anakin rots/luke anh lightsabers, why arent they identical??

[cboath]

Well, to get nit-pickey, seeing as they demoted pluto, earth actually is the 5th planet - providing you count from the outside in

(and if you skip another one in the process, let's just say neptune, i mean, short of having a ring or two, what good is it? This is what happens when you try and do math at the crack of dawn )

 

[cayman shen]

Yuk yuk yuk. You know what I mean though. An audience can suspend disbelief regarding fantastical elements in order to believe in the story. But we can't ignore continuity. So we'll accept that there's such a thing as a Wookiee, and we'll accept he's 200 years old. But we won't accept it if LATER he's described as being only 85. The film violated it's own rules. As long as we're given the rules, we'll accept them. But mess up, and we'll pick you apart until you cry!

I personally would have liked to see something closer to the real Graflex, but I can see whey they didn't. It looks flimsy, is kinda chunky...no real harm done. I was more off-put by Kenobi's ROTS saber, personally, though it's grown on me over the years.

 

[Djinn]

I have always assumed they churned out another slightly different saber mostly for the merchandising alone.

If it was exactly like the graflex in ep4 no many people would have bothered to get another since majority of the saber collectors already have one. But if they change things around some, then the saber freaks would have to go out and get it just to complete their collestions.

Pretty much the same reason they produced an ep3 Vader saber that never saw two seconds of screentime.

 

[Beggarsoutpost]

If you spend any time with the ANH and ESB Graflex you'll see the elements of both sabers that the prop master used to create the ROTS saber... They're both in there... The reason for the changes is the same for both Anakin's and Obiwan's... Lucas Film Licensing.. neither the Graflex or the various parts of the Obi saber can be licensed and controled by LFL... They can't stop anybody from making and selling as many of those sabers as people will buy... But by changing the design to an interpretation of the original it gives them total control of the end image, prop, toy, etc.... They could not have made an exact copy of the Graflex for the same reasons we can't make an exact copy of theirs...

 

[Scott D]

Are the OT Luke Graflex sabers and the Anakin ROTS saber the same size? (diameter/length)

I still remember the MR Anakin AOTC saber and how small it was.

 

[lonepigeon]

Anakin ROTS is a smaller diameter which was another main reason to change it. It's too awkward to fight with a 1.5"+ diameter saber.
Licensing had nothing to do with it. Merchandising had nothing to do with it.
Copying a Graflex wasn't an issue either.

 

[Darth Lars]

It's too awkward to fight with a 1.5"+ diameter saber.

I can agree with that, but even still, there were special "stunt" version of the Anakin ROTS saber used in the production with an even smaller diameter just for the grip area.

 

[SonofSkywalker]

maybe it's as simple as the person who created the ROTS saber used the wrong OT saber for reference. How many times have we seen pictures of Star Wars Displays with parts put on wrong. Maybe some people who work for LFL and ILM aren't big Star Wars Geeks as members Here and it didn't matter to them.
Hard to imagine working there and not being a fan, but...
Maybe Lucas himself doesn't know the difference.
You never know.

 

[Beggarsoutpost]

First of all it's ridiculous to think that the prop master who designed the Hero version of the saber gave any thought to making it smaller for fighting since as was pointed out above Hayden used an entirely different stunt saber that had a large dip cut in to the main body and had a fake flat control box and band.... The reason for creating an original design has everything to do with licencing and control and nothing to do with making it smaller for fighting..... And as I said before if you have spent any real time with either of the first 2 you would see how the ROTS model is a combined version of both of them... The reasoning for this is that it's supposed to be the same saber form Sith to Empire....

 

[lonepigeon]

First of all it's ridiculous to think that the prop master who designed the Hero version of the saber gave any thought to making it smaller for fighting...

Yes, ridiculous - it's not like that's his job or anything. :rolleyes

The main basis for the ROTS stunt is the Luke ESB saber that Lucasfilm still has. There was video at the time of the Luke ESB saber and the Vader Barbican saber in the Ep3 prop department. The prop department examined the original sabers and copied them taking into account real issues like handling. Yes, the stunt has a groove in it, but it looks like it's more to keep the upper hand from slipping (it's not a whole hand width or anything). The lower is still the same which is the main grip.

LFL already licenses the Graflex design saber. Anything they did for ROTS would have been a new copyright anyway since there's no way they could have copied a Graflex exactly - just wasn't possible.

It's already been mentioned in this thread, but most of the OT lightsabers don't match each other even within the same movie -look at the Luke ROTJ.

 

[Beggarsoutpost]

The dip on the main body of the saber is at lest 2 inches and the band the box and the grips are all fake they are flat... The saber he is fighting with is completely different from the "Hero" version that hangs on his belt.... There was no consideration given to the design of the hero version of that lightsaber that had anything to do with how it would handle in a real dual....:wacko

The grips and the flat button on the bottom of the saber are clearly influences of the ANH saber... and the band with ridges and the circuit board are clearly taken from the ESB design....

 

[lonepigeon]

So why do you think NONE of the other PT sabers are anywhere near the diameter of the OT flashgun sabers?
They're an uncomfortable size plain and simple.
If you think it's a Licensing conspiracy then why did they change the Barbican Vader saber? That one's practically scratchbuilt except for the MPP midband. No reason to change it at all, but they did. They changed it just as much as they changed Luke's.

I'm not saying handling was the only reason they changed it, but that was the main reason for the size difference. Licensing issues don't come into prop building decisions.

A 2-inch groove is only enough for a couple fingers to grip comfortably on the upper half of the saber. They probably put that in because of the glove (that way his hand won't slip). SOME stunts had flat grips and no control box. There's also a version that does which is often seen in the promo photos. There are also two different stunt versions of the Ep3 Obi-Wan. One has a completely smooth upper grip and "gear" section, the other is like the Hero.

I know perfectly well what I'm talking about. I work with LFL licensing. I've actually spoken with PT propmasters though not about this saber in particular. I've actually held a lot of original OT and PT props in my own two hands. I've also written 50 magazine articles on the making of the movies, which included a ton of research.

 

[Beggarsoutpost]

I never said conspiracy...

 

[Tan Djarka]

LFL already licenses the Graflex design saber. Anything they did for ROTS would have been a new copyright anyway since there's no way they could have copied a Graflex exactly - just wasn't possible.

Oh I see... Wait, no I don't. Exactly HOW was it not possible?

Let's see, it's not marketing, right? And given how the stunt version of the Anakin ROTS is vastly different from the hero version, it's not an issue of practicality.

The only possible avenue of thought? The prop makers just didn't care. The vast majority of Star Wars fans would neither know nor care, so why should they, right?

It's not like there wasn't already TONS of available reference. Heck, they could have just asked you! There is no good reason for the Anakin ROTS saber being that different from the Luke ANH (except maybe a shiny chrome finish, because it was new).

They could have made it the same. They should have made it the same. They didn't.

 

[p0sitr0nic]

And again, why would they? Onscreen it looked quite close, but still shiney and new like all the PT sabers. The only people who would even notice is geeks like us who obsess over the props and such.

 

[p0sitr0nic]

Anakin ROTS is a smaller diameter which was another main reason to change it. It's too awkward to fight with a 1.5"+ diameter saber.
Licensing had nothing to do with it. Merchandising had nothing to do with it.
Copying a Graflex wasn't an issue either.

Sorry for a double post but I had to address this.

1.5 in diameter is NOT too awkward to fight with if you have big hands like me. To me, the PT sabers are all waaaay too tiny to duel with, I cant keep a good grip, but my own custon, which is 1.5, fits me perfectly.

Hayden Christenson has girly hands.

 

[Tan Djarka]

And again, why would they? Onscreen it looked quite close, but still shiney and new like all the PT sabers. The only people who would even notice is geeks like us who obsess over the props and such.

First: Because WE care. The people that actually might buy the licensed replicas. If somebody cares, maybe it's reason enough for them to care too?

Second: How much would it have cost to aquire a Graflex replica and put grips, a calculator bubble strip, and a Covertec knob instead of a D-ring on it? Maybe $200 ($300 including labor)?

How much did it cost to facricate an entirely new saber? Thousands? Even George Lucas has a budget, and it's not like there are no other found items in the prequels.

 

[Djinn]

I'm still holding onto my earlier theory of If they just made cleaner newer looking versions of the sabers we saw in ep 4. Not many people would buy the replicas because they technically already have those sabers.

But if they were radically new designs inspired from the ep 4 handles, well, people need to complete their collections.

Obviously the width of the handle while screening is not a factor here because much thinner stunts were made. The hero props were meant to be shown off on screen, in visual dictionaries, and posters, etc.

But what I didn't like was apparently an artist and not so much a prop designer came up with the concepts. How else can you explain the bling-blingyness of them? With the bright shiney polished chrome handles covered with bright gold parts and decorations. All they are missing is a pot leaf or the words "Thug Life" in diamonds down the side.

I prefer the more mechanical look of the original graflex with the small parts and screws and stuff all around the emitter area. With a brushed chrome to prevent corrosion exterior, you know things a weapons would have. Not a piece of jewelry.

 

[Hecubus114]

I think people are over complicating it. I think GL simply wanted another way to show that SW is "his" and he can make/change it any way he wants to prove so. I can just picture his line of thinking: "I had a certain vision of Luke's/Anakin's saber, but back in the 70's when we had no money, I was forced to use the closest thing I could find. Now I'm allowed to make how I really want it" (which is bs like most of what he says). He told propmakers to "idealize" it, and the chance to make it easier to duel with, and market a new collectable, were just perks.

I'm sure it really rubbed George the wrong way when the first person (how ever long ago it was) identified the found item that was used to make the saber.

 

[lonepigeon]

Oh I see... Wait, no I don't. Exactly HOW was it not possible?

Are they going to stamp and form sheet metal for each saber prop? A real Graflex has lots of tiny little bits they would never replicate on their own. The minute they change anything it's a new creation, not a Graflex.

Let's see, it's not marketing, right? And given how the stunt version of the Anakin ROTS is vastly different from the hero version, it's not an issue of practicality.

It's not vastly different. The most commonly used stunt has a groove that's it.
As with other PT sabers there were a couple other stunt saber options.