The Assassination of Jesse James by the coward Robert Ford - BORING

[hydin]

Finally got a few hours to spare from the christmas madness with the family, so I opted to sit down and watch what I thought would be a great western.

This movie sucked.

It was not a good western, nor was it a good movie. It was about 2 hours of "OMG JESSE IS ACTING LIKE HE IS GONNA KILL ME", and then him getting shot and another half hour of the guys who shot him life sucking.

To put this in perspective, Jesse James, Hero outlaw in the west, shot ONE PERSON in the movie, and that was in the back.

The movie was just boring. The acting was good, I guess. I just don't get turned on by "look how zany this guy was!" and "wow this guy acts like he has aspergers!". I watch westerns to actually have a fun time and enjoy things like shootouts and posses and whatnot.

I have been on a bit of a western kick lately, but this movie has probably cured me of that.

Still gonna see True Grit though, cause I have a feeling they can't screw that movie up.

Chris

 

[Capt MarVell]

Watch "Silverado" or "Open Range" or "The Cowboys" to cleanse the pallet. Or even "True Grit" with the Duke, I'm sure it's still going to stand on its own merits even with the Coens' version out there.

Jim

 

[Art Andrews]

Wow... I couldn't disagree more. This was a GREAT movie!!! Now, if you are looking for an action/adventure western, this is certainly not it. If you are looking for a shoot-em-up, this is not it. If you were hoping for something light and easily palatable like Tombstone, this isn't even close.

However, if you are looking for something with a bit more realism and a bit more truth to it that isn't all Hollywooded up, this is the movie for you. It is something like a semi-modern tragedy.

If it makes you feel any better, Mirax thought this was one of the most boring movies she has ever seen! She literally couldn't get through it without falling asleep.

PS. It probably helps that I am an unabashed Brad Pitt fan and thought he gave a haunting performance in this movie.

 

[hydin]

He did some great acting, I will give him that. I just really thought it would be a "western" in the terms of action, shootouts, fast draws, etc. I mean for god's sake it has JESSE JAMES in it!

Instead, it was just... boring. It's sort of like going to see No Country for Old Men and expecting it to be a action/thriller instead of a drama. You would just walk away disappointed in the movie.

If I was looking for an "artsy" film, then hell yea this would be a great one. Only problem was I as looking for less art and more gunfire.

One of the better movies I have seen lately that didn't have much gunplay but was still surprisingly good was Gunless. Ya don't need gunfire to make it a great western, but man it helps

Hopefully gonna see True Grit on New years, if not sooner. Here's hoping they keep in the FILL YOUR HANDS YOU SON OF A *****! line like the original had. Gotta wonder why they switched eyes for the eyepatch though, noticed that in the trailer I saw for it a few months back..

Chris

 

[Art Andrews]

Chris, I can agree with you that this movie was a bit mismarketed as they made it seem like it was going to be an action movie when it isn't an action movie at all.

BTW, for what it is worth, I hated No Country for Old Men. That was the most depressing movie I have seen in a long long time.

I too am looking forward to True Grit!

 

[Lord Boron]

I agree with Art. I thought it was great. Extremely well made, and beautifully photographed. A nice relief in a day of overused and bad CGI in every film.

 

[hydin]

If you have to use CGI in a western... I think you might be doing it wrong :lol

Only possible exception to this is Cowboys and Aliens, which is going to rock.

Also on the "Great western movies" that I have seen lately, 3:10 to Yuma and Appaloosa. 3:10 was a little better, but man Appaloosa has Aragorn in it, and that man always manages to be great in any film he is in.

That and 3:10 got that "They gon' hang me in the mornin" song stuck in my head :lol

Chris

 

[Art Andrews]

3:10 was definitely more exciting of the two while Appaloosa was more gritty. The one thing was Appaloosa had Renée Zellweger who I personally don't care for at all. I didn't like her role and I just don't like her and she really took away from my enjoyment of the movie, but I absolutely loved but Vigo and Ed Harris. Man.... I think I am going to need to watch both of those again... time for a weekend western Marathon!!! Thinking Tombstone, 3:10 to Yuma, Appaloosa, Silverado, The Quick and the Dead, Wyatt Earp (yes, I like boring movies... so kill me), Seraphim Falls (now that is a weird one), Open Range, and Unforgiven. Wonder if I could get through all of those this weekend.

 

[ThrowingChicken]

I, also, agree with Art. I thought the movie was fantastic. Wonderfully acted and beautifully shot, as well.

This is my favorite scene, featuring Nick Cave:
YouTube - Nick Cave in The Assassination Of Jesse James

 

[Charles Kline]

I liked it.

 

[Calufrax]

The "western" as a genre is very curious because mostly they were rather pat shoot 'em ups. My dad who's gone now and I used to watch them when I was growing up. It was a safe Xmas present to get him anything on VHS western, especially John Wayne., so much so I kept a list of what he had so I wouldn't overlap it. Something things that were harder to find like "Hondo" were among the last I was able to get for him.

I think one of the best westerns is still one of the first ones and it's worth getting the DVD of it to watch everything on it because the movie had a curious history edit-wise. It has the shoot 'em aspect because it's about Wyatt Earp and it's not terribly accurate to the story as none of the versions of the story are in any of the films made about the famous gunfight but "My Darling Clementine" is still my favorite western ever. It's just beautifully shot, the story hits all the right notes from dark to funny and back to deadly again. I just adore that film and most people I show it to have never seen it and it never seems to get a less than wow reaction.

My favorite quirky take on the western genre is also "Barbarossa" with of all people Willie Nelson and Gary Busey from back in '82. It's quite funny in places and though it's far from perfect to me it's probably closer to what the old west, at least down Texas was probably really like.

Of course things like "Silverado" and other movies mentioned here are very good 'traditional' westerns, they mostly tend to rely of the two dimensional heroes and villains that are the staple of the genre. John Wayne is still the King of the Western and my favorite John Wayne movies are the best from going backwards in time to the least, the very best being his last movie ever "The Shootist", then "The Cowboys" both of which are very moving. "True Grit" and "Rooster Cogburn" make nice bookends to one another.

The best in his heyday though for me is "The Searchers" where to me he plays a guy who's really a - oh, poo for the filters here - a b*stard who becomes redeemed in the end. As you go backwards in time there's still great stuff in there, but "The Searchers" has such a strong moral message to me its an A-Plus. It has one of the best last visual shots in cinema history to me which I won't spoil, but when you watch it and you think about it you'll see what I mean.

It really too big a genre despite how it seems to have dried up in the mid-seventies to discuss briefly because there's just so many Westerns that were made and some that I'm sure I need my memory jogged on because I will have forgotten a great one. I was reminded of "Cat Ballou" just last night.

Actually to bring it to a props building angle, I would like to see if someone has ever rated Westerns for their accuracy to their periods for the way they depict revolvers and other props. I think most of them just probably willy-nilly grabbed guns and other things that might be right for say 1885 but not right for 1869 out of the props department. I confess I don't know much about the history of revolvers, but I get the impression from what I have read they weren't as ubiquitous in real life back then as they seem in Western movies til the 1880s onward. It's the curious thing to me is with most westerns you can't really tell what year the movie is supposed to be taking place in.

 

[Art Andrews]

I can tell you that some of the more modern movies like Tombstone, 3:10 to Yuma, Appaloosa, and the Assassination of Jesse James paid a LOT of attention to accuracy in weaponry. Doesn't mean they got it all right, but they really took a sincere interest in paying attention to it unlike the westerns of old where any six-shooter would do.

 

[CTF]

Not only is it quite compelling, but that show has some of the best photography of the last decade.

 

[Calufrax]

I can tell you that some of the more modern movies like Tombstone, 3:10 to Yuma, Appaloosa, and the Assassination of Jesse James paid a LOT of attention to accuracy in weaponry. Doesn't mean they got it all right, but they really took a sincere interest in paying attention to it unlike the westerns of old where any six-shooter would do.

I actually haven't seen any of these yet, not for lack of interest by any means, just only so many hours in a day and they are in my voluminous Netflix queue which this thread makes me want to bump them to the top now.

But yeah, I always despaired a little that most Westerns had too much of the generic 'any six-shooter will do' aspect to them. In the heyday it seemed like they had all these props and most studios seemed to have standing Western street sets that the studios had a financial interest to just keep churning them out.

In my LA days I can remember the thrill I got driving past Paramount on Melrose I think and looking through the gates one could glimpse in the distance in the 80's their western street. I always assumed this was what they'd used as Virgina City in "Bonanza", probably the most "generic" of all westerns where time stood still for all the years it was on the air it seemed.

I vaguely recall Michael Landon talking late in his life how formulaic it was what with any time the Cartwright boys fell in love you knew that she was either a goner or was going to be packed of to San Fransico on the stage coach by the end. I think this was probably on Carson where he also joked how strange it was all those men living in the same house together year after year started to seem. He joked the Cartwright weren't gay, but thank god Hop-Sing was; a naughty joke I remember that Carson nearly fell out of his chair laughing at.

I grew up on reruns of "Bonanza" and "The Virginian" and "Alias Smith and Jones" and the like in the 70's and you have to talk to an over 45 crowd to find anyone else that knows what the heck you are babbling about. Of course I also grew up being an intense fan of Star Trek too, so one of my favorite pictures I haven't seen in a long time is one of Leonard Nimoy in full Spock regalia talking to Michael Landon in his Little Joe costume on the Paramount lot and I think one of their cars is in the background. It's such a jarring image it makes me smile to think of it. I just tried google image searching for it but can't find it, alas...

 

[CTF]

It really too big a genre despite how it seems to have dried up in the mid-seventies to discuss briefly because there's just so many Westerns that were made and some that I'm sure I need my memory jogged on because I will have forgotten a great one.

Just as video killed the radio star, it was Vietnam that killed the Western.

 

[robstyle]

I can tell you that some of the more modern movies like Tombstone, 3:10 to Yuma, Appaloosa, and the Assassination of Jesse James paid a LOT of attention to accuracy in weaponry. Doesn't mean they got it all right, but they really took a sincere interest in paying attention to it unlike the westerns of old where any six-shooter would do.

If memory serves, the grips on Ford's gun were uber rare. Something like 100 in existence in the world. A set was secured and replicated. Lots of attention to the little things.

 

[Wes R]

I actually haven't seen any of these yet, not for lack of interest by any means, just only so many hours in a day and they are in my voluminous Netflix queue which this thread makes me want to bump them to the top now.

But yeah, I always despaired a little that most Westerns had too much of the generic 'any six-shooter will do' aspect to them. In the heyday it seemed like they had all these props and most studios seemed to have standing Western street sets that the studios had a financial interest to just keep churning them out.

In my LA days I can remember the thrill I got driving past Paramount on Melrose I think and looking through the gates one could glimpse in the distance in the 80's their western street. I always assumed this was what they'd used as Virgina City in "Bonanza", probably the most "generic" of all westerns where time stood still for all the years it was on the air it seemed.

I vaguely recall Michael Landon talking late in his life how formulaic it was what with any time the Cartwright boys fell in love you knew that she was either a goner or was going to be packed of to San Fransico on the stage coach by the end. I think this was probably on Carson where he also joked how strange it was all those men living in the same house together year after year started to seem. He joked the Cartwright weren't gay, but thank god Hop-Sing was; a naughty joke I remember that Carson nearly fell out of his chair laughing at.

I grew up on reruns of "Bonanza" and "The Virginian" and "Alias Smith and Jones" and the like in the 70's and you have to talk to an over 45 crowd to find anyone else that knows what the heck you are babbling about. Of course I also grew up being an intense fan of Star Trek too, so one of my favorite pictures I haven't seen in a long time is one of Leonard Nimoy in full Spock regalia talking to Michael Landon in his Little Joe costume on the Paramount lot and I think one of their cars is in the background. It's such a jarring image it makes me smile to think of it. I just tried google image searching for it but can't find it, alas...

Westerns these days rarely have the same magic as the older ones, i'm not sure why because if anything the modern ones are probably the most accurate at times. Maybe that's just it, the allure of the western back in the day was that there was no gray area between good and bad. I grew up in the 80s with Big Valley on sundays and some reruns of Bonanza and such.

 

[CTF]

...there was no gray area between good and bad.

Exactly.

That ended with the 'Nam.

 

[The Stig]

Not only is it quite compelling, but that show has some of the best photography of the last decade.

Agreed.
Not since Unforgiven have I actually been that taken in by a western.

 

[Art Andrews]

If memory serves, the grips on Ford's gun were uber rare. Something like 100 in existence in the world. A set was secured and replicated. Lots of attention to the little things.

That is super cool. I had no idea on that! I really thought Casey Affleck did an amazing job of playing Ford, someone who was truly a lowlife, but who was so tragic you just couldn't quite hate him. I dunno, again, I thought this movie was both moving and haunting.

I watched Seraphim Falls and Appaloosa last night, and wow, I forgot how weird SF gets at the end... just odd. With Appalossa, I was once again reminded why I love Vigo and Ed and why I detest Renee... she is just annoying from start to finish and while I know the entire movie pivots around her, I just think it would have been much better without her in it.