Could Disney finally give us the remastered, unedited Star Wars we want?

[third3ye]

Disregard theatrical distribution, this is all home video distribution rights, and it appears Fox still retains it. Disney had to buy the distribution rights from Paramount after they acquired Marvel, could just be that Fox isn't willing to sell the home video rights at a reasonable enough price. We obviously don't know the exact terms of the agreement but it's a strong enough contract that Disney and Lucasfilm haven't tried to break out of it (yet). Considering the state of affairs between Marvel and Fox, hard to say if Marvel's parent company is also caught in the middle between those 2.

What could be an interesting play for Disney here is releasing the originals via digital download or EST. Given how long ago the Fox deal was made, digital distribution is likely not covered under that deal (but just my guess). EST may not be the best revenue channel as I'm sure most if not all OT SW fans would want a hard copy, but it's a card Disney has up its sleeve if Fox won't budge.

 

[Bryancd]

Yes, like I said early, Fox could release DVD's of any of the films tomorrow if they were so inclined and have that right for the next 6 years.

 

[Solo4114]

Yes, like I said early, Fox could release DVD's of any of the films tomorrow if they were so inclined and have that right for the next 6 years.

Presumably, yeah. Although, nobody here knows the license terms (as far as I know, anyway). It could also be that Fox has the exclusive right to release anything that LucasFilm says it wants released with respect to these films. Putting out a blu-ray release? It goes through Fox. Changing your packaging? Through Fox. Releasing a megaset with all the films? Yup. Through Fox (or at least where they're in the supply chain).

What I'm curious about is whether it's true in this case that Fox itself cannot release anything that Disney/LucasFilm doesn't tell them to release. How much latitude does Fox actually have? How much can they do without Disney's approval or coordination, with the original three films?

In other words, could Fox decide "We're gonna remaster these and release them as the theatrical versions"? Could Fox decide "We're gonna put out the SEs on blu-ray, but with a blu-ray copy of the LD rips"? Or is it more along the lines of "These are the films we have to work with. We're going to release the 6-disc set, two 3-disc sets, but we're NOT releasing single discs until two years from now" and that's the extent of their authority? I don't know, and since I don't work in the industry, I don't know what industry custom is.

 

[JD]

Is the last Blu Ray release still in print? Or is it just a matter of what's out there being available and once it's depleted it's gone?

 

[Bryancd]

Is the last Blu Ray release still in print? Or is it just a matter of what's out there being available and once it's depleted it's gone?

It's available on Amazon.

 

[matty matt]

Fox is the distributor. They distribute the releases for Lucasfilm. That's all they do. Now I'm sure Disney would love to have Buena Vista do it, but that's not going to happen until they get the rights to all the movies, including ANH. What good would it do to release a boxed set of just Episodes 5 and 6?

 

[JD]

It's available on Amazon.

I see it at Target and the usual stores all the time... I'm just wondering if that it's just existing stock and when it's gone, it's gone or if it's something they're actively keeping in press.

 

[cboath]

If an unaltered OT only happens when Disney owns the rights, I imagine then, that it'll never ever happen. The reason? Once Disney owns it, I seriously doubt they'll open their unaltered OT with the Fox logo and fanfare...

In order for all to get what they want, a joint venture is ultimately required.

Fox doesn't own the film, literally and figuratively. LFL does. They can't restore it because they don't own it. Simple as that.

Also, i'm pretty sure they can't just up and release things simply because they want to. They have to have authorization from LFL. Now, they can continually pump out the versions they're currently authorize to print/sell, like the current BR. I don't imagine they made a finite number and when they're gone their gone, that's Disney marketing bs

Personally, I think people overestimate how strongly an unaltered OT would sell. Sure, we'd all buy it, but the public at large? i'm not terribly sure about that.

 

[niennumb1]

The only alterations I would consider REALLY good ideas are fixing what was actually the technical flaws of the films.

Examples:
- Removing apparent matte boxes from around ships, but leaving shots otherwise intact
- Improved Blue Screen compositing in places, but using the original sources
- Remastered THX soundtrack for surround sound welcome. I don't think backtracking to a something utilizing pre-5.1 would help with the experience in a home theater.

I wouldn't consider those "screwing over the originals" in my book. Shots still stay the way they are in edits and runtime the same. No brand new CG effects, just fixing what were technical imperfections in the visuals of the originals.

 

[Riceball]

The only alterations I would consider REALLY good ideas are fixing what was actually the technical flaws of the films.

Examples:
- Removing apparent matte boxes from around ships, but leaving shots otherwise intact
- Improved Blue Screen compositing in places, but using the original sources
- Remastered THX soundtrack for surround sound welcome. I don't think backtracking to a something utilizing pre-5.1 would help with the experience in a home theater.

I wouldn't consider those "screwing over the originals" in my book. Shots still stay the way they are in edits and runtime the same. No brand new CG effects, just fixing what were technical imperfections in the visuals of the originals.

I agree with that and that's what I'd want to see in a new, un-adultered OT release; just fix the technical errors without adding or removing footage.

 

[glunark]

I might be in a minority here, but if you change anything, even in the slightest, then its not the original.

It looked good at the time, it dosnt matter if it no longer looks good to today's audience,

Yeah, I will miss the Fox logo too, but I already saw a cartoon clone wars movie at the cinema that didn't have one, and the next one will probably start with the disney castle and bad robot.

The film itself starts with John Williams and the scrolling text, after that I dont care if there are matt boxes, sabres that look crap, and the skys of Yavin arent swarming with x wings.

I just want the star wars I saw in 1977.

 

[niennumb1]

I just want the star wars I saw in 1977.

I would recommend one of these:

 

[rodneyfaile]

Wonder what will be released first, the unaltered OT on blu ray, or Mr. Fusion.

 

[Bryancd]

I might be in a minority here, but if you change anything, even in the slightest, then its not the original.

It looked good at the time, it dosnt matter if it no longer looks good to today's audience,

Yeah, I will miss the Fox logo too, but I already saw a cartoon clone wars movie at the cinema that didn't have one, and the next one will probably start with the disney castle and bad robot.

The film itself starts with John Williams and the scrolling text, after that I dont care if there are matt boxes, sabres that look crap, and the skys of Yavin arent swarming with x wings.

I just want the star wars I saw in 1977.

Like I said, based on this sentiment and others expressed in these pages trying to release a version of ANH that will satisfy everyone is a fools errand.

 

[cayman shen]

I was quite happy with the OT that was the condescending bonus disc in the DVD release. I just want it in high def. It's the only version I'll watch anymore, and I'd like it to look its best. The films are part of out heritage. The deserve at least the respect given to Hot Tub Time Machine.

 

[third3ye]

My vote is for a high def version of the theatrical with some clean-up but leave the original as intact as possible. Yeah I'd miss the improved VFX from the SEs but honestly, I go in knowing it's a movie from the 70s, so yeah I do expect the FX to look dated. I'm basically thinking of what Disney has done with their older animated features for their Diamond Edition blu-rays - cleaned up for 1080p, improve the colors, throw in a couple special features, and done. It's never going to look as crisp as more recent movies but looks a hell of a lot better than a DVD.

 

[batguy]

Like I said, based on this sentiment and others expressed in these pages trying to release a version of ANH that will satisfy everyone is a fools errand.

It's a fool's errand to try to please everyone on a website like this, yes. But there are a few other people besides us who might like a decent Blu-Ray cut of the OT in the future.




The average buyer for a new OT release doesn't even know what "Industrial Light & Magic" is. They don't give a crap about the original 40yo effects work, they just want a reasonably watchable movie to modern eyes. Getting rid of the creative changes would be a bonus. (Hell, the CGI shots of Greedo shooting first and the inserted Jabba look almost as fake to a modern viewer as the early ILM work that the SE was intended to fix.)

If it continues to be a choice between the SE and the originals, more than a few people will elect to keep watching the SE version - NOT BECUASE THEY LIKE THE CREATIVE CHANGES - but because the 30-second annoyance of the Greedo & Jabba scenes do much less damage to their suspension-of-disbelief than the alternative: A steady stream of rickety SFX running throughout the length of movie and the entire Battle of Yavin look like cheap amateur model ships.

This mindset is a foreign concept in a prop forum. But I'll bet this describes at least 97% of the buying public.

 

[cayman shen]

My vote is for a high def version of the theatrical with some clean-up but leave the original as intact as possible. Yeah I'd miss the improved VFX from the SEs but honestly, I go in knowing it's a movie from the 70s, so yeah I do expect the FX to look dated. I'm basically thinking of what Disney has done with their older animated features for their Diamond Edition blu-rays - cleaned up for 1080p, improve the colors, throw in a couple special features, and done. It's never going to look as crisp as more recent movies but looks a hell of a lot better than a DVD.

Hey, if you want the improved FX, you'll still have the SE. I don't think most people want the SE erased or suppressed...they just want the originals as well!

 

[niennumb1]

Is there anyone here who has an HD projector home theater who has watched the Blu-Ray releases on it? I noticed "A New Hope" is quite a bit more botched looking in the imagery than the other two films in the OT. Some pretty bad artifacting and due to some of the further post work done it looks as though things like skies, edging around characters against the brighter backgrounds and other bits really stand out as muddied up and ugly.

I have played a bunch of other films and I know it's not my projector. There are some pretty messy spots and wonder if that's from that "cleanup" work that was done with the film print.

 

[Solo4114]

Like I said, based on this sentiment and others expressed in these pages trying to release a version of ANH that will satisfy everyone is a fools errand.

I agree that it'd be a fool's errand to try to satisfy everyone. However, I don't think it's necessarily a fool's errand to try to produce some sort of "archival" version of the non-special edition films. We could debate which sound mix best represents the film, whether to include matte boxes or not, etc., but on the whole, I think a 4K scan of the film negatives used to produce the 2004 SEs, but without the edits done by LucasFilm, would be satisfactory enough to anyone who wants an OOT.

There's still the argument that it's not economically beneficial to Disney...yet...but the direction of the home media market may have an impact on that in the years to come. As has been discussed before, the SEs are at the top of their resolution. The new stuff was all done natively in 1080p. The old stuff was scanned in at 1080p. If home media moves in a direction that increases resolution yet again -- whether through streaming or disc-based media -- they're gonna have to rescan the originals again, even if they want to put out SEs. There's no way to squeeze more resolution out of the SEs. (which is also true for the PT, but they can't "rescan" anything there)

So, in addition to the "Who blinks first" negotiations with Fox, there's the potential dwindling life cycle for the SEs in a general sense.

Is there anyone here who has an HD projector home theater who has watched the Blu-Ray releases on it? I noticed "A New Hope" is quite a bit more botched looking in the imagery than the other two films in the OT. Some pretty bad artifacting and due to some of the further post work done it looks as though things like skies, edging around characters against the brighter backgrounds and other bits really stand out as muddied up and ugly.

I have played a bunch of other films and I know it's not my projector. There are some pretty messy spots and wonder if that's from that "cleanup" work that was done with the film print.

If you mean the stuff done by Lowry Digital, I'd be surprised if it's their fault. They've done some AMAZING work in recent years, what with the Bond restorations, and the North by Northwest restoration. They aren't a hack outfit. I'd be far more inclined to believe it's LucasFilm doing stuff on the cheap or simply doing a crappy job. Remember, these are the peopel who flipped rear audio channels and said it was "Working as intended" then flipped them back in the next release. This is also the same group who "color corrected" in such a way that you can actually pause, go frame-by-frame, and see the exact frame when the color palette abruptly switches back to the original look.

Frankly, setting aside questions of whether one prefers the SEs or the OOT, I think the technical job done on the DVDs and, I gather, the blu-rays was pretty poor.