Didn't they say something in the original movie about how the physicality of the item being digitized was held in the laser itself and then put back afterwards?
Tron Legacy Movie Review
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Jedi2016
Sr Member
Well, in the first film (which I saw again tonight with some friends) talked about how the disassembled matter from a real-world object was stored "in the laser beam" (which I take to mean there's some kind of raw-matter storage in the system somewhere). The argument is that Quorra never had any matter to begin with.. despite whatever pattern she may have fed the laser, there was nothing there to build her body from.
That does bring up the interesting idea that, perhaps, the ISOs were the only ones capable of doing this, of leaving the Grid. If that's the case, then Flynn didn't know it, either, since he would have otherwise just let CLU try it and get himself derezzed in the process. Unless that was the whole point of them having Flynn's disc.
Hopefully this is something they'll go into in the behind-the-scenes or commentary, or else something we can squeeze out of repeat viewings, maybe something that Flynn says about the ISOs that we didn't catch the first time.
That does bring up the interesting idea that, perhaps, the ISOs were the only ones capable of doing this, of leaving the Grid. If that's the case, then Flynn didn't know it, either, since he would have otherwise just let CLU try it and get himself derezzed in the process. Unless that was the whole point of them having Flynn's disc.
Hopefully this is something they'll go into in the behind-the-scenes or commentary, or else something we can squeeze out of repeat viewings, maybe something that Flynn says about the ISOs that we didn't catch the first time.
EvilRocketeer
Master Member
I thought the CGI on Arnold in Terminator Salvation was better done than the cgi on clu...but when i think of it..it could be the same since we didnt really see the cgi arnold speak..so it's really a close one
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CB2001
Master Member
I actually was going to say this too, but I wasn't sure if the laser was as big as a building or if the laser was as small as we saw in the film. But your right, the laser in the first film is freakin' huge.
LOL! Amen, Brother Art. My friend and I were discussing the negative critical reception before the screening; his first words as the credits rolled (and people began to converse excitedly all around us) were "what the **** are the critics smoking these days?!", or words to that effect.
It does get you excited, eh? It makes you think about it, and makes you want to talk about it - a bit like Inception, yes? Anything which does that can't be bad!
Agree with most of your points. Would the Na'vi look as good as they do (they really do look very good, to me) if they were pink- or brown-skinned, with brown or green eyes? Nonetheless, I WAS disappointed with CLU...but I gave him a pass. After all, he IS A PROGRAM. He doesn't have to look perfect, though since other programs were played by real humans it would have helped - but I was able to rationalise it during the movie; it wasn't a deal-breaker. It was worse during the flashback scenes with Young Flynn - he was the bigger problem. I really would have liked them to light those even lower, or whatever other tricks they could have used.
True. I would have liked it kept to two shots at most - one would have been better, or a second shot showing them doing something other than head-bobbing.
I think of it as an action/adventure movie with some script-doctoring issues and a few pretensions to 'deep and meaningful' messages, but ones which are a little tried-and-true to say the least. And yet it is so much more than the sum of its parts.
I've seen about three eps of House, though I'm a huge Hugh Laurie comedy fan. I do like what I've seen, but can't recall Olivia. I'm told she is NOT naturally chirpy and comedic in real life, and from the promo stuff I was expecting an Ice Princess character. So Quorra was a huge surprise.
thumbsup:thumbsup
Agent RayBans
Sr Member
I guess we could assume that what ever exists in a program's code that determines its "appearance" could be converted into matter? Almost like 3D printing? And what determines the appearance of a program is the appearance of its user, for some reason? (But then what about ISOs?)
Also, I think the world of Tron wants us to believe that a computer program is an independent entity, and doesn't require the presence of a computer to function. IE Tron on a floppy disk would look like Tron sitting in an empty room really bored with nothing to do.
If we accept those ideas, that helps the idea that a program can exist in the real world. There is just the missing variable that explains how a program is given the means to go from being code to a walking, talking robot. But, if Flynn had envisioned ISOs helping humanity by them joining us in the real world, he must have figured that out some how.
Maybe all of this explanation was left out on purpose. If its taking paragraphs for us to make sense of it, then how would they have been able to explain it in the movie without putting the audience to sleep? :lol
Here's an interesting thought... on the "Quorra in the real world" argument.
Let's look back at the getting in/out of the Grid aspect.
You have to have a disc to get out (assumed). Sam was a user, so the Grid kicked him out as he came in. However, they used Kevin's disc to get out of the Grid.
For users, the Grid could be designed to scan the user's DNA before going in/coming out to make sure and put the user back as they were. If Kevin's intent was to get the ISOs out, he could have programmed his disc to scan any DNA coming out and materialize it.
The problem with this is, there's no physical body to materialize to. But there is... Kevin didn't come out. I'm no geneticist, but if the system stores physical matter and just rewrites it according to blueprint, then why couldn't the system just materialize Quorra out of Kevin's "material" according to Quorra's DNA?
Maybe Kevin Flynn read Seth Brundle's notes... :lol
Let's look back at the getting in/out of the Grid aspect.
You have to have a disc to get out (assumed). Sam was a user, so the Grid kicked him out as he came in. However, they used Kevin's disc to get out of the Grid.
For users, the Grid could be designed to scan the user's DNA before going in/coming out to make sure and put the user back as they were. If Kevin's intent was to get the ISOs out, he could have programmed his disc to scan any DNA coming out and materialize it.
The problem with this is, there's no physical body to materialize to. But there is... Kevin didn't come out. I'm no geneticist, but if the system stores physical matter and just rewrites it according to blueprint, then why couldn't the system just materialize Quorra out of Kevin's "material" according to Quorra's DNA?
Maybe Kevin Flynn read Seth Brundle's notes... :lol
YenChih Lin
Master Member
I am very very surprised by this review of you and that proves, that you can
1/27/11, but that also means, it's absolutely worth spending money on 3D for this thrill ride.Thank you - but one question remains: Would you like to see more after Tron Legacy (which has already been announced to do another sequel)?
Actually, the 3D was not that impressive. Depending on how you feel about ticket prices, I think you can see it in 2D and not miss anything.
More Tron?
heres a question... assuming Kevin always came into the grid the same way Sam did, at the facsimile Flynn's Arcade, why the hell put the exit point so far from it? How the heck did he do that whole trip everytime he wanted to get out? I know he wanted to make it hard for programs to get out... but how the heck did he do it everytime. With his special light cycle i guess...
Skyler101
Sr Member
Hey guys,
After two years of waiting to see this film, I lugged myself out in the cold to catch a opening weekend screening, in a foreign country, and say Tron Legacy.
I so wanted to love this film, it had great potential, but never really cranked over. After reading everyone else's comments, I wont go over the same territory, but wanted to add these points.
The ISOs were a miracle, but we never really understood why and how they were going to change the world. Sure Flynn mentioned that they could eradicate modern problems, but I got the feeling it was all theoretical, and something that never went beyond the surface calms. Cora never displays any real talents or special abilities, and this is the real shame of the film. The ISO become a reason without function, and actually take this film away from the original story of TRON. A shame, cause it could have taken the narrative to the next level. Its like the writers pitched spectacle and no narrative to drive it. They missed the reason that the original film is popular today.
I was also disappointed with the way that the displayed the grid. The original film was like something you had never seen before, and I cringed in the flashback scenes when CLU, FLYNN and TRON were walking around in bomber jackets with a light stripe! We went from electrical circuitry displayed on ones representation of there body, to clothes you bought from a surplus store! It didnt look or feel like the electronic universe we knew from the first film, and it took away from any connection from the original.
They may have used ideas and names from the first film, but like so many re imaginings of previous films we all know and love, they got to smart for their own good, and ended up with a different product all together.
End of Line....
After two years of waiting to see this film, I lugged myself out in the cold to catch a opening weekend screening, in a foreign country, and say Tron Legacy.
I so wanted to love this film, it had great potential, but never really cranked over. After reading everyone else's comments, I wont go over the same territory, but wanted to add these points.
The ISOs were a miracle, but we never really understood why and how they were going to change the world. Sure Flynn mentioned that they could eradicate modern problems, but I got the feeling it was all theoretical, and something that never went beyond the surface calms. Cora never displays any real talents or special abilities, and this is the real shame of the film. The ISO become a reason without function, and actually take this film away from the original story of TRON. A shame, cause it could have taken the narrative to the next level. Its like the writers pitched spectacle and no narrative to drive it. They missed the reason that the original film is popular today.
I was also disappointed with the way that the displayed the grid. The original film was like something you had never seen before, and I cringed in the flashback scenes when CLU, FLYNN and TRON were walking around in bomber jackets with a light stripe! We went from electrical circuitry displayed on ones representation of there body, to clothes you bought from a surplus store! It didnt look or feel like the electronic universe we knew from the first film, and it took away from any connection from the original.
They may have used ideas and names from the first film, but like so many re imaginings of previous films we all know and love, they got to smart for their own good, and ended up with a different product all together.
End of Line....
I suppose this will come down to a matter of opinion. Yes, Arnold was good, but he was used in an extremely limited way, for a VERY short time and in special lighting to make the effect work. The exact same thing was done with Brad Pitt in Benjamin Button. The shot of Brad as a teenager was mind blowing to me... but the thing is, it was barely a few seconds... as was Arnold. CLU was one of the primary characters throughout the movie in ALL types of environments. Please don't misunderstand and think I am saying his rendering was not without problems. It certainly was and at times it was indeed a little distracting, but I think it was pretty bold and amazing for them to take such a leap and while I am willing to admit there were flaws, I also thought they did a stunning job and it added to the movie experience to have CLU as he should be, a young Bridges.
Exactly! If I walk out of a movie and all I can talk about was the effects or the actor, or the plot, the movie was a failure. If I walk out and talk about the things that happened in the world that was painted for me for the past two hours... now THAT is a movie worth watching. And you are right, Inception was the same way. I walked out and my head was buzzing with the ideas and the possibilities. The same happened here. I have a million questions which lead me to WANT to see a sequel and see where this is taken. An amazing and expansive framework has been developed, they are wide open to bring us even more cool things in the future! The question is, will they, or will they fall into a trap and the third one will be terrible. I guess a lot will depend on the script. Don't we have some script writers here? Get busy!!!
lol:lolI will agree that there were a LOT of pieces of this movie that seemed that they were lifted from others. Personally, I saw Star Wars, The Dark Knight, LOTS of Fifth Element, and LOTS of Matrix, etc. Because we are human and because we all more or less have the same wants, hopes and desires, you are going to see some of the deep messages get repeated after a while, especially when you start talking about God-like abilities and the possibility of abusing them or the possibility of creating a perfect world. Again, lots and lots or links to the Matrix in that regard. While it wasn't perfect, even in message, I look at this movies message compared to something like... Avatar and see no pretentiousness here at all in comparison. Avatar was an incredible visual feast that was completely undermined by the self-righteous message it was ramming down our throats. While I can certainly see where you might see shades of the same here, it wasn't even enough to register with me and I am ususally ultra-sensitive to those type of things.
I'm told she is NOT naturally chirpy and comedic in real life, and from the promo stuff I was expecting an Ice Princess character. So Quorra was a huge surprise.
Agree completely. I was expecting her to be doing the ultra-cool untouchable thing and was VERY pleasantly surprised to see her not be that way at all. When I first saw that she was very boisterous I was like... oh no.... Leeloo... but I think they did a great job of making Quorra her own character and not a cookie cutter copy of Leeloo, even though the roles had similarities. Again, seeing Wilde like this makes me really want to see her more and see what she's got because I would have never thought this was possible watching her on house.
I am very very surprised by this review of you and that proves, that you canon the critics seen on the more movie centric sites. Tron Legacy starts in germany much later
Thank you - but one question remains: Would you like to see more after Tron Legacy (which has already been announced to do another sequel)?
Thanks... I think. I am by no means a movie critic. There are people here on the site who are able to break them down much better than me. What I am is VERY picky and I walk out of a LOT of movies very disappointed, frustrated, and unsatisfied. That was not the case, here.
And to answer your question, YES, I would very much like to know what happens next in the Tron universe. I would be very afraid that they would ruin it and destroy all that they have built, but I am very intrigued by all that was left unanswered and unlike most movies who tack on a poor excuse for a sequel, I think this movie did a great job setting up a sequel throughout. I almost have difficulty imagining them NOT doing another.
I can totally agree on this point. The concept of the ISO was touched on and you were given the sense that they were important, but you never REALLY know why other than vague concepts. One of the questions I asked at the end was "what is Quorra going to change in the real world?" but then beyond all the theoretical things Flynn mentions, lets be honest, if this did indeed happen, the simply fact that a string of numbers came to life and was a living sentient bring, it WOULD change almost everything we believe and the way we look at life itself. It would probably be one of the greatest turning points for humankind. She wouldn't even necessarily have to DO anything, she would just have to exist. Now, I know that is somewhat creating an answer and doesn't get away from your valid point that they should have fleshed it out more.
As much as I agree with you on your first point, I disagree with this one. I see where you are coming from, but in considering the look of the first film vs the second, in the first film, Flynn was sucked in to a world created without direct human intervention. I see it as a shell, completely functional, but lacking any depth or detail. It was very utilitarian, as it should have been. However, when Flynn comes back in the flashbacks of Tron: Legacy, he isn't coming back as a confused prisoner. He is coming back as a "god" to create and to build a world in his image. Since he has total control and power to create and destroy, why in the world would he come back as he was before? He comes back the way he wants, on his terms, with his own look and style ideas, not the style ideas of the computer, which again was very utilitarian. I can agree that this movie took the Tron universe in a very different direction from the first movie, but I think it expanded on it in a good way and gave us more that was completely plausible within the framework of what we knew from the original Tron. While this kind of term is becoming a bit dated, this was Tron 2.0, a Tron built from Flynn's vision instead of that of a soulless computer.
While I know the angles aren't great, thought this was a fun comparison to see where Tron came from and where it is today. I think the fact that they have changed the design so little is great.
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