Everything great about ROTS

[astroboy]

I've stated this a few times, but I feel it can never be said enough.

ROTS may not be the WORST of the prequels (Cuz TPM is just so crazy terrible) BUT it has the single biggest failure of any of the Star Wars movies and tells me that George Lucas was just calling it in...

That Failure is showing Darth Vader at the end of ROTS... it was such a money grab it blows my mind... and yet leaving him out could have at least SAVED the ending of that flick.

So here's why showing Vader ruined ROTS and the transition to ANH... and kind of, if you watch the whole thing in order, ruins the OT as well! (hyperbole!)

By showing Anakin becoming Vader, it ruins the reveal of who Vader was in Empire Strikes Back. It makes "No. I am your father" a pointless revelation.

HOWEVER, if they never showed him, here's how the story would look if you watched all the flicks in a row (if you're so inclined to torture yourself for 3 movies).

In the Phantom Menace we're introduced to two bad guys... Darth Sidious, and his apprentice DARTH MAUL. We know nothing of Maul cept he's a Sith... A "Darth" and a great character design. In the end, Maul kills Qui-Gon, and Obi kills Maul. Sidious/Palpatine is going to need a new apprentice.

Then we get to Attack of the Clones, and meet the NEW apprentice... I think... Not sure what he is, but either way, new bad guy in black, Count Dooku. We get another Mysterious past, but the guy survives to the next flick.

Then in ROTS we see Dooku killed pretty early on... So Palatine needs another apprentice. Also in this movie we get yet ANOTHER new bad guy. A coughing robot. But he still uses lightsabers, so here's your third bad guy enforcer, who is also killed... by Kenobi. 3 for 3 dead Palpatine apprentices.

So here's how Revenge of the Sith SHOULD HAVE ENDED.

Kenobi and Anakin fight. Anakin has his legs and arms cut off, and starts on fire, is burning to death. Ben yells the usual "WE WERE BROTHERS!" and Anakin screams back "WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? ARE WE EVEN FRIENDS? WE HAVE ZERO CHEMISTRYYYYYY" and passes out. Face in the ground.

Ben looks at him, sadly, takes the lightsaber from the ground and walks away. We never see Anakin again in the movie. Just his burned, corpse looking body in the dirt.

Ben drops off Luke and Leia... movie ends.

Now we start ANH.... first thing that happens: a FOURTH bad guy is introduced. Another Darth. Now if you're looking at these in order, as a complete story, this is perfect. Just another bad dude, just like every other movie.

Then we meet Ben again for the first time in forever. We watch as he tells like this NEW Darth is the guy that killed his father. Ben looks like a lying A-hole, not owning up to killing Luke's dad, and placing the blame on a scape goat...

Then when Ben and Vader meet there's HINTS he's Anakin, but then if you're not looking for it to be Anakin, it's no different than that past Dooku had with Kenobi... They know each other, talk crap about each other, and fight.

And by the time we get to Empire, the "I am your father!" "Oh my gawwwwwwd Anakin didn't die!!" moment can happen.

But nooooo. All of this is ruined so they could put Vader in promotional crap for ROTS.

I really like that version!

 

[Cephus]

The real problem with the prequels is the time they were made. The original trilogy has a particular look and feel to them that makes them a cohesive set. By the time the prequels were made, filmmaking had changed and they have a completely different feel. So does TFA. That's why I say that Star Wars ended in 1983, because they just don't make movies like that anymore. I say the same thing, for instance, about Crystal Skull. It isn't an Indiana Jones movie because filmmaking and storytelling had changed dramatically between the end of Last Crusade and the beginning of Crystal Skull. You just can't go home again.

 

[NeoRutty]

I really like that version!

Thanks!

Funny thing is, when ROTS was in pre production and rumors James Earl Jones was doing Vaders voice, I called shenanigans!

I told all my friends there was NO WAY they would show Vader at the end and ruin Empire's review, and I stated pretty much exactly what I wrote in the last post...

Then was SHOCKED when they really did show him. What a missed opportunity.

 

[astroboy]

Thanks!

Funny thing is, when ROTS was in pre production and rumors James Earl Jones was doing Vaders voice, I called shenanigans!

I told all my friends there was NO WAY they would show Vader at the end and ruin Empire's review, and I stated pretty much exactly what I wrote in the last post...

Then was SHOCKED when they really did show him. What a missed opportunity.

I was hoping that we would see a prototype costume, with less armour.

But that last scene was awful

 

[Axlotl]

"WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? ARE WE EVEN FRIENDS? WE HAVE ZERO CHEMISTRYYYYYY"

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

The real problem with the prequels is that they were made.

Fixed that for you.

 

[Snikt]

The real problem with the prequels is the time they were made. The original trilogy has a particular look and feel to them that makes them a cohesive set. By the time the prequels were made, filmmaking had changed and they have a completely different feel. So does TFA. That's why I say that Star Wars ended in 1983, because they just don't make movies like that anymore. I say the same thing, for instance, about Crystal Skull. It isn't an Indiana Jones movie because filmmaking and storytelling had changed dramatically between the end of Last Crusade and the beginning of Crystal Skull. You just can't go home again.

I totally disagree with this. If you have a good story to tell, and competent people to tell it, it will be told the way it was meant to be. Are you talking about filmmaking had changed in the sense of technology? Yes, I doubt we will ever have a full blown practical effects driven blockbuster ever again. But TFA came pretty damn close. Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull sucked because the story wasnt there, the dialogue, writing... The very foundations of a good movie werent there, hence a crappy movie. Mad Max says otherwise about going home.

 

[astroboy]

I totally disagree with this. If you have a good story to tell, and competent people to tell it, it will be told the way it was meant to be. Are you talking about filmmaking had changed in the sense of technology? Yes, I doubt we will ever have a full blown practical effects driven blockbuster ever again. But TFA came pretty damn close. Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull sucked because the story wasnt there, the dialogue, writing... The very foundations of a good movie werent there, hence a crappy movie. Mad Max says otherwise about going home.

Mad Max was amazing.

And not only that but whenever I think about how fantastic Nux' character arc was, I think about how much I couldn't stand Finn. Who had no character arc.

George Miller schooled us on turning a bad guy into good guy

 

[AJTaliesen]

.and i think you'd have a fine action movie for a more civilized age.

what weird world is this where i'm trying to be positive?

I can't even talk to you when you're like this. :lol





Those movies are bad and you should feel bad about it. TFA was a better movie.

 

[KrangPrime]

I can't even talk to you when you're like this. :lol





Those movies are bad and you should feel bad about it. TFA was a better movie.

boy, try to give people what they want, and you still can't win ;o)

Don't make me say 'I like Jar Jar'... I really don't, but at this point i'm just craaaaazy enough to do it! ;o)..

 

[Snikt]

Mad Max was amazing.

And not only that but whenever I think about how fantastic Nux' character arc was, I think about how much I couldn't stand Finn. Who had no character arc.

George Miller schooled us on turning a bad guy into good guy

I never saw Nux as a "bad guy" per se, more of a misguided character that saw something different. I feel as though we didnt get enough of Finns backstory. That was one of my beefs with the TFA was Finn, I enjoyed him on screen, I liked the actor portraying him, but I didnt understand how a mentally conditioned stormtrooper could defect like that.

But yeah George Miller rules!
AJTaliesen Thank you sir, couldnt agree more!

 

[Greenie]

I've stated this a few times, but I feel it can never be said enough.

ROTS may not be the WORST of the prequels (Cuz TPM is just so crazy terrible) BUT it has the single biggest failure of any of the Star Wars movies and tells me that George Lucas was just calling it in...

That Failure is showing Darth Vader at the end of ROTS... it was such a money grab it blows my mind... and yet leaving him out could have at least SAVED the ending of that flick.

So here's why showing Vader ruined ROTS and the transition to ANH... and kind of, if you watch the whole thing in order, ruins the OT as well! (hyperbole!)

By showing Anakin becoming Vader, it ruins the reveal of who Vader was in Empire Strikes Back. It makes "No. I am your father" a pointless revelation.

HOWEVER, if they never showed him, here's how the story would look if you watched all the flicks in a row (if you're so inclined to torture yourself for 3 movies).

In the Phantom Menace we're introduced to two bad guys... Darth Sidious, and his apprentice DARTH MAUL. We know nothing of Maul cept he's a Sith... A "Darth" and a great character design. In the end, Maul kills Qui-Gon, and Obi kills Maul. Sidious/Palpatine is going to need a new apprentice.

Then we get to Attack of the Clones, and meet the NEW apprentice... I think... Not sure what he is, but either way, new bad guy in black, Count Dooku. We get another Mysterious past, but the guy survives to the next flick.

Then in ROTS we see Dooku killed pretty early on... So Palatine needs another apprentice. Also in this movie we get yet ANOTHER new bad guy. A coughing robot. But he still uses lightsabers, so here's your third bad guy enforcer, who is also killed... by Kenobi. 3 for 3 dead Palpatine apprentices.

So here's how Revenge of the Sith SHOULD HAVE ENDED.

Kenobi and Anakin fight. Anakin has his legs and arms cut off, and starts on fire, is burning to death. Ben yells the usual "WE WERE BROTHERS!" and Anakin screams back "WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? ARE WE EVEN FRIENDS? WE HAVE ZERO CHEMISTRYYYYYY" and passes out. Face in the ground.

Ben looks at him, sadly, takes the lightsaber from the ground and walks away. We never see Anakin again in the movie. Just his burned, corpse looking body in the dirt.

Ben drops off Luke and Leia... movie ends.

Now we start ANH.... first thing that happens: a FOURTH bad guy is introduced. Another Darth. Now if you're looking at these in order, as a complete story, this is perfect. Just another bad dude, just like every other movie.

Then we meet Ben again for the first time in forever. We watch as he tells like this NEW Darth is the guy that killed his father. Ben looks like a lying A-hole, not owning up to killing Luke's dad, and placing the blame on a scape goat...

Then when Ben and Vader meet there's HINTS he's Anakin, but then if you're not looking for it to be Anakin, it's no different than that past Dooku had with Kenobi... They know each other, talk crap about each other, and fight.

And by the time we get to Empire, the "I am your father!" "Oh my gawwwwwwd Anakin didn't die!!" moment can happen.

But nooooo. All of this is ruined so they could put Vader in promotional crap for ROTS.

This is exactly right. It's the same as the Yoda spoiler. He should not have even been in the PT. As well as revealing twins and naming them, for the hard of thinking!

 

[Darth Lars]

This is exactly right. It's the same as the Yoda spoiler. He should not have even been in the PT. As well as revealing twins and naming them, for the hard of thinking!

I think that it would have been cool if we had seen the Jedi Council at a distance. For instance, the Jedi Council scenes in TPM could have been Obi-Wan and Anakin waiting outside the council chamber's doors, waiting for Qui-Gon. As the doors open, we get a quick glance of Yoda and a couple of the other council members sitting smug on their "thrones". Qui-Gon comes out, absolutely furious. Obi-Wan: "What did they say?"... and so on.

 

[KrangPrime]

i liked seeing yoda as something other than a broken down old hermit.

nice contrast when you see him again in the other episodes.

 

[annanake]

I've stated this a few times, but I feel it can never be said
enough.

ROTS may not be the WORST of the prequels (Cuz TPM is just so crazy terrible) BUT it has the single biggest failure of any of the Star Wars movies and tells me that George Lucas was just calling it in...

That Failure is showing Darth Vader at the end of ROTS... it was such a money grab it blows my mind... and yet leaving him out could have at least SAVED the ending of that flick.

So here's why showing Vader ruined ROTS and the transition to ANH... and kind of, if you watch the whole thing in order, ruins the OT as well! (hyperbole!)

By showing Anakin becoming Vader, it ruins the reveal of who Vader was in Empire Strikes Back. It makes "No. I am your father" a pointless revelation.

HOWEVER, if they never showed him, here's how the story would look if you watched all the flicks in a row (if you're so inclined to torture yourself for 3 movies).

In the Phantom Menace we're introduced to two bad guys... Darth Sidious, and his apprentice DARTH MAUL. We know nothing of Maul cept he's a Sith... A "Darth" and a great character design. In the end, Maul kills Qui-Gon, and Obi kills Maul. Sidious/Palpatine is going to need a new apprentice.

Then we get to Attack of the Clones, and meet the NEW apprentice... I think... Not sure what he is, but either way, new bad guy in black, Count Dooku. We get another Mysterious past, but the guy survives to the next flick.

Then in ROTS we see Dooku killed pretty early on... So Palatine needs another apprentice. Also in this movie we get yet ANOTHER new bad guy. A coughing robot. But he still uses lightsabers, so here's your third bad guy enforcer, who is also killed... by Kenobi. 3 for 3 dead Palpatine apprentices.

So here's how Revenge of the Sith SHOULD HAVE ENDED.

Kenobi and Anakin fight. Anakin has his legs and arms cut off, and starts on fire, is burning to death. Ben yells the usual "WE WERE BROTHERS!" and Anakin screams back "WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? ARE WE EVEN FRIENDS? WE HAVE ZERO CHEMISTRYYYYYY" and passes out. Face in the ground.

Ben looks at him, sadly, takes the lightsaber from the ground and walks away. We never see Anakin again in the movie. Just his burned, corpse looking body in the dirt.

Ben drops off Luke and Leia... movie ends.

Now we start ANH.... first thing that happens: a FOURTH bad guy is introduced. Another Darth. Now if you're looking at these in order, as a complete story, this is perfect. Just another bad dude, just like every other movie.

Then we meet Ben again for the first time in forever. We watch as he tells like this NEW Darth is the guy that killed his father. Ben looks like a lying A-hole, not owning up to killing Luke's dad, and placing the blame on a scape goat...

Then when Ben and Vader meet there's HINTS he's Anakin, but then if you're not looking for it to be Anakin, it's no different than that past Dooku had with Kenobi... They know each other, talk crap about each other, and fight.

And by the time we get to Empire, the "I am your father!" "Oh my gawwwwwwd Anakin didn't die!!" moment can happen.

But nooooo. All of this is ruined so they could put Vader in promotional crap for ROTS.

Palpatine would have had to make Anakin Darth Vader without letting us know his Darth name for this to work.

 

[NeoRutty]

Palpatine would have had to make Anakin Darth Vader without letting us know his Darth name for this to work.

Why would any of that have to happen on screen? The naming I mean.

Anakin can still go bad... he can still kill a bunch of people. Just don't have that ridiculous scene between the two of them.

"Rise my new apprentice!"

"Yes Master"

"Your new name is Darth Vader, because."

"I don't get to choose?"

"Noooooooooo..."

"Do I have to wear make up? Like Darth Maul?"

"No. Was that make up? or his skin?"

"I don't want to wear make up."

"You don't have to"

"But I can't name myself?"

"***** Annie. You'd think you'd be chomping at the bit for a new name."

"No it's fine, I guess"


I don't remember exactly how it went, but I know I rolled my eyes. Darth Vader...:rolleyes

 

[annanake]

Why would any of that have to happen on screen? The naming I
mean.

Anakin can still go bad... he can still kill a bunch of people. Just don't have that ridiculous scene between the two of them.

"Rise my new apprentice!"

"Yes Master"

"Your new name is Darth Vader, because."

"I don't get to choose?"

"Noooooooooo..."

"Do I have to wear make up? Like Darth Maul?"

"No. Was that make up? or his skin?"

"I don't want to wear make up."

"You don't have to"

"But I can't name myself?"

"***** Annie. You'd think you'd be chomping at the bit for a new name."

"No it's fine, I guess"


I don't remember exactly how it went, but I know I rolled my eyes. Darth Vader...:rolleyes

And now were back in the good ol can't please everyone territory.
A lot of people feel the entire reason to have the movie at all is to SEE the birth of Vader !
Myself included . now IF the movies came out in order it would be better your way but who exactly are we fooling at this point ????

 

[Cephus]

I totally disagree with this. If you have a good story to tell, and competent people to tell it, it will be told the way it was meant to be. Are you talking about filmmaking had changed in the sense of technology? Yes, I doubt we will ever have a full blown practical effects driven blockbuster ever again. But TFA came pretty damn close. Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull sucked because the story wasnt there, the dialogue, writing... The very foundations of a good movie werent there, hence a crappy movie. Mad Max says otherwise about going home.

Not really. They just don't make movies the same way today as they did when Star Wars came out. The pacing is different. The kinds of stories are different. And yes, the technology is different, which can be either good or bad depending on what you're talking about. You're right, we probably will never have a full blown practical effects movie ever again because with CGI, you don't have to actually solve problems, you can do anything, no matter how ridiculous it is. Filmmakers don't have to worry about how things work, they just throw it on screen and often, it looks horrible. Personally, I don't think the foundations of a good movie were there with any of the prequels or TFA. Or Fury Road.

 

[Cephus]

i liked seeing yoda as something other than a broken down old hermit.

nice contrast when you see him again in the other episodes.

It really made no sense for him to be like that in the prequels. He was about 900 years old. So even 30 years before his death, he was still a very, very old... um... puppet. Flipping around like a Mexican jumping bean makes no sense at all at that age. 200 years before, sure. But that's like taking a 100 year old human and saying he could be doing gymnastics at 95. I don't buy it.

 

[annanake]

It really made no sense for him to be like that in the prequels.
He was about 900 years old. So even 30 years before his death, he was still a very, very old... um... puppet. Flipping around like a Mexican jumping bean makes no sense at all at that age. 200 years before, sure. But that's like taking a 100 year old human and saying he could be doing gymnastics at 95. I don't buy it.

So he could not be using the force ?

 

[KrangPrime]

It really made no sense for him to be like that in the prequels. He was about 900 years old. So even 30 years before his death, he was still a very, very old... um... puppet. Flipping around like a Mexican jumping bean makes no sense at all at that age. 200 years before, sure. But that's like taking a 100 year old human and saying he could be doing gymnastics at 95. I don't buy it.

no faith in the force, have you...always with you it can not be done ;o{)