ANOVOS issues (ANOVOS ONLY discussion)

... the fact that Anovos is only receiving small portions at a time automatically tells us, they don’t have the funds to order the complete demand from preorders.
IF that is true, the question is why. We know they've had to switch manufacturers at least once on some items. Could be that they lost a great deal of money with one (or more) manufacturers for several products, which they can't get back, and have since that time been trying desperately to get caught up and make back the difference, afraid (or unable) to be upfront with the community about what's going on. Pure speculation of course, but I very much doubt they have deliberate, ill intentions.

Over the weekend I received notice that the rather costly payment-plan item I had going is now paid-in-full. It'll be the last thing I buy until at least a couple of the things I have on pre-order actually start getting delivered.
 
Ive always been suspicious about the whole “change in manufacturer” excuse.

The fact that they spent the money on the prototype and was able to showcase them at cons, means they thought they were pretty much good to go. If not, then why advertise.

No manufacturer would take the time to cad, tool, and build a finished product without understanding the means to mass produce. Time, labor, raw materials, machinery usage, extended burden, and dunnage.

More like, Anovos didn’t do a request for quote. Once the prototype was built, it’ll cost this amount of money to create a run of whatever. The amount of money Anovos doesn’t have.

So....their stalling or they don’t know what they’re doing or both.

Rule number 1 in preorders (and this goes for Both anovos and EFX)

Never EVER attempt preorders until the final article has been approved and manufacturing is ready to produce.

Just my humble opinion.
 
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As for consumers...

Never purchase or preorder an item that’s labeled “prototype”

That’s the disclaimer that the “final product” isn’t approved to begin the run.
 
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Ive always been suspicious about the whole “change in manufacturer” excuse.

The fact that they spent the money on the prototype and was able to showcase them at cons, means they thought they were pretty much good to go. If not, then why advertise.

No manufacturer would take the time to cad, tool, and build a finished product without understanding the means to mass produce. Time, labor, raw materials, machinery usage, extended burden, and dunnage.

More like, Anovos didn’t do a request for quote. Once the prototype was built, it’ll cost this amount of money to create a run of whatever. The amount of money Anovos doesn’t have.

So....their stalling.


Just my humble opinion.

That could very well be the case, but if so, where did all the money collected from pre-orders go?

From what I've heard, the change in manufacturer was for soft goods, not hardware. I would guess that the prototypes they show off at cons are made domestically. Among other things, there were problems with the Solo TFA leather jacket and also the Star Lord jacket. With the latter, the prototype was made with pleather, but they have allegedly (=not officially confirmed, but implied as much at cons and in messages) switched to real leather when they changed manufacturer.

You can get completely screwed by factories in low-cost countries because there is very little recourse or liability. The last time I had a couple suits made in Thailand, they had to redo the jackets and vests from scratch several times because they didn't follow my very clear instructions. I asked them to exactly duplicate a vintage 1930s suit, but they basically completely ignored everything I specified and made one using a rejected 1980s pattern. It was beyond horrible... and they made some unbelievable patterning mistakes! This was a well-known (though low budget) tailoring house , and they DID eventually deliver (several months late) a couple very nice suits, most likely because they did have a sense of pride, had a name to protect and I mentioned wanting to show off the finished goods on a well-known niche fashion website (fedoralounge). But they could just as easily have stopped answering my messages and I would have been left without anything.

When the Dredd costume group on Facebook came together for making leather suits and armor, it probably took an entire year of back-and-forth before the suits were even close to acceptable. And even when the shop finally started making them, there were serious problems with the finished items. (For example, I got an armor vest where all the plates were upside-down!)

Remember when HCG finally shipped the oft-delayed Aliens Pulse Rifles and most of the stock had drooping barrels? They probably lost quite a bit on those, and might've gone under if they didn't already have a buffer to cover it and if fans hadn't found workarounds to fix it.

If they can get away with it, many low-cost factories will not prioritize quality. I'm guessing Anovos put in a large order based on initial good impressions, then had to pull out when the results turned out to be disastrous, and lost the investment. Pursuing a case against a small outfit in a place like China or Pakistan when you're a 'small' company in the US or Europe is probably a lost cause. A couple setbacks like that, perhaps due to inexperience, and you'll be struggling to deliver.

Whatever the case, I have a hard time believing they went into it with the intent of just making a quick buck or screwing over the fans. These guys were already well-known in prop circles and initially it went pretty well. As has been suggested by others, they probably took on too much at one point, had one (or several) major setbacks and are simply struggling to recover.

I'm still hoping they'll get there eventually. Am I mad about the delays and lack of open communication? Hell, yes. I make that known to them, politely, semi-regularly. And I don't really cancel, because I've waited this long... I might as well wait a little longer, even if I'm taking a chance on losing quite a lot of money. But simply raging against them is not going to get the items delivered faster and may in fact do the opposite.

For those of you going to Star Wars Celebration and the various cons in the US... it would be very a very generous and helpful thing for the community if you stopped by the Anovos booth and spoke to them (politely) in person about all this and reported back to us here what they said. (I'd certainly do it if I had the opportunity, but they don't ever come over to this side of the pond.)
 
To be fair though, it is rather difficult to get an honest manufacturer in China who can produce to specs you have provided. Some of these manufacturers are basically above the law and can get away with ripping you off in China, so you have to be extra cautious with them. So Anovos coming across a manufacturer that was dodgy is not a scenario we just pass off as unlikely.

Prototypes are likely made by anovos themselves, and are then provided to the manufacturers to recreate.

Other companies do the same, as in they usually make their own prototypes for pics/display purposes.

No manufacturer would take the time to cad, tool, and build a finished product without understanding the means to mass produce. Time, labor, raw materials, machinery usage, extended burden, and dunnage.

But is the manufacturer actually taking time to tool the products? Or are they putting little effort. I mean, I have seem some people who order a high-quality tool for injection molding, and receive a rough, underscale etc. of an excuse of "this is what you bought"
 
No doubt the owners of the companies have strong relationship bond’s throughout the prop community. As a matter of fact I encourage it. It makes for a better product. Knowing the fine detail. If Gino is the head of RND due to his contacts and keen eye, then by all means.

That being said, when you start a business that envolves your hobby, at some point you will have to separate yourself into business management.

As for the soft goods prototype, they did receive the sample. Correct? The images on their website suggests so. They did advertise and enable it to be preordered, correct?


As for manufacturers in other countries....they want to associate themselves with large companies with volumes like Walmart of say 150,000 units of their name brand camping tent or baby cribs. That’s why they love Nike, Hasbro, etc. Volume is where the money is at. Not start and stops for runs of 500 units. There’s a small profit margin. You basically get what you pay for. If you want to cut cost, then yes go to another manufacturer that will say they can do it for less. If you want a premium build, pay the price. Especially if that’s what you claim to deliver to your customers.
 
Gerard.

Absolutely they had to tool the product. That’s how they send the prototype. That’s what gets approved or not. It’s given the buyer (company) to say go or no go. That tool would be the basis for the production run. They would still charge you for it.

As the buyer, you paid for a product that has been spec’d out. If they get it wrong, they redline it and build another on in their dime. If you sent incorrect drawings, then it’s your dime. No company ever pays for the mistakes the vender causes
 
Just to avoid confusion

The prototype is a base/idea. There can be 10 or 1000 prototypes. Whichever one is decided it will be approved and goes to the manufacture

The manufacturer then make articles. Also there can be many articles. More of practice runs. Whatever article is approved by the customer (Anovos). And used as the basis of production.
 
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IF that is true, the question is why. We know they've had to switch manufacturers at least once on some items. Could be that they lost a great deal of money with one (or more) manufacturers for several products, which they can't get back, and have since that time been trying desperately to get caught up and make back the difference, afraid (or unable) to be upfront with the community about what's going on. Pure speculation of course, but I very much doubt they have deliberate, ill intentions.

Over the weekend I received notice that the rather costly payment-plan item I had going is now paid-in-full. It'll be the last thing I buy until at least a couple of the things I have on pre-order actually start getting delivered.

I'm not so willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. Until any tangible evidence shows me where my money has gone, and why it went there, my opinion is that something dodgy is going on there.

I have no firm evidence to back that up, just my opinion
 
In the Knights of Ren Costuming Group on Facebook, someone got an Anovos Kylo cape prototype, saying he got it from an employee since they get paid in props according to the comments. :/
 
No doubt the owners of the companies have strong relationship bond’s throughout the prop community. As a matter of fact I encourage it. It makes for a better product. Knowing the fine detail. If Gino is the head of RND due to his contacts and keen eye, then by all means.

That being said, when you start a business that envolves your hobby, at some point you will have to separate yourself into business management.

As for the soft goods prototype, they did receive the sample. Correct? The images on their website suggests so. They did advertise and enable it to be preordered, correct?


As for manufacturers in other countries....they want to associate themselves with large companies with volumes like Walmart of say 150,000 units of their name brand camping tent or baby cribs. That’s why they love Nike, Hasbro, etc. Volume is where the money is at. Not start and stops for runs of 500 units. There’s a small profit margin. You basically get what you pay for. If you want to cut cost, then yes go to another manufacturer that will say they can do it for less. If you want a premium build, pay the price. Especially if that’s what you claim to deliver to your customers.

I agree with this. I'd say pay up for a quality manufacturer and raise the prices or whatever you need to do.
 
Just got an email from Anovos providing a 40% discount to all in-stock items using the promo code MARDIGRAS40.

So that is 40% off only around 5 items....lol.
 
Among other things, there were problems with the Solo TFA leather jacket and also the Star Lord jacket. With the latter, the prototype was made with pleather, but they have allegedly (=not officially confirmed, but implied as much at cons and in messages) switched to real leather when they changed manufacturer.

- What problems did they have with the Force Awakens jacket? This is the item I'm waiting on...
BTW - is it me or is the image on the product page different from the one they had a couple years ago (back when I placed the order)? I could be remembering incorrectly but it doesn't look as "good" as the one I recall.

- Did they ever make the Star-Lord jacket? I've never heard of anyone getting one and I though it was canceled altogether.

Last thing...
I wonder if they had to change manufacturers due to the black market items that are leaking out the back doors of the factories? I've run accross a couple of items now from dodgy Facebook ads to posts in this forum that are for Anovos product for sale that was bought directly from the factory at significant discount. If that's going on (who knows why - maybe Anovos is unable to pay these factories so their recouping how they can) I can understand Anovos wanting to take the business elsewhere. Again - All speculation on my part.

Cheers
Steve
 
Wow 40% off sounds like a company who REALLY needs some cash flow....
They've done that a few times over the years. Looks like they want to move a lot of odd stock that isn't going anywhere- odd sizes of the Abrams Trek movies and so on. I'm still kicking myself for not getting a Galactica Uniform when they had a massive sale on those a couple years ago. (From the looks of it, the classic and TNG Trek stuff is still the bread to their butter. Not surprising since the quality on that has been mostly top-notch.)


- What problems did they have with the Force Awakens jacket?...

- Did they ever make the Star-Lord jacket? I've never heard of anyone getting one and I though it was canceled altogether....

Last thing...
I wonder if they had to change manufacturers due to the black market items that are leaking out the back doors of the factories?...

I'm not positive, but I think it was something to do with the leather. Maybe the place they were using were not used to working with it, or maybe there were problems with sourcing quality hide that was legal/certified or something. As far as I can remember, the photos are the same. I think that they might've had a photo of the actual screen jacket the first time they announced it, though.

The Star Lord jacket is still being made and has not been canceled. There have been a lot of rumors surrounding it, but the current official-unofficial info (relayed directly by personnel at cons and hinted at in messages) is that they are making the leather parts out of real leather, after changing manufacturers. Currently due for Spring 2019, but who knows. I really hope it happens. (I would make it myself like I did with the original jacket, but doing all the rubberized screen printing for just one copy would cost a small fortune and I don't have the time.)
 
I would hope so as those are the relatively easy ones to do


(From the looks of it, the classic and TNG Trek stuff is still the bread to their butter. Not surprising since the quality on that has been mostly top-notch.)
 
I would hope so as those are the relatively easy ones to do
Not that easy, or someone would've done it properly a lot sooner. How many really nice TWOK-era uniforms have we seen? Very few fan-made that look right overall, and none available commercially. Same with the TNG uniforms. And the patterns and fabrics of the TOS unis are pretty hard to replicate as well, even if those have come the closest to be copied before Anovos (and the velour versions have even been bested by fans if I'm not mistaken). It's one area where they have truly excelled; most of their premiereTrek efforts have come close to tailor-quality garments, going far beyond mere 'costumes'. I've made business suits, jackets and other things... and was especially impressed by the TWK jacket and the TNG tunic. The one true 'dud' I've seen when it comes to Trek was the first Picard 'Darmok' jacket, which was completely wonky. They messed that one up completely, as if they had used an extra-short pattern for them (like, two sizes too wide for the length of the sleeves). I'm hoping they will have fixed that with the new one in all-suede, as they have promised that they used a completely new and different pattern.
 
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