STAR WARS Rebels new animated series!

What I meant, referring to the ships, is that I thought basic parts of those things would be made canon. Obviously if I played SW Battlefront and teabag Darth Vader that's not canon. I can't see why assets, like ships, planets, weapons, etc. in a game wouldn't become canon.

Other than the Republic Commando and X-Wing novels, I agree. Everything else was pretty crappy. I can guarantee you that nothing will change with the new books other than all the crap will rise to the top since it will be canon. You aren't going to be able to just ignore it like The Crystal Star (regarded as THE worst EU novel). There's no way to guarantee every book that comes out will be on par with the films. So when all the talking Disney bunny aliens are wrote into a book, which will happen, they will be the same level of canon as Luke...

First off... Teabag Vader..... ***** awesome! :lol


I have more faith in the new EU because LFL and Disney are directly involved and they will care about how everything fits in and effects the franchise. In the past, since LFL was not going to do any more movies, they were content on letting book publishers develop and create the ongoing saga. Problem is that publishers were pretty short sited. They cared more about selling a comic mini series or novel story arc but did not give much consideration to how it would effect Star Wars in the long run.
 
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Sorry, I found the old EU to be mostly crap. Too many authors going after the cool factor to lure in fan boys and make their own little mark on Star Wars. When Disney announced they bought the franchise and we're going to do new movies that included origin cast, I prayed that it would mean wiping out the EU. And they did and I was so very happy. It's gone and I could care less if any of it comes back. And if whatever does comeback, I hope it is used better in new stories.

Other than the Republic Commando and X-Wing novels, I agree. Everything else was pretty crappy. I can guarantee you that nothing will change with the new books other than all the crap will rise to the top since it will be canon. You aren't going to be able to just ignore it like The Crystal Star (regarded as THE worst EU novel). There's no way to guarantee every book that comes out will be on par with the films.

I'll quasi-agree with both of you. The Crystal Star, while a decent story, totally wan't Star Wars. The Black Fleet Crisis was just bad (the only thing I liked about it was that it brought back a grown-up Cindel Towani, from the first Ewok movie). The whole New Jedi Order series felt off, even if I liked a few of the story elements and character arcs from within it. Likewise the Fate of the Jedi series -- if it had just been Luke and Ben dinking around on a personal quest, I would have liked it far better. Et cetera, et cetera. For all the good stories and characters and writing, it seemed there was at least as much that didn't work for one reason or another.

So when all the talking Disney bunny aliens are wrote into a book, which will happen, they will be the same level of canon as Luke...

What, you mean these? :p

In the past, since LFL was not going to do any more movies, they were content on letting book publishers develop and create the ongoing saga. Problem is that publishers were pretty short sited. They cared more about selling a comic mini series or novel story arc but did not give much consideration to how it would effect Star Wars in the long run.

Enh... More that they went about it the wrong way. The editors and overseers of what would come to be called the Expanded Universe had a policy that no new work could contradict the films (duh) or any previously-published work. So when West End Games screwed up things like the length of the Super Star Destroyer or how lightsabers work, later authors were beholden to perpetuate those errors. When Tim Zahn gave us Rogue Squadron due to a misinterpretation of what was seen in ESB, it had to be perpetuated by later authors. And so on. Inconsistencies and oversights and factual errors kept compounding as more and more new material got added. And the 501st Legion has contributed to that, too, with the group defining -- back in 2002 -- Storm Commandos as black Scout Troopers (they aren't) and Magmatroopers as red Stormtroopers (they've actually never been seen or illustrated or described anywhere, and the single appearance of red Stormtroopers in the EU specifically identified them as Royal Guards in red Stormtrooper armor on special assignment). So in 2003, Dark Horse published a miniseries where we saw Storm Commandos... as black Scout Troopers. And in 2009, Gentle Giant did an exclusive red repaint of their Stormtrooper statue as a Magmatrooper.

So yeah, the establishment of the Story Group back in '08 was a good thing, and they helped push back against some of that over the years since (Super Star Destroyers are now properly 19km long), but what they really needed was the retirement of Lucas and the opportunity to dump the entirety of the extant EU into a hopper from which to pull stuff that actually works. I'm hopeful most of the "distant past" stuff, like Dawn of the Jedi and all the Knights of the Old Republic era comics and games, get plunked wholesale into the canon. They're pretty internally consistent and the three thousand years between those events and Episode I is plenty of room for anything to happen to bring about the state of the galaxy as we find it in the movie saga. Everything post-ROTJ is gone, but I hope some characters and elements make it in, like Daala and Thrawn and the R6-series astromech. And everything that had been set during the films is in an in-between state -- much of it works, still, and much of it doesn't, and it eeds to be gone through very carefully to determine which is which. Personally, I hope Shadows of the Empire is utterly deleted. It annoys me the same way the search for Boba Fett did in the old Marvel series. Why were they trying to find Fett? They knew at the end of ESB where he was taking Han. Ugh.

As far as this game goes, though... Yeah, games are still out there that were published before the Big Announcement. They are Legends. But this game was first published then, and is still being added to now. Just a small single-page insert in new releases saying certain ships and characters released earlier are Legends, accompanying an announcement on their web site, would forestall things like what started this whole sidebar:

Does that mean Punishing One and Mist Hunter are now canon?

Sorry, SVS. ;)

But since they are still being sent out to stores by FFG after Lucafilm announced that all new books, comics, and games were canon... You can hopefully see how that needs clarification.

--Jonah
 
You guys understand that the "Legends" marker is only previously developed story materials. This way they can still continue to reprint the materials and keep selling them in stores and for those people interested in reading alternate although non-canon storyline. The "Legends" indicated that those material are the old EU. It is not a label that is going to be put on anything and everything produced now and into the future. So while all Legends labels equals non-canon, not all non-canon equals Legends (thumb is a finger but not all fingers are thumbs).

The X-Wing miniatures game is not a story... and therefore not something that can be sourced as canon.
 
This is where I feel we're going in circles. I can't wrap my head around why you're so insistent on separating the not-really-separable. The story can't exist without the settings and characters. Two sides of the coin. Luke Skywalker and the Millennium Falcon are every bit as canon as what they do. Likewise, Baron Soontir Fel and the Mist Hunter are Legends, regardless of the story woven around those elements. Canon standing is relevant to the trappings, too, not just the ephemera. Take away the people, places, and things and it's just one of the seven stories that have existed for thousands of years. Those nouns matter. They create content for the context, and vice versa. The game doesn't need a story to still have canon be relevant. Mixing canon with Legends in a game that is still being produced and still having new (presumably canon) content added, post-Announcement, creates a point of confusion. As we've seen.

--Jonah
 
This is where I feel we're going in circles. I can't wrap my head around why you're so insistent on separating the not-really-separable. The story can't exist without the settings and characters. Two sides of the coin. Luke Skywalker and the Millennium Falcon are every bit as canon as what they do. Likewise, Baron Soontir Fel and the Mist Hunter are Legends, regardless of the story woven around those elements. Canon standing is relevant to the trappings, too, not just the ephemera. Take away the people, places, and things and it's just one of the seven stories that have existed for thousands of years. Those nouns matter. They create content for the context, and vice versa. The game doesn't need a story to still have canon be relevant. Mixing canon with Legends in a game that is still being produced and still having new (presumably canon) content added, post-Announcement, creates a point of confusion. As we've seen.

--Jonah

The thing is, the X-Wing game doesn't do anything to add to the existing canon, it merely pulls from the canon, so I don't see how whether the game is canon or not matters. An RPG would almost certainly matter since they'd be more likely to add to the universe as well as flesh things out but a miniatures combat game, not so much. Whether a unit in the game is pulled from canon or Legends sources wouldn't matter to players except for if you wanted to create a canon pure game where you can only use units, and corresponding cards, that are from canon sources, aside from that players just aren't going to care.
 
Items, ships, characters, etc... Yes, all things that can go into a story. But a company making a plastic model does not make it canon, It has to be in a canon story.

For instance, the latest 6" figure poll had Mara Jade in the running. If she had won and they made the figure. It would not have meant it brought the character back into canon. Similarly, Darth Revan won and KOTOR is no longer part of the canon. The release of this figure or the continued released software does not make it canon.
 
Just listening to the new RFR podcast and Jimmy Mac interviews Dave and they discuss Ahsoka and how much the story group love the character. I've said it before and will reiterate, Ahsoke will NOT die in Rebels, she has more stories to be told as far as Disney is concerned.
 
Absolutely. I firmly believe that we may even see he in a live action film at some point. I would LOVE to see an aged ashoka have a conversation with luke about his father

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Just listening to the new RFR podcast and Jimmy Mac interviews Dave and they discuss Ahsoka and how much the story group love the character. I've said it before and will reiterate, Ahsoke will NOT die in Rebels, she has more stories to be told as far as Disney is concerned.

i hope so too, im curious if they throw her in the rogue movie....
 
Just listening to the new RFR podcast and Jimmy Mac interviews Dave and they discuss Ahsoka and how much the story group love the character. I've said it before and will reiterate, Ahsoke will NOT die in Rebels, she has more stories to be told as far as Disney is concerned.

Absolutely. I firmly believe that we may even see he in a live action film at some point. I would LOVE to see an aged ashoka have a conversation with luke about his father

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i hope so too, im curious if they throw her in the rogue movie....

If Ahsoka ever does show up in live action form, I hope they consider letting Ashley play her.

star-wars-clone-wars-cosplay.jpg
 
I would like Ahsoka to show up with Luke, even if she is just in the background. That would show that the surviving Jedi did come forward to help. That's one thing I didn't like about the EU is supposedly all these Jedi survived, but only a handful bothered to contact Luke. Ahsoka should still be alive in the new movies.
 
I would like Ahsoka to show up with Luke, even if she is just in the background. That would show that the surviving Jedi did come forward to help. That's one thing I didn't like about the EU is supposedly all these Jedi survived, but only a handful bothered to contact Luke. Ahsoka should still be alive in the new movies.

Well one thing about SW that's always bugged me besides the Empire just folding up after ROJ (which thank gawd they didn't) is this idea that ALL the Jedi but Obi and Yoda got killed...so what are they? Supermen? I could buy a 95% death rate after order 66 but dammit there had to be a few out on spy missions,exploration or such that either figgered out what was going down or got the warning Obi and Yoda sent at the end of the third film.

And if anybody could dodge Vader it'd be his former padwan,in fact any Jedi with even a half a brain might decide rising up and fighting would be,to quote Solo,"suicide" so laying back and causing havoc and backing any uprising would be smarter.

Ahsoka being alive after all this time might not be just possible but a simple fact if her race is long lived,if they live two-three hundred years and she's eighty or so in the new films would be nothing,and in this new series she'd be what? thirty? forty something?

About all I'm curious about is just how the people see the Jedi after Vader,we need to see if they want them back or just want nothing to do with them,and I haven't watched all the Clone Wars shows so I wonder how Ahsoka feels about them herself? seems I heard she left in a way that says she's not too sure about them,and really we need some grey jedi,some who found the order too self confident and too smug and that's why Palp handed them their hind end.
 
I love the idea of grey jedi. I think that's why kanan is so interesting. His training stopped at age 12. Then he never saw another jedi.

Do yourself a favor and watch the ashoka arc at the end of season 5. Brilliant

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Well one thing about SW that's always bugged me besides the Empire just folding up after ROJ (which thank gawd they didn't) is this idea that ALL the Jedi but Obi and Yoda got killed...so what are they? Supermen? I could buy a 95% death rate after order 66 but dammit there had to be a few out on spy missions,exploration or such that either figgered out what was going down or got the warning Obi and Yoda sent at the end of the third film.

And if anybody could dodge Vader it'd be his former padwan,in fact any Jedi with even a half a brain might decide rising up and fighting would be,to quote Solo,"suicide" so laying back and causing havoc and backing any uprising would be smarter.

I think that all the survivors did what the beacon said, go to ground and hide. That's why I don't like the comics (even brand new ones...) where Obi Wan is running around Tatooine saving people when he should be hiding and protecting Luke. Obviously he has used the Force under observation in some instances because people call him a wizard. Just a guess, but I'm thinking that when Obi Wan reprogrammed the beacon he could have signed Yoda's name to it. That would have made the order come from authority so the Jedi wouldn't question it.


About all I'm curious about is just how the people see the Jedi after Vader,we need to see if they want them back or just want nothing to do with them,and I haven't watched all the Clone Wars shows so I wonder how Ahsoka feels about them herself? seems I heard she left in a way that says she's not too sure about them,and really we need some grey jedi,some who found the order too self confident and too smug and that's why Palp handed them their hind end.

I think the old EU got this right in that a lot of people view them like Han Solo. There was so much disinformation out after the Emperor took over that they don't even believe the Jedi can do what they reportedly were able to. Either that or they believe part of it, but think it was exaggerated. Criminals would probably still believe because they would have known the Jedi were bad news and most likely told the stories.
 
I think that all the survivors did what the beacon said, go to ground and hide. That's why I don't like the comics (even brand new ones...) where Obi Wan is running around Tatooine saving people when he should be hiding and protecting Luke. Obviously he has used the Force under observation in some instances because people call him a wizard.

I totally agree. That's why I really hope they don't decide to make an Obi-wan movie and certainly not an Obi-wan trilogy. I don't like the idea of him gallivanting all over the galaxy or even all over Tatooine. As far as I'm concerned, he looked over Luke and lived a generally quiet, solitary life, perhaps with the rare exception but not enough to base a movie on.

Anyway, I very much hope at least Ahsoka and Kanan die by the time Rebels is over. I never liked that Jedi feature in Rebels at all, especially in such an open way, but if they must be included I'm hoping they meet their end before it's all said and done. Of course, I've never understood the appeal of Ahsoka but that's a different discussion. I do think it'd be interesting if Ezra survived. Someone that was just beginning to take their first steps toward becoming a Jedi but had their training cut short could be interesting.
 
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The thing is we never have seen what happened after ROTJ,Ahsoka (since she's an actual part of it now) could very well have shown up and helped Luke,the thing is why didn't these jedi show up during the rebellion? that's kinda the problem with Lucas's story telling-he throws random **** in whenever he pleases and it makes a mess.

My best guess is maybe the jedi that are left are pretty disillusioned at the order's failure and just said "screw it" and ether walked away or went on to helping in other ways hell maybe we'll see Luke trying to rebuild at some point and the remaining few jedi he can find are like "drop it,the jedi need to stay dead" maybe Ahsoka will help to a point then go off and settle down and have a family,I need to watch the Clone Wars but the thing I get from what I read is she isn't that happy with the Jedi when she leaves.

Like I said-a mess,but maybe the new films will sort it out.
 
The thing is we never have seen what happened after ROTJ,Ahsoka (since she's an actual part of it now) could very well have shown up and helped Luke,the thing is why didn't these jedi show up during the rebellion? that's kinda the problem with Lucas's story telling-he throws random **** in whenever he pleases and it makes a mess.

My best guess is maybe the jedi that are left are pretty disillusioned at the order's failure and just said "screw it" and ether walked away or went on to helping in other ways hell maybe we'll see Luke trying to rebuild at some point and the remaining few jedi he can find are like "drop it,the jedi need to stay dead" maybe Ahsoka will help to a point then go off and settle down and have a family,I need to watch the Clone Wars but the thing I get from what I read is she isn't that happy with the Jedi when she leaves.

Like I said-a mess,but maybe the new films will sort it out.

I'm interested to read the upcoming comic showing what happens after Return of the Jedi. For those that do not know what I am talking about, read this: http://www.darkhorizons.com/news/38261/-star-wars-comics-reveal-post-jedi-mess

In rebels, Ahsoka has white blades. Dave F. Did say that it was because she was not a Jedi or not following the Jedi ways or something to that effect. I just hope they don't use the term "Gray Jedi" in the new EU.
 
I totally agree. That's why I really hope they don't decide to make an Obi-wan movie and certainly not an Obi-wan trilogy. I don't like the idea of him gallivanting all over the galaxy or even all over Tatooine. As far as I'm concerned, he looked over Luke and lived a generally quiet, solitary life, perhaps with the rare exception but not enough to base a movie on.

They could still do an Obi Wan movie, it would just have to be set in the Prequel era. I like the idea that Obi Wan didn't even ignite his lightsaber in public until he was in the Cantina and that kind of signaled the return of the Jedi. He didn't need to hide anymore at that point.

The thing is we never have seen what happened after ROTJ,Ahsoka (since she's an actual part of it now) could very well have shown up and helped Luke,the thing is why didn't these jedi show up during the rebellion? that's kinda the problem with Lucas's story telling-he throws random **** in whenever he pleases and it makes a mess.

I think the only problem there is Ahsoka. We know Ahsoka resurfaced to help the fledgling Rebellion, so she either parts ways at some point or is killed. That would be the only reason, other than the time each series was made, no one mentions to Luke that they already have a Jedi. Otherwise the rest just hid and kept their heads down like Yoda.
 
I totally buy that Obi Wan had more adventures even off planet.

Also I have mentioned this previously in this thread regarding that just because you don't see something in the OT, it does not mean it didn't happen. I totally believe their was always more rebels serving in other places all the time. Haven't you ever wondered where all those pilots came from in the A New Hope ceremony scene? The only thing that makes sense is that they were part of the bug out forces that reached Yavin after the battle. You think they were just sitting around wearing their helmets, thinking. "Boy, if i had a ship, I'd really show them." or "Ok, I'm a skilled rebel pilot, but sure it was a smart move to give my ship to a farmer that never flew a starfighter or a single space battle." Where was the fleet, Madine, Mothma, Ackbar at Yavin and Hoth? Where was all the others from Yavin and Hoth during Endor? Why would you take all your ground troops and ground assets into a space battle (Endor)? You wouldn't. I believe there were forces that either were not needed or were on separate missions or for some reason or another could not meet up with the fleet.
 
I think the only problem there is Ahsoka. We know Ahsoka resurfaced to help the fledgling Rebellion, so she either parts ways at some point or is killed. That would be the only reason, other than the time each series was made, no one mentions to Luke that they already have a Jedi. Otherwise the rest just hid and kept their heads down like Yoda.

I say we freeze her in Carbonite and thaw her out in the movies. It's the option that leaves the fewest holes for characterization and lore. It's a big galaxy. Some idiot must have done this to themselves before Han went through it.
 
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