Why do so many people think Star Trek: Into Darkness was bad?

[Father]

That's not only lazy writing, it kills any drama, too.
Hey this is new! Wow, what do we do about this species/being/crisis? Shall we discuss it, get our heads together and think of a solution? Nah, let's as Leonard Nimoy, he'll know.

Which is ironic because he generally holds himself to a pretty strict code about altering the timeline... or not.
He gave Scotty the transwarp equation (that he would later come up with anyway). He made his presence known to JJ Spock. I guess he will give them any information they need when it benefits his friends. At some point they'll run into a race he hasn't dealt with directly like the Borg. His personal knowledge is finite.

 

[Lost21stJedi]

At some point they'll run into a race he hasn't dealt with directly like the Borg. His personal knowledge is finite.

Exactly. I know I'm not explaining this the correct way but as an example, say in TOS, when they departed on their 5 year mission they left Earth and headed west (yes I know N-S-E-W doesn't refer to space, just trying to make a point). Well what if this time, they started out on an entirely new heading. They would not encounter any of the planets that Prime Spock did. Remember, there is an awful lot of space out there :cool

 

[Michael Bergeron]

Exactly. I know I'm not explaining this the correct way but as an example, say in TOS, when they departed on their 5 year mission they left Earth and headed west (yes I know N-S-E-W doesn't refer to space, just trying to make a point). Well what if this time, they started out on an entirely new heading. They would not encounter any of the planets that Prime Spock did. Remember, there is an awful lot of space out there :cool

True, but remember, Spock was alive and well in the TNG era. His knowledge wouldn't be limited to what his on screen adventures were in TOS.

 

[Jeyl]

How come the Enterprise is more susceptible to the Volcano's heat from a distance when Spock is wearing a suit that can withstand building sized lava eruptions a mere spitting distance away?

 

[Zenwalker]

OK , I finally saw The Wrath of Khan...um ...er...Into Darkness.

Nuff' said.

 

[BAK55]

As a fan who had seen the original broadcasts of the show on a B&W TV set back in '66, I would simply like to see a story that would be -as Gene Roddenberry had said- to be believable. Something never seen before wouldn't hurt either.

I even remember the NBC ad campaigns stating this was the first "adult" science fiction series. Meaning the stories would be more interesting than the comic book variety being shown at the time, and it seems we are being fed now.

Unfortunately, it seems if there isn't pandering fan service or whopping explosions on the first hit on this new "starship" -that is now more of a hotrod than a ship, and why are the movie ships made of tissue paper that rip apart so easily when the original ship could take a beating and still come through- , I'm not expecting much from this reboot.

What really made TOS stand out so well was there were science fiction writers providing stories for this show. Now we only get television or screenplay writers to provide the current stories.

 

[Rotwang]

There are several points that really irked me in the new films. I have no problem with Abrams when he says he wants to make Star Trek for people other than the fans, only to stuff his second film full of references only fans of the original would understand. I can live with the whitewashed Khan, the atmospheric capable Enterprise, or even the blood resurrection trick, they constantly reversed ageing and massive mutations in the series.

I really hate the factory bits they use for the insides of the ships, at least they could have tried to film inside a real ship if they wanted that kind of "hardware" feel. This kind of stuff only works for low budget shows like Red Dwarf.

"Old Spock" is just silly, he should have slipped out and gone back to his era after he had his cameo.

Kirk is an *******. Seems it's now the law in Hollywood that all male heroes must by definition be angry, surly, angsty characters overflowing with personal tragedy (tragedies most people eventually do get over, except Hollywood characters wallow in it, waiting for their shot at redemption) We had Kirk's arc in the first film and then they decided to do the same in the second one, can't wait how they will handle the same arc of promoting/demoting Kirk in the next film.

What bothers me most of all is the Spock/Kirk engine room reversal, which is plain stupid and has nothing to do with creativity (especially with the cop-out at the end, at least we had to wait for Search For Spock first time round) Somebody must have really patted themselves on the shoulder for having that idea ...

 

[trueogre]

OK , I finally saw The Wrath of Khan...um ...er...Into Darkness.

Nuff' said.

Well it kinda bugged me when the shuttle sucked in debris spat out by the volcano, since when has a spacecraft needed vents? There's nothing to suck in space but when they go to a planet they're suddenly sucking atmo? The suit Spock is wearing probably can withstand heat for a while, Enterprise the series had Malcolm Reed withstand a plasma leak but ultimately he succumbed to the heat. Spock may be able to withstand heat more efficiently than a human. Much like Spock could withstand more radiation than a human.

 

[Jeyl]

Why does Khan attempt to smuggle his 72 followers by putting them inside torpedoes instead of something a bit more practical? Aren't advanced torpedoes the kind of thing people would take issue with if they were discovered? It's like trying to smuggle a bootleg movie by hiding it inside your drug stash. Why not put his followers in something more harmless, like probes?

 

[seelsa73]

Holy spoilers people, jeez.

 

[Michael Bergeron]

Holy spoilers people, jeez.

I'm surprised anyone who didn't want spoilers would come into a thread discussing specifics of what people liked/didn't like about the film...

 

[Bigdaddy]

Ok so I read though this thread (a LOT of reading here ) I might give this movie a try in a few years, but so far it sounds like it even less "Trek-ish" than JJ's last attempt. I'll stick to the TNG for a while. I hope JJ doesn't do another one of these and just focuses on SW, it seems more up his alley. Since there are 2 of these films now I think it's too late to try and "rescue" the series. Maybe the opening of the new SW movie will be Luke waking up from a horrible dream, "I was a Captain in something called Star Fleet!" :lol

 

[Kerr Avon]

I'm surprised anyone who didn't want spoilers would come into a thread discussing specifics of what people liked/didn't like about the film...

You can't help people like that. There's seriously something defective with their thought processes.

 

[jlee562]

Perhaps I'm remembering the details wrong, but I thought it was Marcus who put them in the torpedoes...no?

 

[SmilingOtter]

I dunno, maybe? I thought it was Khan, since he was so interested in the number of super torpedoes aimed at him.

Neither villain's actions seemed to make any sense. Marcus gave Khan some reason to believe that he had the others killed, which was the only leverage he had over Khan. It also gave Khan, who was both a genius and a savage, a compelling reason to hate Marcus. The Admiral also had no good reason to destroy both the Enterprise and her crew.

Khan also tried to destroy the Enterprise in general, and Kirk in particular, for no good reason. Kirk had gone out on a limb for him, risked life and career to keep Khan alive, and was obviously being used by Marcus just as Khan had been.

 

[Jedi2016]

Perhaps I'm remembering the details wrong, but I thought it was Marcus who put them in the torpedoes...no?

You're correct, Khan didn't put them in the torpedoes. He wasn't aware of that little plot until someone told him there were exactly 72 torpedoes pointed at him.

I didn't mind the movie overall.. it is what it is, and anyone who expected a magical return to Trek's roots is deluding themselves.

I could have done without the gratuitous "KHAAAAAAN!!!", though.. that was pushing it a little too far into campy fan service, IMO. I also agree with the point that someone made about Khan's "revelation" about who he was, that Kirk and Spock would have just responded "Who?" until they had a chance to look him up in the database (I assume there were entries there related to Khan Noonian Singh, and I do find it odd that they never even tried to look him up). Purely pandering to the audience there.. they should have made all those nods to the original much more subtle.

 

[jlee562]

I didn't really think it was all that convoluted. Marcus and Khan conspire, with Marcus holding Khan's crew. Khan goes off to Qonos, and Marcus sends the Enterprise after him. Khan realizes he's been backstabbed by Marcus when he asks how many torpedoes are aimed at him, so now he's in business for himself and his crew.

Marcus needs to destroy the Enterprise because they've discovered his plot. They were never supposed to bring Khan back alive, because if he goes on trial, Khan says: Marcus used me to initiate war with the Klingons.

 

[Jeyl]

I also agree with the point that someone made about Khan's "revelation" about who he was, that Kirk and Spock would have just responded "Who?" until they had a chance to look him up in the database

If I was to add anything to the script but was forced to not make any other changes, I would have given Kirk a strange case of Deja Vu after Khan reveals his real name. Kirk can tell Spock that there's something about the name Khan that's important, like they have dealt with him in the past even though they haven't. This could lead to them contemplating if their "other selves" had encountered someone like him before since the only way Kirk would have knowledge of this is if Spock Prime had mind melded with Kirk, which was the case. This would have given NuSpock a much better reason in contacting Spock Prime since Khan has to be important to Spock Prime if his name got into Kirk's head.

 

[CessnaDriver]

.........Kirk is an *******. Seems it's now the law in Hollywood that all male heroes must by definition be angry, surly, angsty characters overflowing with personal tragedy (tragedies most people eventually do get over, except Hollywood characters wallow in it, waiting for their shot at redemption) We had Kirk's arc in the first film and then they decided to do the same in the second one, can't wait how they will handle the same arc of promoting/demoting Kirk in the next film.

.......

This is another huge JJ Trek no go for me.
I find it stretching all credibility that someone like JJ Kirk would ever be let near a such a vessel let alone command it.
I think of how hard it is to become captain of US aircraft carrier or nuke sub.
Command of a starship is going to be just as hard to earn and just as easy to lose forever if you screw up.

So the prime character to convey what this starship's meaning is, doesn't even belong there or really understand
what it's all about. At least what it used to be about. I don't know what the mission of the JJ-Prise is.

 

[Jet Beetle]

Actually the entire TOS, TNG, DS9, Voyager DID happen, only in another parallel universe. Basically JJ needed a new template for Star Trek. If he had dumped on the whole Star Trek mythos then Spock Prime wouldn't exist. Because Spock Prime does exist proves that he's not stomping on the previous stuff. Also to validate this, Spock asks Spock Prime how he defeated Khan. If JJ's stomped on the mythos, why ask Spock Prime.

Actually the existence of Spock Prime negates that is is an alternate or parallel universe or at least confuses the issue.. Spock prime's knowledge of how they defeated Khan couldn't possibly have helped - it either would be
"the Captain beat him with a bar thing in engineering"
or " See, Khan stole the Genesis device"
JJ Spock "The what?"
Spock Prime "Oh, Carol Marcus created this torpedo that can build planets."
JJ Spock: " Wait, Carol Marcus is here but she's a weapon specialist."
Spock Prime "Nevermind - just punch him and have Uhura shoot him or something."
All this should mean there will be no Space Seed meaning Khan never meets his wife nor will ever be marooned on Seti-Alpha 5 and thus no Wrath of Khan meaning Spock never dies - they never steal the Bird of Prey and most likely Kirk and co never time travel to get the whales.
But with the knowledge that Romulas is going to be destroyed 100 plus years from now they can be ready and stop the Super nova before it toasts the planet. If so, the nacelles on the Enterprise should deflate.