What in your opinion are the best Star Wars editions and why?

[Solo4114]

I think you've done the rarity in analyzing the changes for what they were without bashing, well done

Thanks!

I don't disagree with any of what you waid really, either. I get why people want unabashed copies of the original. I do to, but i'm not prepared to through a fit over it either. Honestly, I don't get george's motivation for not doing it. All refusing to do it does is **** off a lot of people who built you your fortune. Even if he thinks there's not a market for it, does he honestly expect it won't make a profit? Storywise, it's not like he really changes anything other than greedo/han. It doesn't hurt the SE's in any way. So like I said, while I don't understand it, i'm not going to sweat it much either.

I think the other changes mostly don't HURT the SEs, but the bulk of them don't really HELP 'em either. Like I said, the Jabba/Han scene in ANH is pretty much repetitive. It's a nice bit of fan service at this point, but that's it. It doesn't help the story (which is one reason why cutting it made sense).

However, Hayden at the very end doesn't make sense to me. I recognize that it's done for two reasons (1) because it ties back to the PT a little more strongly, and (2) the made-up explanation of "Oh, well, technically he died at that age, so he was redeemed later but appears at the age he died and...um....I know I was going somewhere with this..." It's all just twaddle designed to placate fans who pretty much would be placated by "Because I said so" anyway. I still don't see it as making narrative sense, although it makes marketing sense.

All the SE's have failed to include something i've wanted to see. That being, if you're going to blow up an entire planet, i think it's fair the planet get some air-time prior to the big-bang. Show us there's life and civilization on it. But that's just me and i'm sure that's an obscure opinion.

Actually, that'd be pretty cool. Like, a brief shot on the surface of Alderaan, with city inhabitants looking skyward at the huge moon that suddenly appeared and wondering worriedly what that's all about. You could also do a split-second shot, again, from the surface, showing people reacting in fear as the laser fires towards the planet, then cut to the explosion sequence. I think that'd make the impact of Alderaan's destruction a LOT more meaningful. This wasn't just some rock they blew up. They murdered millions of people in a single stroke.

When I get the chance to show them to my nephews, it's going to be in order of release. Chronological order takes out some big blows of the OT - vader as dad, leia the sister, etc.

Of course, i'm sure we'll see the Ultra Editions or whatever in the next year or two where everything's in 3D. In this one, Han will get to shoot first, but since everyones' on big screen TV's, we'll see that Greedo flipped him off under the table first, so he really started it anyhow

Ha! I love it! Cut to Han pulling out the ol' "GK" blaster, cut to Greedo flipping him off as hard as he possibly can...

But yeah, I agree about the narrative impact of "Leia is your sister and I am your father. Oh, and I built your droids and Yoda and Chewie are BFFs from way back."



Moving on...

That was the case all along.

Then how come they didn't fix it? I heard that same excuse with the audio thing, and I don't buy it either, but even if we assume it's accurate, it's CLEARLY an error. How is that any different from digitally removing compositing lines around the TIE fighters? It's just shoddy workmanship. I mean, defend the films all you want, enjoy 'em in spite of any defects as much as you like, but you cannot with a straight face say that they didn't screw up in PLENTY of places with the '04 SEs. There's just no excuse for it. If they're gonna do this super-duper we-fixed-all-the-broken-stuff edition, then friggin' do it right.

 

[Jeyl]

I like Adywan's version of ANH.

- Color corrected to be less 'blue'.
- No Jabba the Hutt (Really, it was just a rehash of the Han/Greedo scene)
- Han shoots first
- New introduction to the Death Star
- Lots and lots of continuity fixes
- No Special Edition "bonk!" when the stormtrooper bangs his helmet on the hatch
- Less clutter in the Mos Eisley entrance (No green walking piece of fecal matter that takes up the whole screen)
- Muzzle flashes whenever a blaster is fired
- Some dialogue changes ("There will be no escape this time." 'for the Princess' has been removed)
- Cantina aliens are more animated
- Falcon seen in hyperspace in the cockpit after the Tie Attack
- Updated readouts to both the Death Star and Yavin
- Yavin now seen during the death star battle
- New sequence showing the Tie-fighters entering the battle, including more moments with Wedge, Biggs and Luke taking on the Tie-fighters.
- Death Star literally starts firing it's main weapon seconds before she explodes

And many more!

 

[chefhawk]

I like Adywan's version of ANH.

- Color corrected to be less 'blue'.
- No Jabba the Hutt (Really, it was just a rehash of the Han/Greedo scene)
- Han shoots first
- New introduction to the Death Star
- Lots and lots of continuity fixes
- No Special Edition "bonk!" when the stormtrooper bangs his helmet on the hatch
- Less clutter in the Mos Eisley entrance (No green walking piece of fecal matter that takes up the whole screen)
- Muzzle flashes whenever a blaster is fired
- Some dialogue changes ("There will be no escape this time." 'for the Princess' has been removed)
- Cantina aliens are more animated
- Falcon seen in hyperspace in the cockpit after the Tie Attack
- Updated readouts to both the Death Star and Yavin
- Yavin now seen during the death star battle
- New sequence showing the Tie-fighters entering the battle, including more moments with Wedge, Biggs and Luke taking on the Tie-fighters.
- Death Star literally starts firing it's main weapon seconds before she explodes

And many more!

totally agree one hundred percent. the guy is super smart and logical.
Im surprised that lucas hasnt seen and wanted to buy the rights to sell this version.
Maybe its admiting that the special editions were'nt the best. Admittedly the restoration part was amazing...but


cheers

 

[Treadwell]

Then how come they didn't fix it? I heard that same excuse with the audio thing, and I don't buy it either, but even if we assume it's accurate, it's CLEARLY an error. How is that any different from digitally removing compositing lines around the TIE fighters? It's just shoddy workmanship. I mean, defend the films all you want, enjoy 'em in spite of any defects as much as you like, but you cannot with a straight face say that they didn't screw up in PLENTY of places with the '04 SEs. There's just no excuse for it. If they're gonna do this super-duper we-fixed-all-the-broken-stuff edition, then friggin' do it right.

Oh, I agree. Was just a little FYI on one point.

 

[Solo4114]

Oh, I agree. Was just a little FYI on one point.

Oh, gotcha. I mean, I remember the visuals on the sabre in ANH were all over the place. Sometimes you got just the plastic stick (IE: Obi-Wan slowly lifting his sabre head-on towards Vader), sometimes the blade looked white, sometimes aqua, etc., etc. But yeah, no excuse for doing it wrong.

 

[KnightAsylum]

A question asked (Guri's) will be answered, especially here.
...

No kidding, that is why I, and several others, answered it. :rolleyes
But there were more then a couple that were just about bitterness, not about the question.:unsure

Still not a shock around here.
Regardless glad Guri is sharing these films with future generations, more then enough to go around.:cheers

 

[Too Much Garlic]

I like Adywan's version of ANH.

I saw that version. It was all over the place and he added crap that wasn't needed. Might as well just watch the SE's. At least they are official.

 

[mez7]

my opinion is Don't let the old-bitter-afraid-of-change folks keep any of these movies, in any form away from kids.:rolleyes

that someone recommending the original edits rather than SE's,
that you think it somehow means to keep the movies away from the kids?

that just doesnt make sense at all :unsure

 

[CTF]

I saw that version. It was all over the place and he added crap that wasn't needed. Might as well just watch the SE's. At least they are official.

Exactly.

 

[fabrik]

Check out The Phantom Edit for your first port of call.

 

[Solo4114]

that someone recommending the original edits rather than SE's,
that you think it somehow means to keep the movies away from the kids?

that just doesnt make sense at all :unsure

The original OTs are every bit the "real movies" as the SEs. Lucas can prefer whatever version he likes, but that's why there's chocolate and vanilla, as my grandmother used to say.

Personally, I think there are two key issues with the PT and the SE OT that make showing the films (A) in release order and (B) in their original form first (and later show the SEs if you want) the better way to go.

1.) Kids will "bond" with whatever visual aesthetic they see first. If you show them the PT first, they'll wonder why the OT -- even the SE OT -- looks so old. They'll be busy paying attention to the f/x instead of the story. If you want the kids to get maximum enjoyment out of the story of the OT, show them the original versions first and the PT and SEs later. I think if you go in "chronological" order and/or show the SEs, the kids will be a bit less open to them. Now, that's not true for all kids, of course, but in general, I think showing a kid an older movie first and THEN the updated version (or the sequel or whatever) is the way to go.

2.) With respect to the SE OT and the PT, I think the key problem is that the SE OT doesn't quite work. There's only so many things they can fix. They can't change that the films in the OT weren't shot on primarily green screen stages. They can't change the film stock used. Even from ANH to ESB and ROTJ, there's a VISIBLE shift in terms of the kind of film they used. I always thought it was a noticeable difference, even as a kid. In addition, while some f/x are changed/fixed/updated, other stuff isn't. Example: why is the Rebel base on Yavin just some stone building in a jungle? We get these long CGI-laden shots of every other city, major building, etc. But we just get a forest, and a vague shot of...I dunno. A big stone building that I think is housing a hangar, but it's so far away I can't tell. Visually, that doesn't "fit" with the style of the PT or the modern edits to the SEs. Example 2: Puppets vs. CGI. Take Yoda. He's a puppet. He's CGI (x2). Then he's a puppet again (x2). Meanwhile, you've got the green dinos in Mos Eisley wandering in the streets, you have the dewbacks ridden by stormtroopers, and then.....you have Frank Oz with his hand up a muppet's butt. Jabba, likewise. In ANH, he's mobile. In ROTJ, he's clearly a puppet. Why? Probably because the cost involved to fix it wasn't really worth replacing him, but it's still visually inconsistent. By contrast, TPM Yoda notwithstanding, the prequels are at least visually consistent (whether you may like the style is a different matter). The SE OTs are NOT visually/stylistically consistent. The original OT, however, IS visually/stylistically consistent.


Based on those points, I tend to think it's better to show the original OT, put it in its proper context (Look, these films were made when I was younger than you are, and that's how they look), and then show the PT to show the "backstory" and how filming changed. Plus, the kids, I think, will be better able to appreciate the original OT and the SE OT if they see it in the same order we did.

 

[LeroyLahood]

Adywan's Star Wars Revisited.

 

[darthgordon]

I had to skip through, because all I ever see in these threads is how much the SE's suck, the prequels suck, George Lucas sucks and how bitter people are. I've heard it... it's like watching the Sixth Sense for a second time... it's a waste of time. So I don't know what you've been told, but there are only two versions available on DVD. The '04 SE's and the original laser disc rips. The '97 SE's are only available on VHS... and I have no idea why anyone, given the choice would watch a VHS in 2011.

IMO the '04's are an improvement over the '97's. However they were a big rush job... and therefore far from perfect in color and sound. They still have '97 SE footage that could stand to be fixed and there is no version of Jedi Rocks that will not make you want to put a gun in your mouth.

The laser disc rips are just poor quality that you could get on bootleg DVD prior to Lucasfilm releasing them.

 

[Barryjoe]

Solo4114,

I really enjoyed reading your well written, thoughtful comments.

Thanks,
Barry.

 

[Jawafive]

I tend to lean towards the 2006 versions, but I hate the addition of Jango's voice in place of the classic Boba in ESB. Drives me crazy! I do like many aspects of Adywan's version of ANH, but it as others have said sometimes it is all over the place and cheapens a few moments IMO. Overall I think it's a fun version of the movie to watch.

I'm hoping that the blu rays will be all I need to buy until the next big thing comes out!

-Matt

 

[dualedge]

Just to be clear, I don't have a problem with Lucas playing with the various versions. I just want three things:

1.) That when he plays with them, he provides us with an "archive" copy of the originals. There is something to be said for preserving film history, and frankly, I think it's important to show what he accomplished with the technology he had back then. Star Wars was an f/x landmark and it's important to preserve that.

2.) That he provide a "cleaned up" version of the otherwise unchanged originals. Don't pump the color artificially (or if you do, do so consistently), just remove some of the smears, stains, grit, etc. If Blade Runner can look as good as it does, you can do the same with the OT and have it look AMAZING.

3.) That whatever changes, fixes, cleanups, etc. he does, HE DOES THEM RIGHT AND WITH CONSISTENT ATTENTION TO QUALITY. Honestly, there is NO excuse for the flipped audio channels, or for the crappy color work in the DVD versions of the SE.

Excellent summation Solo. Absolutely could not agree with you more on any of this. I'm fine with Lucas doing the prequels and SE's... more power to him and to those that love them but as I've said before, I've yet to meet a Star Wars fan that would NOT want nice cleaned up versions of the originals for reasons ranging from archiving to nostalgia even if they do love the SE's and prequels. That is not asking too much IMHO even if it does mean Lucas having to cut his ex-wife a check now and then.

 

[Wes R]

I like the original and the 97 special edition and if i had a vcr still and had an interest in Starwars like I used to I'd be watching it. Actually given how many movies i have on vhs still i'd love for a vcr.

 

[Solo4114]

Glad you guys like the reasons I offered. I agree that, even if you love the SEs, the PT, etc., an archival high-quality lovingly-restored (not "improved," just restored) version of the original OT would be terrific.

I suspect that, at SOME point, Lucas will do just that. It's an obvious moneymaker. He could probably sell an entire new boxset to people who'd already purchased the old ones just by doing that.

As for the '97 SE, I have them on VHS in widescreen. It'd be interesting to see them transferred to DVD purely for comparison's sake, but the specific differences could always be pointed out in a special feature on some DVD, I suppose.

You'd think that with the promise of Blu-Ray, you could get the "Ultimate" edition that would allow branching, or a pre-set menu where you personally select which changed elements you want to include from which version.

Ah well. Maybe in the "neural net virtual light" version or whatever.

 

[DL 44 Blaster]

Having never seen the Adywan editions, is originaltrilogy.com the best place to find a download? There are a few different versions of even his and they vary in size...tremendously, so which one should I download. What about his ESB version?

I've seen every official version and still like the original releases the best....and to play them in the order of release...not in terms of episode.

I've heard so much about the Adywan edits that I thought I'd give them a whirl since I've always liked edits and fanfilms.

 

[Colin Droidmilk]

The laserdisc-ripped original releases are the best. I don't even think the image quality is that bad. I also like my VHS original releases. This is because I'm old and bitter and afraid of change, of course, and not because I'm a keen preserver of cinema masterpieces.

And I'll tell you another thing. The cgi DS battle shots in the SE had a novel prettiness at the time of release, but boy are they beginning to show their flaws. In terms of motion primarily. I've been watching the original release battle a lot over recent months, and decided to have a look at the SE version again the other day, and was surprised by how phoney a lot of the motion looked. There's a kind of over-fluidity, a kind of mechanical, inorganic 'over-perfection' to a lot of the shots, which betrays the mathematical nature of their production. It's a problem rife with post-Jurassic Park cgi. Jurassic Park cgi was damn near perfect, but then Lucas heralded in the present era of crap cgi, and he did so with the Star Wars SEs. Just one more example: all the detail on the cgi Falcon is very poorly registered in the SE Bespin fly-through - the computer tech of the day couldn't handle the high-frequency texture of the ship. That bugged me immediately back in '98.