AA case begins

[Tyler Durden]

With the quality of the image, it's tough to call ABS or HDPE. I see areas that might suggest HDPE, but I can't make any definite statements.

While aged or unevenly heated plastic may be present on the suit,
I agree that most of the discoloration is probably due to lighting.

I'm also inline with Gino's theory that the real ST prototype, i.e. what ultimately became the Sandtrooper , is shown in the Esltree photos that Brian posted.

 

[SithLord]

Ok thanks Brian and others...I'll defer to the TK experts here

I guess it is a bit late but maybe this whole part of the thread about this new reference material should be split to another thread? Just a thought...haven't seen such a large digression before but certainly a very interesting one...

 

[CSMacLaren]

They look like scuffs to me indicative of either ABS or fiberglass...if it was painted HDPE we would see the characteristic beige where the flakes were...

However, would you think that the TIE Pilot funky rectangular shape thing would be so soft in detail were it cast in FG?

 

[Star Wars Helmets]

However, would you think that the TIE Pilot funky rectangular shape thing would be so soft in detail were it cast in FG?

Thats a very good point mac!

Cheers

Jez

 

[Too Much Garlic]

However, would you think that the TIE Pilot funky rectangular shape thing would be so soft in detail were it cast in FG?

If the original mold for it was vac-formed and then just slapped on the clay trooper sculpt before making the mold.

Just a suggestion for an explanation.

Just feels more "natural" that the helmet was vac-formed as that seems to be the way they were intended to be made!?

 

[GINO]

I second the idea of splitting this topic off into another thread as the discussion of this prototype trooper seems to have its own legs.

I would call the thread:

Stormtrooper Test Photos at Elstree Discussion
(or something like that)

You could break it off at post #1033

Anyone else think this is a good idea?

.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

Seems logical.

 

[Apollo]

Anyone else think this is a good idea?

.

archive it too once it has run it's course

 

[Lord Abaddon]

I second the idea of splitting this topic off into another thread as the discussion of this prototype trooper seems to have its own legs.

I would call the thread:

Stormtrooper Test Photos at Elstree Discussion
(or something like that)

You could break it off at post #1033

Anyone else think this is a good idea?

.

Very good idea, especially since there might be more to the AA case as well and this thread will continue on that subject.

Also I think that if Brian is going to post any more great pics they should be in a thread of his very own so members can see them and not have to wade through all this other stuff.

 

[clayslinger]

Hi All,

Just wanted to jump in and say Hi to Brian and thanks for the photos of your work. Beautiful work!
I'm a sculptor myself and the shots of the spaces you've worked in bring back memories! Haven't done the big stuff for almost 20 years though.

I certainly don't claim to be an expert in troopers and it's almost impossible to tell from a photo ,but as someone who's worked on projects with tight budgets that still want things to look flawless, the idea of a prototype being cast in fiberglass sounds likely to me.

If you're just wanting to check out the look of it in action,the cost of making positives for vacuform is higher than just popping a cast out of the original mold of the sculpture. Especially if you suspect you'll be making changes .

I even think that it was a main reason why they went with vacuform in the end. The time and money to cast and clean up 50 fiberglass suits would be much higher than 50 vacuform suits. Something you would learn after casting one up.

Just a thought.

Thanks again Brian and thanks to all who have done such an amazing amount of research into these costumes. Makes for a great read!

All the best,
Chuck...

 

[Art Andrews]

I know I am coming in on this a little late, but wanted to voice my agreement with those who are saying the color issues with the armor is a result of lighting, not of the pieces being from different materials, etc.

 

[SithLord]

TrooperMaster made a good point on TPD about the shade differences in the armor...what do people think about the possiblity that maybe the compad was put on the rear of BOTH the TIE and one or two TK helmets as a test....we know that there was only one TIE helmet (at least) with a compad on the rear instead of the pillbox...yet we don't see that onscreen (or at least cannot identify it for certain). So maybe AA also, just for variety's sake, put a compad on the rear of a TK helmet just as a test and that was what we see at Elstree but they discarded the idea of the compad on the rear of both the TIE and TK helmets? :confused But again we don't even know for sure who made the suit but a good point was made that the helmet looks just like the ones piled up in front of SDS at the time....including the brow piece which I thought AA sourced himself? Trust me I would much rather believe that this suit was a preliminary test suit that Elstree made but if they did such a good job on it why would they need AA?

 

[Qui-Gonzalez]

TrooperMaster made a good point on TPD about the shade differences in the armor...what do people think about the possiblity that maybe the compad was put on the rear of BOTH the TIE and one or two TK helmets as a test....we know that there was only one TIE helmet (at least) with a compad on the rear instead of the pillbox...yet we don't see that onscreen (or at least cannot identify it for certain). So maybe AA also, just for variety's sake, put a compad on the rear of a TK helmet just as a test and that was what we see at Elstree but they discarded the idea of the compad on the rear of both the TIE and TK helmets? :confused But again we don't even know for sure who made the suit but a good point was made that the helmet looks just like the ones piled up in front of SDS at the time....including the brow piece which I thought AA sourced himself? Trust me I would much rather believe that this suit was a preliminary test suit that Elstree made but if they did such a good job on it why would they need AA?

Because at the time he could probably pull from vac forms much quicker than the Elstree folks would be my guess.

 

[Star Wars Helmets]

Because at the time he could probably pull from vac forms much quicker than the Elstree folks would be my guess.

But that doesnt explain why they outsourced ALL the vac-forming to AA. This wasnt just the Stormtrooper helmets, it was the TIE's, RFT's, DS Gunners, XWing's, Imp Guard, TK Armour, TIE and Xwing chest Box's. This lasted 2-3 months.

All that would have been kept in-house with Elstree unionised labour if possible, not out-sourced to some non-unionised sweat-shop.

Since we seem to have (understandably) discounted fiberglass, IMO this is just another AA helmet. Either with the TIE bit glued to the back or else added to the vac form buck for a couple of pulls.

Cheers

Jez

 

[Qui-Gonzalez]

All that would have been kept in-house with Elstree unionised labour if possible, not out-sourced to some non-unionised sweat-shop.

Cheers

Jez

Jez, you've answered your own question with that statement. It's cheaper to use non-union labor on a film with a strict budget.

 

[Star Wars Helmets]

Jez, you've answered your own question with that statement. It's cheaper to use non-union labor on a film with a strict budget.

Yes, but you couldnt just decide to side-step due process just to save a few quid. Like I said it was 3 months work, not 3 days. IMO It was out-sourced to SDS as Elstree was not equipped to do the job.

Plus John Mollo's diary confirmed the numbers required and the numbers paid for. These correspond with the invoices from SDS.

Like I said earlier. If this video was taken early feb, even late Feb 76 then maybe. But the fact it was 15th March means SDS had already delivered the lions share of helmets and armour to Elstree, makes me believe it was just an AA helmet - not the "missing link"

Cheers

Jez

 

[GINO]

Keep in mind that there were tons of set panels etc. needing vac formed.
Perhaps they needed additional vac forming help to handle the volume, therefore outsourcing to AA.

.

 

[blewis17]

Keep in mind that there were tons of set panels etc. needing vac formed.
Perhaps they needed additional vac forming help to handle the volume, therefore outsourcing to AA.

.

Good point, Gino.

 

[SithLord]

Not sure if this helps any at this point but just the front view with a bit of enhancement...

 

[Star Wars Helmets]

Keep in mind that there were tons of set panels etc. needing vac formed.
Perhaps they needed additional vac forming help to handle the volume, therefore outsourcing to AA.

.

Perhaps, but that doesnt address my two points about the corroborating numbers, nor the dates.

I just think that everything points to that helmet and armour being the same SDS stuff that we've seen countless pics of on the pavement outside his offices on route to Elstree early March. IMO thats the simplest answer.

Cheers

Jez