with interesting spaceships & aliens & robots just as much even if there had never been a dollar in it for him.

Very true. He did luck out insofar as he retained merchandising right for the films, but that was literally dumb luck.
 
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