Film Scores and Movie Music

Fawbish

Fawbish

Sr Member

This just popped up on my feed, gave it a watch. Really interesting! And before I get flak, this isn't a Marvel v whoever thread.

Interestingly, it would be good to know peoples reaction here at 1 minute in to the video. Because I totally get where they are coming from, but the Captain America theme popped right into my head, so I was screaming for the people to come up with something. Of course there is a bit of an argument to be made against the video creator in that he is using for contrast films that are entrenched in the consciousness (although most of these are young people...) and MCU, while beloved, isn't quite entrenched yet. I didn't realise other films were so similar to each other though, and I bet that happens a lot. Gonna be on the look out now. Also the "temp" thing - I hadn't considered how long an editor would be using other music instead of the score before. The more you know.

So...

1) Favourite marvel music theme? (Iron Man flight test - the badass guitar as the mkII does the surface checks...so good, Captain America trilogy definitely has probably the best and most memorable score for me, Avengers 1 main theme is excellent)

2) Favourite music film theme in modern Superhero films? (I know a lot of people will be citing 1978 Superman, all hail the Williams! but hence the modern requisite - mine is the Man of Steel theme, very closely followed by the Kickass score - something about that score really, really gets me going, very inspiring (appropriate to the film message))

3) Favourite music film theme in any film? (Harry Potter is probably the most tied in to my nostalgia and emotional centre)

This will double as a recommendation thread, as I like finding out/rediscovering soundtracks.
 
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Of course there is a bit of an argument to be made against the video creator in that he is using for contrast films that are entrenched in the consciousness
Click to expand...

They're entrenched for a reason, and in this instance of the music, for good reason if not for the film, themselves. Though only time will tell if these superhero movies, especially these Marvel ones, will be remembered or last at all into the future, but this video (and a few others of the creator) points to a larger flaw of trend that carries beyond just the similarity in music.

Consider this, how long before they start remaking them? Or just reuse the same pattern for each succeeding film but with different faces?


On topic of this thread, I don't much care for these films anymore (I checked out after X-Men DoFP), but if it counts as a musical score of the film, I can hum "Man with a Plan" from the first Capt. America film. Its melody is catchy even if the words aren't for me and it appeals to my affection of song-and-dance showtunes. The rest is pretty forgettable for me though beyond Sabbath's "Iron Man".
 
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PoopaPapaPalps said:
They're entrenched for a reason, and in this instance of the music, for good reason if not for the film, themselves. Though only time will tell if these superhero movies, especially these Marvel ones, will be remembered or last at all into the future, but this video (and a few others of the creator) points to a larger flaw of trend that carries beyond just the similarity in music.

Consider this, how long before they start remaking them? Or just reuse the same pattern for each succeeding film but with different faces?


On topic of this thread, I don't much care for these films anymore (I checked out after X-Men DoFP), but if it counts as a musical score of the film, I can hum "Man with a Plan" from the first Capt. America film. Its melody is catchy even if the words aren't for me and it appeals to my affection of song-and-dance showtunes. The rest is pretty forgettable for me though beyond Sabbath's "Iron Man".
Click to expand...

DoFP is by a different studio though to be fair. MCU tends to have a closely aligned vision/similarities.

I agree that the MCU has less memorable music than many, but Fox tends to follow the same trends too. Can't think of any defining x-men music off the top of my head. WB films do tend to trend on the operatic side of film scores and I enjoy them, but even then, it's more that their properties are based around less numerous characters this far. Batman/Supes etc. Wonder Woman has a great theme, electric cello just blaring out. As soon as the DCEU starts to expand a little more, I expect the quality in music to drop a little also. Unless it is a priority for them to enhance each character from a musical perspective. Which would be cool.

But almost nothing can beat the first Avengers theme. It's basic but powerful, and pulls you in at the perfect moments (exactly how the video described, to be fair).

I agree, there is a longevity issue with the regards to the quantity that is being produced now. Supes and Bats, many reboots.

But only time will tell, as you said - which was my point. Time tested themes and scores with heaps of nostalgia attached versus relatively new and fresh films. Not quite fair.
 
WB, Disney, Fox; whatever. I wasn't talking about, nor even implying, comparisons of one studio production against another. I'm looking at these things as films together as part of a larger genre and what they do and contribute individually. I've had my fill of the superhero stuff and don't bother aligning myself with one team or another; I just see them as they are and take it from that.

Music is completely subjective, yes, and people choose to remember certain things more than others because they want to. You bring up Avengers and say the nebulous "you", but I can't much relate because I honestly can't recall anything musically from that movie, nor much else, beyond outrageous, cartoonish action. As with your example with the Avengers, in my case, I can remember the X-men "theme" from the first film because I was completely enamored with it even if, I'm sure, most of the population cannot.

As for them, the general populous which the video is targeting, it's more a statement on the current state of these kinds of films rather than just these particular films themselves. It's just using the Marvel/Disney movies to point to a larger flaw. And the fact that they can't remember these musical cues says something about them in relation to their response to the films. As far as the general public being able to recall the more familiar film themes, there is a reason why their go to is John Williams (even Harry Potter, which is relatively young) and it stretches beyond just marketing: it's his command of composition and understanding of music theory that is able to evoke something in so many peoples' minds. The video, using Marvel/Disney as a groundwork, exposes not just how they're structured but how so many modern films are as well and puts forth that current lackluster scores, and not only just that, is symptomatic of a larger problem at play.
 
PoopaPapaPalps said:
WB, Disney, Fox; whatever. I wasn't talking about, nor even implying, comparisons of one studio production against another. I'm looking at these things as films together as part of a larger genre and what they do and contribute individually. I've had my fill of the superhero stuff and don't bother aligning myself with one team or another; I just see them as they are and take it from that.

Music is completely subjective, yes, and people choose to remember certain things more than others because they want to. You bring up Avengers and say the nebulous "you", but I can't much relate because I honestly can't recall anything musically from that movie, nor much else, beyond outrageous, cartoonish action. As with your example with the Avengers, in my case, I can remember the X-men "theme" from the first film because I was completely enamored with it even if, I'm sure, most of the population cannot.

As for them, the general populous which the video is targeting, it's more a statement on the current state of these kinds of films rather than just these particular films themselves. It's just using the Marvel/Disney movies to point to a larger flaw. And the fact that they can't remember these musical cues says something about them in relation to their response to the films. As far as the general public being able to recall the more familiar film themes, there is a reason why their go to is John Williams (even Harry Potter, which is relatively young) and it stretches beyond just marketing: it's his command of composition and understanding of music theory that is able to evoke something in so many peoples' minds. The video, using Marvel/Disney as a groundwork, exposes not just how they're structured but how so many modern films are as well and puts forth that current lackluster scores, and not only just that, is symptomatic of a larger problem at play.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I was probably thinking too small scale - appreciate the eye opener, thanks. :thumbsup it is a window into a larger issue I suppose - though looking at it macro, there are still massive variations on quality/enjoyment of music film to film.

Being derivative (however hard they try not to) and thus the eventual watering down of the musical scores added to more than likely a larger quantity of films being released year on year is probably also a factor.

Although you could pick out there is also a correlation between perceived quality of movie music and how "good" or objectively good a film is too (T2, ET, Jaws, Star Wars etc) Most well remembered music happens to also be from a well remembered or generally liked films. Or perhaps because the film is liked the music shares that, and vice versa.

Do you believe the film/movie music/scores are on the wane? Are we beyond the golden era of movie scores? Or perhaps it can't even be properly perceived within our time frame - we always default to "well back in my day.." etc, and future generations will remember the music of Zootopia as their nostalgia driven perfection.
 
Kickass score was kickass.
Sitting here now, I can't recall any scores from any of the recent crop of superhero movies.
Say "Kickass", though, and it starts playing in my head. Perfectly scored.
 
1) Favourite marvel music theme?
Not a theme per se, but I greatly enjoy "The Star Spangled Man", How that didn't get nominated for best original song is beyond me. There were only 2 nominees that year.

2) Favourite music film theme in modern Superhero films?
The Incredibles, of course.

3) Favourite music film theme in any film?
The Rocketeer and Indiana Jones are pretty much tied.
 
NeilT said:
yeah, it did.


But it was one of those modern 'Theme's are lame, so we're going to TEASE you with a theme, only the theme will just be a few notes and it won't really get started into a full fledged theme'...

nolan batman was the same way.
Click to expand...

To my ears, MoS was like Terminator Salvation: filled with general bland ELEVATOR type music - background noise.

When I think of super hero 'themes' there are basically just two that I jump to, Superman: the movie by John Williams and Batman, Danny Elfman(Which is the main reason why I THOUGHT the soundtrack for Terminator Salvation would be good).

Lightning said:
3) Favourite music film theme in any film?
The Rocketeer and Indiana Jones are pretty much tied.
Click to expand...

James Horner(RIP dude! :() and John Williams = genius at play

:love
Deep Impact's OST feels like more of the same, at least to me
 
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Axlotl said:
Sitting here now, I can't recall any scores from any of the recent crop of superhero movies.
Click to expand...

that's because I've noticed true themes becoming a thing of the past these days.

again, recent reboots as an example.

That Knight Rider 2008 reboot. It uses the first few notes of the original theme, and then goes off into some random california rock nonsensicla stuff that isn't nearly as interesting.
WB appparently owns thundercats out right, yet they only ever used 30 seconds worth of their main theme and the show didn't really have any memorable music like the original series did.

Take in part 2002 He-Man, and the Difference in actual memorable music to modern shows is pretty shocking.

Even Star Trek mostly has degraded background music that all sounds cookie cutter.
compare the awesome music of TNG's first three seasons to some of the latter stuff and you'll notice a difference.

- - - Updated - - -

firesprite said:
I don't think it's a Marvel-specific thing, personally. I think in the last 10 years, there are maybe 2 or 3 movies where the score is actually memorable to me.
Click to expand...

It either feels like an attack on themes in general,

or the modern crop of music movie masters just are not as good as the guys that preceded them.

I specifically remember Rick Berman told the composers of the star trek music to 'tone it down to generic' so that it didn't over shadow the on screen stuff.
talk about.....I wanna strangle you.... in type of comments ;)
 
A lot of people were going all ga-ga over Rey's theme from TFA, but I'm still not hearing a theme in that jumbled mess.
It's a pretty piece of music, to be sure, but that's not what makes a theme. You would think John Williams, of all people, would understand themes.

I think the best theme I've heard in recent years has to be the Tomb Raider 2013 theme.
Jason Graves understands themes. Somebody in Hollywood needs to give that guy a job.

If you haven't played the game, here's the score:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TU76IwfthQo&list=PLpFC8oeJ3aNn0bfgw67n_d420u4gvYV-z

Game of Thrones also does a really good job of utilizing themes in it's score.
 
Axlotl said:
A lot of people were going all ga-ga over Rey's theme from TFA, but I'm still not hearing a theme in that jumbled mess.
It's a pretty piece of music, to be sure, but that's not what makes a theme. You would think John Williams, of all people, would understand themes.
/QUOTE]

I'm of the same thought.

although, in watching the Force Awakens Credits, I don't think you can blame williams on this one.

I can't help but wonder how much music he actually DID on TFA, because there is another composer on there credited with alot of stuff.
Click to expand...
 
I didnt even realise John Williams did TFA or parts of....I wonder if that is a symptom directly related to this stuff. And yet the main Star Wars theme was obviously around, and I really enjoyed TFA music, even if it was entwined with original themes.
 
I still hum the Iron Man theme pretty regularly(first one that popped into my mind when the narrator asked the people he interviewed) and yes, the Avengers, and Cap's themes I love as well. But things definitely aren't the way they used to be and there are fewer and fewer scores that are instantly recognizable, or memorable these days.

It's just another nail in coffin of cinema..err new way of doing movies. Even as we saw in TFA, old themes were used sparingly in scenes(Han and Leia theme), almost as an afterthought or with reservation, compared to the way they filled the set and almost seemed another character in ESB and RoTJ. I also agree that Rey's theme was beautiful, it wasn't a real theme in the way you have the Force, above mentioned Han and Leia, Leia's own, and the Imperial March was as much Vader's as the Empire's.
 
NeilT said:
WB appparently owns thundercats out right, yet they only ever used 30 seconds worth of their main theme and the show didn't really have any memorable music like the original series did.
Click to expand...

I actually read an interview once with the composer for the newer series. He was only given 30 seconds for the OP/theme, and he wanted to incorporate the original theme into it. I think he did well for a limited time frame to work with.



As for movie OST that hit me, I loved the scores for The Last Unicorn, Neverending Story, and Labyrinth. Those 3 movies shaped my childhood, and even years after my last viewing, as soon as the music starts, I can remember the cues.

For something more recent, it's not film, but the OST for the video game Journey (which holds the distinction of being the ONLY video game OST to be nominated for the Grammy for Visual Media or whatever it's called). Listening to the soundtrack on its own, I can see that section of the game play out in my head, especially with Road of Trials. I'm hoping that Journey Live makes it to Seattle, because seeing it performed live with a player is going to be awesome.
 
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Nice video.
Temp music used on most of these "blockbusters" is ruining movies.

Only once in a while will you get something decent from a big budget movie. Marvel's entire superhero MCU universe score list is complete utter garbage. The only theme that is memorable is the Captain America one, and that's about it. Everything else is garbage, you don't even have a continious theme being carried over to the sequels or next installments.
All you get is a generic dose of morose comotose sound effects and the boring themeless, tuneless gunk.

Its horrendous frankly. The DC movies are just as guilty.
 
Solos blaster said:
I still hum the Iron Man theme pretty regularly(first one that popped into my mind when the narrator asked the people he interviewed) and yes, the Avengers, and Cap's themes I love as well. But things definitely aren't the way they used to be and there are fewer and fewer scores that are instantly recognizable, or memorable these days.

It's just another nail in coffin of cinema..err new way of doing movies. Even as we saw in TFA, old themes were used sparingly in scenes(Han and Leia theme), almost as an afterthought or with reservation, compared to the way they filled the set and almost seemed another character in ESB and RoTJ. I also agree that Rey's theme was beautiful, it wasn't a real theme in the way you have the Force, above mentioned Han and Leia, Leia's own, and the Imperial March was as much Vader's as the Empire's.
Click to expand...

Iron Man has a theme??

I watched all 3 Iron man movies and there is not a single "main theme" that is used across all three movies.
All I heard was some generic stuff
 
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