Star Trek Into Darkness (Pre-release)

[SSgt Burton]

By all means, how would you describe the 'human' aspect of the story? What is it about Star Trek that must only be associated with the 'human' aspect of story telling? In fact, what makes it a universally human story?

There are no aliens on Earth that watch Star Trek.

The only beings that watch Star Trek are humans.

So any story no matter how removed from humanity it may seem on the surface, will have themes/allegories that are directly related to humanity, because the only audience that will experience it are human beings.

That's the whole bloody point of science fiction.


If you're looking for some universal themes in Star Trek '09, here's two:


"Be careful what you wish for; you might get it"

"Honour thy Mother and Father"


Basic, but eternal themes.





Kevin

 

[DARTH SABER]

There are no aliens on Earth that watch Star Trek.

The only beings that watch Star Trek are humans.

So any story no matter how removed from humanity it may seem on the surface, will have themes/allegories that are directly related to humanity, because the only audience that will experience it are human beings.

That's the whole bloody point of science fiction.


If you're looking for some universal themes in Star Trek '09, here's two:


"Be careful what you wish for; you might get it"

"Honour thy Mother and Father"


Basic, but eternal themes.





Kevin

thumbsup:thumbsup

Another theme in Trek09 - Teamwork, its always beneficial. The film couldn't have made it any clearer. Spock had issues, Kirk had issues. Even the early part of the film is edited with jumps back and forth to show Kirk's problems and Spock's problems mirroring each other. Both had to put that aside for the greater good.
While Wrath of Khan may have been about Kirk finally facing facing a no-win scenario against Khan and losing Spock in the process, Trek 09 has Kirk learning this lesson on his first mission, forcing him and Spock to make amends and possibly forge a friendship.

I think TOS made it clear that the reason the crew was so successful in their missions was because there was a balance of teamwork going on. The new filmsh shows the beginnings of that.

 

[Jeyl]

There are no aliens on Earth that watch Star Trek.

The only beings that watch Star Trek are humans.

I'm pretty sure that a lot of writers who have worked on Star Trek including myself understand that concept clearly. What I don't think you understand Burton is that when I say that I like the alien characters of Star Trek, it's not because I can directly relate back to the human race. I can accept these fictional aliens for what they are. Odo is a changeling who can't eat or drink and has a unique ability to physically meld with others of his own kind. Tholians are a crystalline species who communicate though complex chirps, live in extreme temperatures and can develop technology to build webs in space.

I liked Star Trek when it wasn't afraid to deal with alien cultures and go into territories that didn't depend upon 'relatable' safe zones. Even TOS depicted Spock's logic in a positive productive way that the human characters wouldn't generally think about. Not really the case with JJ's Trek since most of the time anything associated with logic is an arrogant, racist a**hole and the only advice he's given is to give in to his 'human' emotions. Looks like that's going to be the same case again with NuSpock's logic telling him it's better to die in a volcano than let some natives see the Enterprise.

"Honour thy Mother and Father"

Even JJ's Star Trek fails at that.

Pike: Your father would be proud.

I seem to recall that Kirk had a mother once who survived the events of the film's opening. Maybe the opening was some illusion and Kirk was born asexually? Naw. The film makers probably believe that if mothers aren't being used to make babies, they're just non-productive emotional anchors for their male characters to give them motivation to move the plot along.

 

[CessnaDriver]

Guys that don't get along first and then come together for a great team.

Like... The Avengers? Protectors of earth.

 

[greatwazoo42]

Guys that don't get along first and then come together for a great team.

Like... The Avengers? Protectors of earth.

...or Firefly.

 

[protokev DMD]

Here we go with the mother routine again. Thanks SSgt.

 

[Proper]

I seem to recall that Kirk had a mother once who survived the events of the film's opening. Maybe the opening was some illusion and Kirk was born asexually? Naw. The film makers probably believe that if mothers aren't being used to make babies, they're just non-productive emotional anchors for their male characters to give them motivation to move the plot along.

Good God, who the h**ll cares?!!! Let's see... I don't! Many fans don't.

This isn't, TOS 101! It's not must-follow-Trek-TV! Trek'09 stands on its own dais. As I said before, the Trek-world is a stage for artists who may care some or little about what the previous performer did on-stage in pursuit of his/her own talents! Trek offers much more than the sum of its nit-picky parts and details. Too often a fan sadly falls into the trap of focusing on the physicality of Trek as if it were real! Some people need Canon as if it were the air they breathe. If you refuse to see the forest for the trees, which is the enjoyment of the current Trek experience as the entertaining cinematic art and storytelling that it is, so be it. Whom does that really hurt?

 

[Jeyl]

The problem here is that we're not talking about a real world object like a car or a jet. We're talking about a fictional spacecraft that's functionality is determined by fiction.

Yeah, but you're not going to really sell the excitement factor if your fictional technology doesn't have a certain set of rules. It's cool that a ship can do awesome things, but if it can do 'anything' with little to no downside, there's almost no sense of danger. Even classic Trek was pretty iffy on it's own rules, but it didn't outright abolish them in one sitting.

 

[Jeyl]

Good God, who the h**ll cares?!!!

Uh, people who have mothers? I know whenever I did something important, I knew that both my mom and dad would be proud of me, regardless of what their jobs were. Why wouldn't Kirk's mother not be proud of what her son did, whether she was in starfleet or not? Mothers can be just as hopeful for their kids as the fathers are.

This isn't, TOS 101!

Good. Even TOS, as timeless and as great as it's stories may be, is not my ideal Star Trek series that I would want future installments to adhere by. You want a series that has good stories really sells the equal representation concept to it's fullest, go watch Deep Space Nine. Not only do women hold positions of high rank, they actually wear the same type of uniforms that their male counterparts wear. Also, Sisko plays Baseball with the Vulcans.

 

[Proper]

I seem to recall that Kirk had a mother once who survived the events of the film's opening. Maybe the opening was some illusion and Kirk was born asexually? Naw. The film makers probably believe that if mothers aren't being used to make babies, they're just non-productive emotional anchors for their male characters to give them motivation to move the plot along.

Sarcasm.

Good God, who the h**ll cares?!!! Let's see... I don't! Many fans don't.

This isn't, TOS 101! It's not must-follow-Trek-TV! Trek'09 stands on its own dais. As I said before, the Trek-world is a stage for artists who may care some or little about what the previous performer did on-stage in pursuit of his/her own talents! Trek offers much more than the sum of its nit-picky parts and details. Too often a fan sadly falls into the trap of focusing on the physicality of Trek as if it were real! Some people need Canon as if it were the air they breathe. If you refuse to see the forest for the trees, which is the enjoyment of the current Trek experience as the entertaining cinematic art and storytelling that it is, so be it. Whom does that really hurt?

Uh, people who have mothers? I know whenever I did something important, I knew that both my mom and dad would be proud of me, regardless of what their jobs were. Why wouldn't Kirk's mother not be proud of what her son did, whether she was in starfleet or not? Mothers can be just as hopeful for their kids as the fathers are.

Again, you dodge my point and choose to twist the meaning with more sarcasm. My point wasn't about mothers or sons or parents. And you know it. I'm a parent myself. But that's OK. :rolleyes

 

[PotionMistress]

Honestly, I don’t know why any of you who only care for the ‘entertainment’ value of the movies even worry about what other’s think about them anyway. So don’t concern yourself with the details or those who like to discuss them either. Go to the movies, enjoy them, period….great! No problem. That’s perfectly understandable. You don’t have to participate in any further in-depth discussions if that is all you want to focus on because you are already satisfied with ‘just the entertainment.’ But why then try to dissuade others who would like to delve and argue a bit about what interests THEM about the series and want to critique away at them? A good argument is often fun and productive.

"...I came here for an argument..
'No you didn't!'
''Yes, I did!..."

 

[SSgt Burton]

I'm pretty sure that a lot of writers who have worked on Star Trek including myself understand that concept clearly.

Care to share your writing credit with us?


PS- I do have a first name you know. It's at the end of every post I make.


Kevin

 

[Jeyl]

Care to share your writing credit with us?

Star Trek Generations. I re-wrote it when I was in lower school. Reworking stories was one of my favorite hobbies.

 

[Jeyl]

Again, you dodge my point and choose to twist the meaning with more sarcasm. My point wasn't about mothers or sons or parents. And you know it. I'm a parent myself. But that's OK. :rolleyes

Well, if your son/daughter does anything important, I'll remember to include you and your significant other in my compliments. Because why wouldn't anyone?

 

[Paul Andrew]

Not to pick nits, but isn't rewriting a movie as a hobby basically fanfic? I'm not sure that's what most would call a 'writing credit'.

 

[Jeyl]

Not to pick nits, but isn't rewriting a movie as a hobby basically fanfic? I'm not sure that's what most would call a 'writing credit'.

Hey, Star Trek has had plenty of writers who have had their names removed from their own stories. I proudly stick to mine.

 

[SSgt Burton]

Kevin

 

[Jeyl]

Kevin

DC Fontana, one of the writers of the original series who also worked on TNG, DS9 AND THE FAN SERIES Phase Two, changed her name from the episode "The Naked Now" because it was a huge embarrassment for everyone involved.

 

[Bryancd]

DC Fontana, one of the writers of the original series who also worked on TNG, DS9 AND THE FAN SERIES Phase Two, changed her name from the episode "The Naked Now" because it was a huge embarrassment for everyone involved.

:confused What does that have to do....never mind.

 

[MooCriket]

This thread just keeps getting more and more and more interesting.

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