'If you carry fake guns - we will treat them as real'

[Wistanley]

Don't know if this is all of the UK or just Cheshire, but it bodes ill.

Linky:
http://www.thisischeshire.co.uk/display.va...hem_as_real.php

SINISTER images of hooded men posing with lethal Mach 10 pistols prompted armed police to carry out an early morning raid.

Officers recovered replica guns and drugs after searching a house in Masefield Avenue, Widnes, last Friday morning.

Det Ch Insp Martin Cleworth warned that anyone carrying replica weapons will be treated as an armed person.

He said: "This is a very dangerous piece of kit. It ain't cool to carry any type of weapon.

"This incident demonstrates the difficulty that police officers face. In order to protect the public, we need to treat these weapons as if they are real until we know otherwise.

"We would encourage parents to impress upon children that they should not be carrying any form of weapon in the street, whether replica or not.

"We will deal robustly with all incidents of this nature and prosecute wherever possible."

Five people were arrested and released on bail for a variety of offences.[/b]

 

[DarthWillie]

Well you shouldn't cary them in the street, makes sense. Just as long as you just collect them there shouldn't be a problem.

Unfortunatly in the Netherlands we're not even allowed to posses them :cry

 

[Stampedemag]

God bless the USA. You never realize the freedoms here until you hear stuff like this. We think the "DC Nazis" are bad (DragonCon security) yeesh.

 

[tommin]

SINISTER images of hooded men posing with lethal Mach 10 pistols prompted armed police to carry out an early morning raid.[/b]

That just SOUNDS wrong no matter how it is read. Hopefully, that wasn't the ONLY 'just cause'.

 

[Scapey]

"Mach 10"?
LOL

That aside, this is probably in the paper because of the recently-passed VCR bill.

It always WAS illegal to carry a replica gun in public - Not to mention stupid.
Under current laws, if you have a reasonable reason for having one ( En route to, or at, an organised skirmish or re-enactment event ) then you're OK.
( Obviously, the gun should be in a bag or case when en route to and from events ).

 

[terryr]

How about fake drivers licenses? Will they treat them as real too?

 

[Rodann]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tommin @ Jan 13 2007, 02:19 PM) [snapback]1396569[/snapback]</div>

SINISTER images of hooded men posing with lethal Mach 10 pistols prompted armed police to carry out an early morning raid.[/b]

That just SOUNDS wrong no matter how it is read. Hopefully, that wasn't the ONLY 'just cause'.
[/b]

Exactly what I was thinking. "Sinister"?? Good grief, under that justification, someone could decide to raid all of US. It could have been a bad attempt at costuming or photo reenactment. I've seen some guys here pose in realistic shots.

"Mach 10". :lol

I agree, it's always been illegal to carry this stuff in public. That's just common sense. But Cleworth is conveniently changing the subject, isn't he? Typical police/media tactic. Call three pistols, a rifle, a knife, and a pipe an "arsenal", and so forth. It sounds like they only raided these guys based on poses in pictures. Hooded or not. That's just scary. And not for the reasons they think. They did find drugs, though, so maybe they had these guys under surveillance already.

Yeah, the DC Nazis......they weren't as bad this year, though. Last year, the security was that way, but the cops seemed laid back. THIS year, it was actually the opposite.

 

[Harry Harris]

I'm slightly shocked that a Detective Chief Inspector would say something like "It ain't cool to carry any type of weapon."

Will he be pictured wearing his hoodie next?

I agree with what Reverend Scapegoat said above though, that if you're caught with a replica weapon - particularly if you're brandishing it as if it were real, then the authorities will treat it as real.

This has been the case in the UK for a long time, and it goes further than that; if you hold up a bank with a banana in a bag you'll be prosecuted for gun crime.

Harry

 

[Birdie]

I am holding a gub.

 

[tommin]

Anyone have a jedi robe and a Gillette Mach3 handy? Please take advantage of this photo op.

 

[bigbaddaddyvader]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stampedemag @ Jan 13 2007, 06:51 PM) [snapback]1396558[/snapback]</div>

God bless the USA. You never realize the freedoms here until you hear stuff like this. We think the "DC Nazis" are bad (DragonCon security) yeesh.
[/b]

Are any of you serious that you actually see this as a BAD thing?Come on....surely you can understand that walking in the street,in this day and age,with realistic replica firearms is inherently dangerous and blindingly stupid.If you are carrying a realistic firearm IN THE STREET you deserve what you have coming for your idiocy.And let's not really try to see the ludicrously lax US firearms regulations,or lack thereof,as something to be envied.there are many things to be proud of about the freedoms in the US and the level of integration achieved there.The attitude to firearms is not.Take it from me having lived in Northern Ireland all my life-GUNS ARE BAD.
If you collect them you'll be fine with your collection-in your house.

 

[Chingon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stampedemag @ Jan 13 2007, 10:51 AM) [snapback]1396558[/snapback]</div>

God bless the USA. You never realize the freedoms here until you hear stuff like this. We think the "DC Nazis" are bad (DragonCon security) yeesh.
[/b]

I'm pretty sure most states in the US have similar laws about replica weapons and rightly so. If you're stupid enough to brandish ANY object as if it were a weapon towards LE, then you quite clearly deserve your fate.

 

[mandybat]

"Harry Stanley was shot dead by police on 22 September 1999 in East London. He was walking home carrying a plastic bag containing a table leg and had stopped in a pub, where another customer, mistaking his Scottish accent for Irish and the table leg for a sawn-off shotgun, had called the police. As a result, a Metropolitan Police armed response unit arrived in the area. Two officers followed Harry Stanley and fired two shots. He died instantly."

Thats how bad it is here in the U.K .

 

[Rodann]

Okay, I don't understand what it's like in the UK right now, I'll admit that. But that pub guy getting shot is a perfect example of paranoia, not lawbreaking. That kind of soccer-mom-knee-jerk-reaction happens over here, as well. And the cops shot a guy twice for something in a BAG?? Did he try to reach into it or something? They over-reacted, IMO. But I wasn't there, so I don't know all the details.

As for brandishing a fake gun...........that wasn't the point, was it? Those guys were arrested because of PICTURES. Like I said, Cleworth changed the subject. Now we have, too. They weren't arrested because they brandished ANYTHING in public, as far as I can read above. Unless I misread something. Not the first time.

 

[Stampedemag]

When did I ever say it was ok to go down the street brandishing a weapon? If you are going to a con over there it looks like you cant have ANY weapon. Real, fake, whatever. Try to be Laura Croft with no pistols, Indy without his whip and gun, Punisher without any weapons... it just isn't the same.

I was getting ready for a Halloween parade this year and a cop was going to get his gun. I was Jason with a machete so he got spooked. I guess he thought the movies were real and so was I. Next time I won't be as convincing. lol I didn't try to kill someone but only walked down the street. Keep in mind this was for a HALLOWEEN PARADE with everyone saying oooo look Jason. lol That cop was transferred to animal control.

My point is I don't want to live somewhere that I can make a prop and get shot for it. That is a little much. Gun control only keeps guns away from law-abiding people. Like they say here "only criminals will have guns".

Gun control that strict does nothing to stop violence from happening. People will kill people wether it is with a gun, kife, baseball bat, bare fist it doesn't matter. Just look at your recent prositiute slayings. Just because they weren't shot doesn't mean they aren't just as dead.

All in all I don't think a toy gun is going to be the end of the world. If a cop sees you with a gun and orders you to put it down slowly (while at gunpoint) you should do it. If you try to "shoot" him with it by all means you should be taken out of the gene pool before you replicate.

(getting off of soapbox)

 

[bigbaddaddyvader]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stampedemag @ Jan 14 2007, 03:31 AM) [snapback]1396826[/snapback]</div>

Gun control only keeps guns away from law-abiding people. Like they say here "only criminals will have guns".

Gun control that strict does nothing to stop violence from happening. People will kill people wether it is with a gun, kife, baseball bat, bare fist it doesn't matter. Just look at your recent prositiute slayings. Just because they weren't shot doesn't mean they aren't just as dead.

(getting off of soapbox)
[/b]

That argument is as sterile as it is flawed.As anyone should rightly be aware the proliferation of firearms causes a rise in violent crime.This is not something that can be flippantly cast out of hand with that old NRA chestnut "Guns don't kill people,people kill people.".A shotgun for home protection is one thing but semi-automatic rifles and handguns?
Violent crime exists in many forms and will continue to do so as it always has.However it cannot be disputed that the more guns you hand people the greater the likelihood they will be used and misused.I would like to ask our members in the US one simple question to gauge genuine response:
Has the level of gun ownership and use in your country improved your life?
For myself I can just say that the only things that firearms have brought my country is heartache and loss.I welcome all firearms regulations that make it more difficult for them to be in private possession.Let's not disguise this one iota.Guns are dangerous.People with guns more so.Best to take one out of the equation I feel.

 

[Feraud]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bigbaddaddyvader @ Jan 14 2007, 03:59 AM) [snapback]1396855[/snapback]</div>

However it cannot be disputed that the more guns you hand people the greater the likelihood they will be used and misused.
[/b]

This comment makes no sense at all as justification for banning firearm ownership.
Technically speaking the more people run with scissors, the more likely someone in a household is to get stabbed. What is the solution? Teach people to not run with scissors or ban them?

 

[Rodann]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bigbaddaddyvader @ Jan 13 2007, 10:59 PM) [snapback]1396855[/snapback]</div>

Guns are dangerous.People with guns more so.Best to take one out of the equation I feel.
[/b]

Leave the gun, take the cannoli. I love cannolis. They're creamy, and crunchy at the same time, and not too sweet. They're especially good with chocolate chips. But that's the Italian in me, I like baked goods.




In case you were wondering, I was trying to lighten the mood, before this thread becomes a US/UK political argument. Trying to understand each others' ONLY point of reference, or lack thereof, isn't likely to happen. I wasn't born in a "gun-less" society. Or aircraft carrier -less, for that matter. Smart move, there, I say.

 

[SG Merc]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bigbaddaddyvader @ Jan 13 2007, 10:59 PM) [snapback]1396855[/snapback]</div>

Has the level of gun ownership and use in your country improved your life?[/b]

As you mentioned, you have the IRA ... we don't.

As for the VCR bill: as soon as the government starts making laws for things that are common sense you 've already lost your rights.

 

[Rodann]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SG Merc @ Jan 13 2007, 11:09 PM) [snapback]1396860[/snapback]</div>

As you mentioned, you have the IRA ... we don't.

[/b]

D'oh. Ouch. :lol