Studio Scale ALIEN & ALIENS Narcissus Retooled, redetailed

Discussion in 'Studio Scale Models' started by SSRN Seaview, Jun 23, 2003.

  1. SSRN Seaview

    SSRN Seaview Well-Known Member

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    Email sent.
     
  2. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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  3. DARKSIDE72

    DARKSIDE72 Sr Member

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    It should also be noted that this is a casting of the ALIENS narc and not the ALIEN. Two VERY different models in details and dimensions. I agree with you Paul, this is a very poor rendering of the model.
     
  4. DARKSIDE72

    DARKSIDE72 Sr Member

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    I didn't pass judgment. I didn't need to. The pictures spoke for themselves. I just agreed with Paul's statements.

    First the nose of this model is horrendously wrong. It is offset and far to small. Details are missing. The engine nozzles are incorrectly installed/back wards. The original casting off of the stolen Narc had a cockpit interior, as did the original. The landing gear pods seem incomplete/broken or they have been added incorrectly. The sides seem warped from your pictures.
    Your casting may kick * but the master you used was pretty much crap, there is no way it was an original pull, someone was blowing a lot of smoke up your * man, sorry but these are just the facts. I hope you didn't pay to much for it.

    Here is how the ALIENS Narc should look.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    As far as reference all I have collected other than the model pictured ,is of the original ALIEN Narc.
     
  5. Jedi Dade

    Jedi Dade Sr Member

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    A poor rendering... Then your standards are just too high. It may not be "perfect" but its far from "poor". I agree that there are some things about it that could be corrected but to say its poor is a bit much.

    Jedi Dade
     
  6. DARKSIDE72

    DARKSIDE72 Sr Member

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    I don't require a lecture on my standards son. I am not ashamed to call them as I see them. Why should an individuals standards be anything other than HIGH when shelling out a lot of money for a product? Your god * right I have high standards.
     
  7. Mr. E Man

    Mr. E Man Well-Known Member

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    Noticed this one's up on ebay. BTW, are either of these castings similar to the one the MIM was offering for sale a while back?

    E
     
  8. Utinni

    Utinni Sr Member

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    It looks about the right size that MIM has hanging in their store on the 2nd floor....
     
  9. aliensarchive

    aliensarchive Well-Known Member

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    Wow, that is amazing. Nice ship!
     
  10. Rogue Studios

    Rogue Studios Well-Known Member

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    I think what Darkside72 is saying/expecting is with all of the build up and hoopla and then the curtain finally drops it wasn't what he expected and since it's a WIP maybe you can post pics of the completed one later..when all of the clean up and rescribing is done.
    Lee
     
  11. Dymerski

    Dymerski Well-Known Member

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    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Chaucer44 wrote:
    <HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Darkside, step aside please. Honestly, what makes you the king of all that is grand and holy? This is a HOBBY for christ sakes. Lighten it up.




    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>
    MAN...I agree, I owned a pull from the actual model that I got from Paul F. himself...and built 3 of them with full interiors, this version looks rather nice just a little soft. Just be happy thay Chaucer44 is offering it! although the engines are reversed and need fixed. The nose being too small?, mine looked like that also.
    Dean
     
  12. DARKSIDE72

    DARKSIDE72 Sr Member

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    Yea I know, I'm a rotten bastard for pointing out the obvious. So be it...
     
  13. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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    Well what I told Chaucer is this:

    I bought the original in 96", the photos above that Darkside posted look like they wre take on my desk at Anubis the day it came in.

    I re-molded the piece and made several replicas.

    I assumed that the one that Chaucer received was a recast that someone else had produced on one of mine.

    There is a thing called tells, I put them into every replica I produce. Why do I do it, in case one of my replicas is sold as an original or is recast.

    Just ask the Mantis how my tells helped him determine a prop that he bought as an original was indeed one I produced.

    Honestly I like Chaucer and have nothing but god dealings, but this casting is horrible to say the least.

    It's one thing to get recast, but poorly only hurts the next guy.

    So the tells that I put into the ship are all over Chaucers piece, how do I know, I personally put them there.

    I really don't care I don't own the rights. I just wanted to know who recast it first.

    I will post some pictures of my version soon.

    The ones that MIM were selling and the one in their store were from my molds.

    Paul


    sales@lucasfrancisstudio.com
     
  14. Spellbinder99

    Spellbinder99 Well-Known Member

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    Paul, will these pictures actually point out some of these "tells" so that the casting could definitely be identified as a later generation casting of the one that passed through your hands? Surely now, when you are pointing out the lineage of the model would be the time to do so?

    I am sure that Cris obtained it legitimately but it would be nice to nail down the heritage of such a piece. I only ask this as Moderator of the Aliens Prop Replica Board as I like to have such information available in case the members are interested in purchasing.

    I noticed a large casting of the Narcissus sold recently on e-bay to Rcrobert, so it will definitely be on the re-cast production line soon as he recasts EVERYTHING he buys, but I think that was a smaller version.

    Cris, I know you are a busy man, but it does you no favours when such an obvious thing as having the engine nozzles on backwards is shown on your first casting. I would suggest that even if it was cast that way on the version you got, you cut them off and reverse them. As for the rest, I don't know much about the detailing, but that blares out.

    Cheers

    Tony
     
  15. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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    I only let my Tells be known to people that get duped.

    But the ship that Chaucer has is definitely re-cast from my piece.

    Paul


    sales@lucasfrancisstudio.com
     
  16. Spellbinder99

    Spellbinder99 Well-Known Member

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    OK Paul, thank you for responding.

    Cheers

    Tony
     
  17. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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    Let me follow up by saying, Chris is a stand up guy and I like him and his stuff a lot.

    I have zero rights to that ship and if he wanted to knock off one of my early castings, not only could I do nothing about it, but I wouldn't care.

    I only wanted to give the lineage to that piece so some didn't thing it was cast from a studio original.

    I support Chris's attempt at making that beast, I know I would never tackle that thing again and never want to build another as long as I live! [​IMG]

    If you want what I think is a decent replica, see him and he should be able to hook you up.

    I am also sending him some detailed shots so he can fix some of the problems his boat has. But the pictures will be of the cast piece, I want my little tells to remain! [​IMG]

    Paul

    sales@lucasfrancisstudio.com
     
  18. Utinni

    Utinni Sr Member

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    Excuse me if I'm wrong, but wasn't that ship stolen right after it was on display? And if it was stolen, weren't you worried about owning a stolen piece of studio Property....and then recasting it?????? Or is it a complete fan made replica? Wasn't sure when you say "Original" if it was the original screen used one, or the "original replica that was molded".... Just curious about it...


    Also, just wondering... since you put "tells" into the piece, it's no longer screen accurate... that kinda sucks for collectors if you told them it was.
     
  19. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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    Ah once again an uninformed rumor posted about the Narcissus.

    Let me spell it out for you one more time.

    Back when they were doing Alien war they wanted to use some of the original props from the film. Just so happens that a container at Heathrow airport was storing most of the hero costumes and props from the film. These pieces were liberated by the Alien War people and some pieces were taken that they weren't allowed to take.

    Regardless, Fox nor Jim Cameron never filled a police report and the container was later emptied and the contents shipped to Fox.

    So you see the Narcissus was taken and is used in some of the video shots in Alien War, so it was on the allowed to be taken list.

    After it was used, someone did liberate the piece and most of the props in private hands. In other words if the studio doesn't know you have that original prop, most likely it was liberated (stolen) by someone that worked on the film or dug it out of the trash.

    Some have heard that it was stolen from Bob Burns. That is an outright lie and Bob burns will tell you that himself. He was promised the piece by Jim Cameron. When the piece was taken from the container, it never resurfaced.

    So being promised something and actually owning it were two different things.

    It was offered to Bob Burns before I even considered buying the piece, but he didn't have the cash to pay for such a high priced piece.

    Once I bought the Narc I offered the piece to Bob Burns, but after paying $5000 for the piece, he didn't want to reimburse me for the prop.

    Instead he wanted to give me some props in trade, which would have been fine, but what he wanted to give me was no where near what the Narc was worth or even what I paid for it.

    Anyway, I bought the Narc way after the limitations had run out of the liberation of the Narc. Believe me I checked and even notified Fox and Bob Burns when I bought this piece.

    And as for putting tells onto something, if I didn't do it some of the replicas I was making back in 95' would be passed off as originals.

    Archive this thread, it's the last time I will tell the Narc story.

    You can believe what you want, you can ask Bob Burns, but the piece was legitimate and was never stolen, unless you consider that original prop you got from a buddy under the table as stolen.

    Paul


    sales@lucasfrancisstudio.com
     
  20. Utinni

    Utinni Sr Member

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    Webster's Dictionary definition of Liberate:

    "to take over illegally or unjustly"
     
  21. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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    What's your point Utinni other than to stir the pot?

    Do you have a purpose?

    Paul
     
  22. Utinni

    Utinni Sr Member

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    Nope, I have ALL the info I need now...thanks
     
  23. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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  24. Utinni

    Utinni Sr Member

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    I was just asking a question and thought your candy coated definition of stealing was interesting...among other things...

    But I have what I needed, thank you.
     
  25. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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    So you are saying that I stole the Narcissus?

    Even after offering it to the guy it was promised to and Fox Archives?

    What original props do you own and where did you get them?

    Paul
     
  26. Spellbinder99

    Spellbinder99 Well-Known Member

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    Paul, just a simple question......The Narcissus you have/had, it was the original Aliens prop?

    Do you still have it? Just interested as an Aliens fan, no other motives so PLEASE don't read any more into the question than there is.

    Cheers

    Tony
     
  27. Utinni

    Utinni Sr Member

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    I'm not suggesting anything, all I did was ask a question. You said enough, which is what I needed.

    thank you!
     
  28. patsmear

    patsmear Sr Member

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    Paul,

    I don't think that ship was used by Alien War for there promo's. It wasn't on display when I was there at least. I also remember some Fox executives coming through and they all seemed pretty cool that we were displaying the props from the 3 films.

    Pat
     
  29. Stormy320

    Stormy320 Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    I wanted to add that I appreciate Darkside and Paul for stepping in on this thread and letting everyone know this prop may not be super accurate. There are so many props out there that it is impossible to be an expert on all of them. If you know a prop being offered is not 100% you need to say so.

    This is not necessarily to Chaucer, but more in general. I don't know how much Chaucer wants to charge for the ship and it may be completely reasonable for what it is.

    However, I am soo tired of so many fans offering props for sale and acting like they are the greatest version ever when in fact they are full of errors, disappointment, and sometimes a waste of money. Many times it is hard to tell from the pictures how good something is and then when you get the item you can be very disappointed.

    I wish we were a little more disclosing and pointed out the flaws first.
     
  30. Birdie

    Birdie Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    The dowside of that argument is the potential for abuse. A good example being the recent 'Apogee' Vader helmet fiasco, where a product was bashed by a sockpuppeting rival. If you are aiming to buy a high-end prop, check out the seller's rep on the board, talk to someone who has bought one. Do your homework, basically. If you're not sure, don't buy.
     
  31. DARKSIDE72

    DARKSIDE72 Sr Member

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    There was never an intention of abuse here for the record. It was simply an issue over the quality of a master used in a casting. As a potential customer and collector myself I thought it was important to speak out about it. I don't think Chaucer has any bad intentions , I do think he was lied to about the master he used, as it was not a 1st generation cast and had some serious accuracy problems. Again as Birdie said do a lot of homework and ask many questions before buying a high end prop. Know what you are buying.
     
  32. SSRN Seaview

    SSRN Seaview Well-Known Member

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    Email sent on the 1st casting.
     
  33. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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    Sending and posting photos of the original.

    Also if I have extra parts, they are yours if I can find them.

    Sell away dude!

    Paul
     
  34. PaulF2000

    PaulF2000 Well-Known Member

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    In this forum, just look down!

    Paul
     
  35. aliensarchive

    aliensarchive Well-Known Member

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    I don't think you can retool a 'Aliens' Narcissus to resemble the 'Alien' one. They are two completely different models with different dimensions.
     
  36. SSRN Seaview

    SSRN Seaview Well-Known Member

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    Yes it showed up the other day and it looks good. Just a minor split due to some rough handling but nothing that can't be repaired. Will be doing some cleanup and triming this weekend.
     
  37. 8 perf

    8 perf Sr Member

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    Thanks for the kudos everyone. This thread and info has been moved to its own thread per peoples request to separate it from this threads discussion.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2008
  38. 8 perf

    8 perf Sr Member

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    delete this
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2008
  39. timeslip

    timeslip Well-Known Member

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    WOW, that is simply a gorgeous build! You did an incredible job.
    George:cool
     
  40. Jedirick

    Jedirick Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    WOW!

    I saw the raw meat he started with! This is incredible.

    hey! I have this studio scale AT AT kit....
     
  41. takevin

    takevin Sr Member

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    You should start a new post, since its so old and had me confused till i jumped to the last page.
     
  42. Emeldahay

    Emeldahay Well-Known Member

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    I got one of the chaucerheaps.

    your a brave man taking it on - what mess the kits are.
     
  43. feek61

    feek61 Sr Member

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    Wow, a lot of history on this one!!! I too think you should start a new thread. Yours looks great to me.


    Will
     

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