AA case begins

[Tyler Durden]

From the last enlarged ST prototype photo, you can see the rounded cutout edges; it looks very similar to the way it was added on the TIE helmet.

I'm definitely leaning toward it being an added piece.

 

[SpyderDan]

No, sorry, it is not some illusion of photography. Even when the angle is different, the swoops show the same corresponding differences in the amount of curvature. If someone can duplicate the way this Elstree TK helmet looks with one of their replicas, then I'll believe you.

Here's a quick demonstration (sorry for the image quality):

Same helmet and armor (TE), on the same mannequin, from different camera angles with the mannequin looking slightly down and slightly up.

How the cap back is trimmed, and especially how the neck trim is configured, could make quite a difference as well.

 

[SithLord]

Most certainly the angle of how any single helmet is viewed matters, but what I mean is that for different helmets the amount of curvature appears to be different, so I was curious how much curvature was originally sculpted in. That is a good comparison and if you can show an angle like the one Brian showed it might be helpful...

 

[SpyderDan]

Most certainly the angle of how any single helmet is viewed matters, but what I mean is that for different helmets the amount of curvature appears to be different, so I was curious how much curvature was originally sculpted in. That is a good comparison and if you can show an angle like the one Brian showed it might be helpful...

Here you go:

I took several shots, and this was the closest match.

The TIE detail piece seems to suggest a straight line that might make you not notice the swoop, especially when viewed from this sort of angle.

 

[gizmo]

Wow this just keeps getting more and more interesting.Thats definetly the Tie compad.

If the compad is not just glued on is there any chance that the compad mold was just put onto the cap/back mold and formed over.Especially seeing we know it was a seperate mold later.

Hey Brian,any chance that dvd will ever see the light of day?


Ben

 

[Star Wars Helmets]

Just seen this on the Prop Den - excellent photo Brian, thanks again for sharing.

I have two theories regarding this "prototype" helmet

1) I cant see a join between the rear and the ear (although that might be due to the quality of footage). Could this helmet be fibergass?

2) Given the date- 15th March 06 (and the fact that most of AA's Stormtrooper were shipped to the studio by that point) - could this be just another of AA's "prototype" designs. Like the "prototype" TIE he made, he just added the comm padd moulding to the back section and vac-formed?

Again thanks for revealing such cool info Brian.

Cheers

Jez

 

[GINO]

1) I cant see a join between the rear and the ear (although that might be due to the quality of footage). Could this helmet be fibergass?

I would bet not. However I would bet that it was white ABS as AA would have been the one to form them in the khaki HDPE.
Also, I don't think that ear is part of the back/cap. I believe it is separate just like the detail piece and is the fault of the poor quality image.

2) Given the date- 15th March 06 (and the fact that most of AA's Stormtrooper were shipped to the studio by that point) - could this be just another of AA's "prototype" designs. Like the "prototype" TIE he made, he just added the comm padd moulding to the back section and vac-formed?

I don't believe that AA ever made any true prototype ever.


.

 

[defstartrooper]

1) I cant see a join between the rear and the ear (although that might be due to the quality of footage). Could this helmet be fibergass?

If you look at the other images of the footage posted earlier Jez there looks to be a gap between the mask and ear.
I doubt the ear would have originally been part of the cap/back mould it would have made forming a major pain and if they cast it in FG i would have thought they would just make an entirely one piece helmet again to make life easier.

 

[Star Wars Helmets]

I would bet not. However I would bet that it was white ABS as AA would have been the one to form them in the khaki HDPE.
Also, I don't think that ear is part of the back/cap. I believe it is separate just like the detail piece and is the fault of the poor quality image.

I don't believe that AA ever made any true prototype ever.

.

I could agree with you on the white ABS, like you said there may be a join but at that resolution its impossible to be sure.

On the second point, irrespective of what we call it - who do you think was responsible for it? - AA had a history of "sticking bits onto other bits" hence imo it looks like his handywork

Cheers

Jez

 

[GINO]

I suppose what I'm trying to say is that I don't believe he did anything but form parts off of vac molds that were supplied to him.
I used to think that maybe he would have created the vac form molds from the solid plaster masters that were provided by LFL, but after seeing the completed trooper at Elstree totally makes me change my mind.
Of course, we don't know with any certainty, just conjecture.

.

 

[GINO]

Actually, it makes total sense that this detail piece was abandoned for the rear of the helmet for all of the background helmets (stunts) because it would not have been able to be glued to the HDPE. Simply wouldn't stick. And then I'm sure they just left it off the heros to fall more in line with the backgrounds ones.

It also lends more credibility to my belief of this prototype helmet being ABS because it could be glued on easily.


.

 

[Star Wars Helmets]

I suppose what I'm trying to say is that I don't believe he did anything but form parts off of vac molds that were supplied to him.
.

I dont disagree with you, its highly possible that this was the case.

However my point was whether the guys at Elstree produced this, or whether it was a derivative made by SDS - and he just stuck the TIE part on the back of the buck and vac-formed over the top.

Cheers

Jez

 

[GINO]

I was just thinking. Maybe that detail piece was originally designed to be the ab plate cover but then rejected for some reason in lieu of the one we saw on screen.

They seem to have the same proportions and it has the stem coming off the top just like the rectangular frame on the ab plate.

Something to consider.

.

 

[Brian Muir]

Actually, it makes total sense that this detail piece was abandoned for the rear of the helmet for all of the background helmets (stunts) because it would not have been able to be glued to the HDPE. Simply wouldn't stick. And then I'm sure they just left it off the heros to fall more in line with the backgrounds ones.

It also lends more credibility to my belief of this prototype helmet being ABS because it could be glued on easily.


.

When looking at the dvd carefully the helmet looks a different colour to the suit.

If as you say it would not stick to HDPE it is a possibility that the helmet is fibreglass.

Also the only joints that can be seen are the ear flaps which were not part of the original sculpt and would have been fitted afterwards (even in fibreglass).

Brian

 

[Brian Muir]

Helmet different colour to suit

Brian

 

[GINO]

I seriously doubt that helmet is fiberglass. You can see the gaps in the ears from the front shot.
I do however believe that it could be white ABS.
It could still be HDPE and that piece could still be glued on, it just wouldn't be very secure.

If you have a look, you'll see the armor is different shades of white as well. It's just that the white's used were not all exactly the same. Just depends on which plastic they were using on the parts they were forming at the moment. You can see it on the screen used suits as well. Probably just less noticeable under the studio lighting.


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[SithLord]

I posted these enhanced images on TPD, thought they might be helpful here.

Definitely the front and rear of this helmet are different, but I don't see any dividing line.

I know I'll get shot for this, but why doesn't someone simply show this trooper to AA and ask? But don't say to him oh did you add a compad, just ask him what he thinks it is and when he thinks it was made. Don't tell him when or where the images were taken. That will be a test for him...even if he gives us lies again, it might be worth asking...if he is able to say right away that was an early test version of the armor that Elstree produced then we can discount his involvement. If he says it is his work then of course we cannot be sure.

 

[JBReplicas]

It could be an ABS rear/cap and a painted HDPE Face but why they would do that I have no idea :lol That might explain the differences in shade or like Gino says it could come down to paint finishes, and the join is usually pretty much covered by the fitting of the ears

 

[GINO]

Not different paint finishes, different shades of ABS.
The armor in those pics is made up of two different shades as well.

Same thing on the screen used armor.

,

 

[GINO]

Another thing to consider is that a lot of ABS sheet can be a different shade of white on each side of the same sheet. I know I have some here with me now that is and it is not uncommon.
It could simply be a matter of which side of the plastic they faced 'up' on the vac table. Especially if they weren't paying close attention or if they were doing different parts at different times.

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