Can I recast an AA Helmet ?

[Darth Domain]

I don't think to whole issues of recasting is touched upon in RPF rules, there are no rules just more like guidlines really (bit like the pirates code). Rules can be bent, misenterpreted made to mean what people want them to mean. AA copied GL work, now makes profit. gets shouted at. RPF members and others buy DP copies which are re-cast and all know this. Rubies takes Mask which seems also to be a copy of DP from way back, however, Rubies has been given a liscense to copy a previous liscensed mask which they now make money on
This is all crystal clear and of course no one on RPF or any other board or E-Bay are supporting this in any way

 

[Too Much Garlic]

Originally posted by Darth Domain+Mar 28 2006, 03:35 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Darth Domain @ Mar 28 2006, 03:35 PM)</div>

I don't think to whole issues of recasting is touched upon in RPF rules, there are no rules just more like guidlines really (bit like the pirates code). Rules can be bent, misenterpreted made to mean what people want them to mean. AA copied GL work, now makes profit. gets shouted at.

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Actually, you don't seem to get it. AA didn't copy GLs work, since AA was the one making the original armor. Whether he has the original molds still, or made new ones does NOT make it recasting, nor copying GLs work, since GL didn't make the sculpts, nor make the molds, nor make the casts. GL just holds the copyright over those items.

Originally posted by Darth Domain@Mar 28 2006, 03:35 PM
RPF members and others buy DP copies which  are re-cast and all know this.

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Yes... and you have to decide with yourself, whether you want to support that trend or go against it by refusing to buy it.

Originally posted by Darth Domain@Mar 28 2006, 03:35 PM
Rubies takes Mask which seems also to be a copy of DP from way back, however, Rubies has been given a liscense to copy a previous liscensed mask which they now make money on

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Rubies took over the licence and the molds from DP, meaning that they have the right to make casts from those molds and sell them. NOT recasting.

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This is all crystal clear and of course no one on RPF or any other board or E-Bay are supporting this in any way

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Apparently not clear enough.

 

[Darth Domain]

No not clear, but hey what the hell, i'm jumping out of this thread now, the more you go into it the more complex it gets. So, is anyone gonna copy AA stuff or what?
just thought i would finish with this (RPF codes of conduct)
Deliberately recasting another memberÂ’s creation without permission is something this community does not support. A member found selling/trading items recast from another member without permission will face possible disciplinary action.

So this has cleared up the original question, you can copy AA stuff as he is not a member here
I assume, Rubies and DP- not a problem

However, do not take another members work and Recast it, Now this is clear and i agree fully :thumbsup

 

[Too Much Garlic]

Originally posted by Darth Domain@Mar 28 2006, 03:46 PM
So, is anyone gonna copy AA stuff or what?

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I sure hope not.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

Originally posted by Darth Domain@Mar 28 2006, 03:46 PM
just thought i would finish with this (RPF codes of conduct)
Deliberately recasting another memberÂ’s creation without permission is something this community does not support. A member found selling/trading items recast from another member without permission will face possible disciplinary action.

So this has cleared up the original question, you can copy AA stuff as he is not a member here
I assume, Rubies and DP- not a problem

However, do not take another members work and Recast it, Now this is clear and i agree fully :thumbsup

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To me that "code of conduct" is flawed, but hey... those are the rules of the forum and I can't argue with that... only try to influence them.

I still don't think it is okay to recast items from companies, members and even non-members. This is however only my own opinion and in no way represent the forum.

The more I learn about props, the more I learn to admire those who use time, effort and money to provide the rest of us with props... and the more I get to dislike recasters (again: not talking about casts made available by recasting an original item that isn't out on the market).

Would still prefer to buy from official companies, but when they don't offer good quality or un-altered items, then you have to turn to fans who are willing to spend the time, effort and money to provide what the companies won't.

 

[Darth Domain]

You know, at tghe end of the day, its more fun to try and make your own stuff. I'm trying to make a kenner conversion kit from scratch. Perhaps that will be recast in future (if it is good enough)
C'est la Vie, oui Mon amis

 

[Jedirick]

Originally posted by Jet Beetle@Mar 27 2006, 10:51 PM
Interested depending on price.

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:lol

 

[rad1701]

I'm curious why after 4 pages on this topic there isn't an "official" response from the mods? Do they have an "official" stance on this? I was always under the impression that this violated the rules here. Is recasting another's work ok if they don't hold an official license? So, if I buy say a nice sculpture off one of the talented members here and they don't have a license and I cast it to make copies that's ok? Of course I wouldn't because I respect other's work but I think that's the point of this thread. I think an official response on this is due.

 

[teecrooz]

What I've gotten out of this thread is that maybe the code of conduct is not sufficient as written.

I guess if the coc was longer and broader then all would be satisfied. Is that what you guys are getting at? :lol

 

[spcglider@aol.com]

Can I recast an AA helmet?

Yes... you can. If you are ready to deal with whatever crap storm it generates when you offer it here. Or elewhere.

Its all a matter of your personal ethics.

You ready to get a C&D? You ready to make enemies? You prepared to deal with all that goes with the interminable recasting argument that plagues every prop community no matter who it contains?

From my personal point of view, its JUST NOT GOOD to recast anybody's work. Even if you change it. And even if the originator lied about the nature of the prop to begin with, it is generally accepted social wisdom that two wrongs don't make a right.

And remember: recasting is generally frowned upon by the RPF.

But I'm not you, so like every decision in life, it must be up to your personal mind.

-Gordon

 

[Jeeves]

OK, I hate this stuff, but WTH, I'll chime in with how I see it.


1) we all want cool props (pay attention to this one, it comes up again)

2) most of these props are not licensed, and copying them would infringe upon the rights of the original artists, or the owners of the intellectual property.

3) because we want cool props, and the owners of the property don't give them to us, we make a conscious decision to overlook those rights - which are, by the way, arguably the only legally valid ones in this whole mess.

4) We have this arcane 'no recasting rule' - why is it there? Because we want cool props, and we don't want to discourage prop makers / purchasers of original props / recasters for producing the items we want. They expend money as an investment, and they deserve a return. If we discourage them by buying from folks that profit off of their hard work, we get no new props.

5) If the no recasting rule has been created to encourage prop makers to make cool stuff for us, what happens to the rule when they stop making said items? It can be argued at the point a prop run ends, that it's OK for anyone to recast their work - as the reason for the 'no recasting' rule has gone away. At that point, we are back to the exact same situation we see in #3, above.

6) This is an informal code of conduct that we have put into place because we want cool props. It's up to the BUYER to have the integrity to decide whether or not they will support people who skirt these guidelines and make props at the expense of the hard work of others. Police yourselves, people, and have some self control. If you are unsure of the validity of an item, ASK someone here.

Is AA still making helmets? Well, I wouldn't buy from anyone that recast his at this time, regardless of the alleged source of his helmets.

To be honest with all you suckas, I have an AA helmet - but it is one of the first 20 available to the public. At that time, none of this information was available - and my decision to purchase might have been different if I'd know more. B)

-Raj

 

[kurtyboy]

Don't the RPF rules allow recasting and selling of items when the original maker is not a member? Or some other nonsense like that.

 

[Darth Domain]

Originally posted by kurtyboy@Mar 28 2006, 05:14 PM
Don't the RPF rules allow recasting and selling of items when the original maker is not a member? Or some other nonsense like that.

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Well in my post above it shows the rule, you can't recast a members work without their permission.
So as i said earlier, we can recast AA, Don post and Rubies as they are not members
Oh for gods sake most people would not have vader masks or armor etc etc etc if it was not for someone making copies

 

[kurtyboy]

Exactly. So we can recast AA's work.

But then if AA joined the RPF would the people that recast his work before he joined be labelled as recasters? Or only if they recast his work after he joined? :confused

 

[KevVader]

...as evidenced by 4 pages in one morning on the subject, there seems to be holes in the "recasting" logic that are big enough to drive a truck through....

However, I think Flynn had stated most people's attitudes towards it the best.....

IMO it all boils down to getting the swag, simple supply and demand, if the supply has run it's course or a "good enough" current replica doesn't exist the memberships turns a blind eye to the recasting to easily obtain the "quality" items...

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Whether it be towards a studio or individual artist...if people think the item is cool enough to get, they will take the above attitude....

 

[Flagg]

Originally posted by Darth Domain+Mar 28 2006, 12:28 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Darth Domain @ Mar 28 2006, 12:28 PM)</div>

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@Mar 28 2006, 05:14 PM
Don't the RPF rules allow recasting and selling of items when the original maker is not a member? Or some other nonsense like that.

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Well in my post above it shows the rule, you can't recast a members work without their permission.
So as i said earlier, we can recast AA, Don post and Rubies as they are not members
Oh for gods sake most people would not have vader masks or armor etc etc etc if it was not for someone making copies

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So if you live by that rule then it would be ok for you to copy an AA helmet since he isnt a member, but if I purchased one of those copied helmets from you who is a member and then made a copy of the copy myself I'd then be recasting?

 

[Too Much Garlic]

That's just lame. I know it is the RPF rules on the subject, but to me that is just plain nonsense.

Use your common sense people. Recasting is stealing, plain and simple... no matter whether the one being recast is a company or private individual (member and non-member alike.)

 

[ShocKWavE]

Rules (or lack of) in one message forum does not justify duplication of an artists work, regardless of the medium. AA has no say in the forum rules, but also has no requirement to personally follow them by joining.

If I make a message forum and make a rule that I can copy whatever I like, it does not make it so. If one cannot understand that within their own conscious, they will likely never understand the concept.

That said, we all "recast" to a degree whenever borrowing from a pre-existing idea.

 

[Lynn TXP 0369]

Originally posted by spcglider@aol.com@Mar 28 2006, 11:35 AM
Can I recast an AA helmet?

Yes... you can.  If you are ready to deal with whatever crap storm it generates when you offer it here. Or elewhere.

-Gordon

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You can and people here and other forums will gobble them up as fast as they did with the DP Vader and Fett helmets that have been done here in the past with no qualms of recasting, it isn't any different.

No crap storm, just people eger to spend the $$$ on a item they want and get it cheaper then the AA which was overly priced to begin with.

Lynn

 

[spcglider@aol.com]

Originally posted by NoHumorMan@Mar 28 2006, 06:11 PM
That's just lame.  I know it is the RPF rules on the subject, but to me that is just plain nonsense.

Use your common sense people.  Recasting is stealing, plain and simple... no matter whether the one being recast is a company or private individual (member and non-member alike.)

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True, but that's the problem with the whole hobby isn't it? If you purchase a piece and it's not a replica from a licensed manufacturer, you're breaking the law.

Like I said, its all about how you feel on the subject. Don't think you're gonna get called on it? Then go ahead. Recast all you like. But don't be surprised when you find yourself embroiled in a long drawn out flame war and character impugning fan dispute. Or even the reciept of a Cease And Desist order from a studio or licensor's lawyer.

But don't forget karma, if you believe in that.

Those are the potential hazzards. If you feel ballsy enough to survive them, recast away. Many have. Many more will.

NOTE: The opinions expressed here do not necessarily reflect the attitudes and opinions of the RPF Community, the RPF board, it's Code of Conduct or it's moderators.

-Gordon