Newbie looking for advice and perspective on first prop

[DukeNukem117]

Hmmm, interesting. I never liked taping myself back when I did careplans for nursing (a whole other life), so I'm going to look on craigslist for an old large scale printer just for BPs.


Anyways, progress update (11-26-11, 19 days left)
I didn't do much over the last 2 days on account of thanksgiving. The main body part has been cut out with a bandsaw. Some further detailing in the cuts needs to be done, and I'm going to start sanding for symmetry starting tomorrow or monday, then router the edges. The side panels will be designed and cut into acrylic with a laser cutter. I thought styrene or sintra might be easier to paint over, but thats what my shop teacher said to use.

As you can see, I've gotten alot of the electronics in the mail, and am sorting through how to make it all work. The CCFL does have a large footprint, but the rod is the perfect size, so I'll see if I can make it work before turning towards LED/acrylic tube.

Few things that I'm still undecided on:

1) The trigger guard slot - I'm not sure if I should try using the milling machine to cut this out. The MDF is too thick to use a scroll saw, so a jig-saw might be the best way, then I smoothen it out with putty. I'm not too experienced with jig saws, so I dont know how much kickback or control it has. Another option is to simply drill a ton of holes. Lastly, should I cut each separately or clamp the two MDFs together for a better shot at symmetry? Its going to clamp together to be 1.5 inches thick.

2) The trigger - A static trigger would be extremely easy to do, but a moving one would obviously be better. However a moving one would take much more time, as I would need to cut a slot between the two thick pieces of MDF, and cram a trigger, spring, and possibly hinge in there. Since I dont have the time to wire the trigger to interact with the lights, it would simply be there to press. I'm not sure if the trade-off is worth it for how much additional time it will take. Is there a way to "cheat" a trigger function that is much easier and less complicated that I don't know about?

Thanks, and I hope you all had a great Thanksgiving!

 

[robstyle]

Make the trigger a slide as opposed to a classic trigger. That way you just have to make the trigger out of MDF and round the edges off. Cut a channel into the trigger guard and handle to mount it. This will also allow you to mount a micro momentary switch behind that trigger that can activate the lights when pressed. If you get a switch that already has a heavy enough spring on it, youve solved the trigger return issue.

Any plastic, ABS, sintra or styrene material isnt easy to paint but it can be done. You should look into either a plastic primer or cheap out and dust the surface with Krylon fusion from a rattle can. Ill say what will save you on the paint is a weathered look. Not silver edges but actual grim, wear, texture and color.

 

[DukeNukem117]

Something like this? (see attachment)

I originally considered carving out a channel, and making the trigger mechanism out of something like Sintra or Styrene externally, then sliding it in. But your method simplifies that even more.

I think I'm going to skip turning on the light with a trigger for this project, and save it for my next prop. I am going to hit up a local electronic store one of my profs recommended to find one of those audio playing mechanisms, I'll update how that goes.

I spent a good portion of the day tinkering and reading up on electronics. I was able to complete a lightbox side project, which I'm pretty happy about since it costs a fraction of what stores charge, and is bigger. But it taught me some stuff about soldering, LEDs, etc. I also figured out how to make the CCFL work, at least in theory. I'm going to run the cable into the front canister, which will house the inverter and the 12v 27A single cell battery. The on/off switch can be on the bottom, inside the beveled end. I think I will even have space to fit the LED components next to it. I'm going to ask a friend who is an electrical engineer major if I can hook both up to the same switch.

I think the reason my professor recommended acrylic is cause he has alot lying around in his shop, so I don't have to buy it. I'm still figuring out the construction for the top and the barrel, so I'll figure out painting afterwards. I think I'm required to use my spray gun, so I'll be using PCL 2 part automobile primer, along with house of kolor paint. I'll do weathering if I have time, but at the very least, I'll need to deliver something painted in the end. I really want to do weathering, so even if I don't make the deadline, I'll tackle it at some point.

Thanks for all your help, and I'll post back when I have something new.

 

[robstyle]

You could do the trigger that way but I was suggesting sliding it into the channel from the rear then simply mounting the handle. The spring loaded momentary switch would be the return. Its the same principal as a water gun or nerf in regards to the channels.

For your LED lighting might I also suggest you dont just add LED's as an afterthought. Use them for internal type ambient back lighting. Keep the design as a weapon and not a swap meet toy. To keep it simple, cheap and basic I still suggest off the shelf dollar store flashlights and such. That is if youve not already spent money on parts.

 

[DukeNukem117]

Too late, haha. I think I'm just going to have the CCFL for lighting, so as to not overdo it. I think I'm having a better idea of what you are saying with the trigger. But how should I cut the channel out? I'll have to cut an identical part out of both sides of the body. Router? Mill?

 

[robstyle]

You can do anything really to channel the trigger guard for the trigger. Router, dremel, hobby knife, chisel... whatever you have on hand that will do the job.

 

[DukeNukem117]

Status Update (11 Days Left)

Man, I couldn't have picked a worse time to get sick. Some things had to change as a result of that and further realizations as this project went on.

Strangely my class did not have a chamfer bit for the router despite having 2 boxes of router bits. I tried to chamfer the sides myself with a router and a course sanding bit. I think I'm just going to use a fillet bit and a router instead. I'll probably smoothen out the insides with bondo.

I tried milling out the trigger slot but ended up needing to make additional adjustments with a dremel. In retrospect, I probably shouldnt have cleared it all the way to the back, but I'll get to that later.

In order to have a stopper for the trigger spring, I made a small channel into the wood and glued inside a lego piece. Luckily, the little circular extrusions underneath fit the spring perfectly.

I used many small scraps of masking tape to cover up the exposed area of the trigger. I needed to insert the trigger and connect both halves of the gun in order to make further progress, and I needed a way to paint everything else without repainting the trigger. This way I can peel off the masking tape with tweezers after everything else is painted.

I bribed my roommates with chocolate and ramen so that I can have the living room for the next 2 weeks.

A big box of lasercut pieces to sort through and attach once the body starts coming together.

-------

Currently I'm working (or trying to) on the barrel assembly. I'm struggling to find the right diameter PVC pipings, and I don't want to have to buy a 10 feet pipe for 6" of it. I have a big fat dowel (you can see it in the corner of one of the pictures) that I am considering lathing.

I've decided to abandon the whole back top syringe handle altogether, and will instead have it become a simple geometric stock. This was partly to cut down on the workload, and partly to not have the end result look like a super soaker. I've also shelved the bayonet and lower front canister for now, as I can attach those at a later point. I've also ditched the CCFL cause it seemed out of place. So much time learning electrical knowledge that won't even be used in the end lol.

One thing that I am trying to decide on is what to use to smoothing out the edges. I tried using apoxie sculpt today, and was disappointed to find that it didn't stick to MDF all that well, making it difficult to sculpt. I also tried heating and bending styrene to cover up the inside of the hand guard and trigger slot similar to what Volpin did here:

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5076/5907415670_3ec8e873ae_b.jpg

But styrene proved difficult to manipulate, and it kept warping and curling. I think I might just use bondo to smooth out everything. Should I consider bondo glaze or dolphin glaze for that instead? I also have wonderflex on hand, though I don't know how well that'll work.

The last thing I'm trying to do is figure out how to paint this thing. Alot of it will probably be assembled when I reach the painting stage, just because I need it assembled to guide construction. I'm wondering if I should construct some kind of hanger or arm to hold it up so I can hit every side with primer and paint.

Man, I'm learning so many new things in the construction of this so far, though I wish I knew half of those coming in.

One thing I will say is that if I die from exposure to all this dust and paint, I hope to be reincarnated as something with more arms.

This guy has the right idea.

PS: Yes, I use a respirator, but its hard to get all this dust out of my living room.

 

[robstyle]

You can always go back and repaint the trigger so dont let that hold you up.

For painting the surface, if its going to be smooth plastic or acrylic, you can cheap it out and dust the cleaned surface with krylon fusion out of a rattle can. Self etching primer will work as will a filler primer. One issue you will run into with masking to paint colors is the tape will pull the paint off that plastic. Demask the tape by first applying the tape to your shirt or pants. This takes some of the stick off while still leaving enough to hold and do its job. Green or blue painters tape and NOT yellow/brown paper tape is what you want.

Get the mock up done then worry about paint. This includes all your parts in hand and whatever electronics your still looking to use.

Dont do that sanding in your living area. Regardless of a respirator its all now all over your place when the respirator is not used for day to day life. Its not just your health but your roommates as well.

 

[DukeNukem117]

Ok, should I try to keep most of the main components separate until priming and painting?

 

[DukeNukem117]

I've been really busy working so I havn't had a chance to update the status. Here is a picture from a few days ago. Its a general idea of what the final thing will look like, sans ammo canister.

The barrel has been attached to help construction, but the stock is still separate. The PVC and plastic stock have been sanded down so that primer will stick to it. The edges of the detail panel has been beveled with glaze. I'll probably be priming tonight.

 

[robstyle]

Without knowing your final paint scheme I cant suggest full build vs partial for paint and primer. If the acrylic or barrel is to be a different color than the MDF, then it would be easier and more time effective to paint them separately.

As for your finalized surface and greeblie dressing, remember function over layers upon layers of junk. This is where sci-fi designs go wrong. Less is more when it comes to functionality. You dont see anything unrelated to function on a bare military rifle.

To add something to your build, consider a simple and fitting display stand. You can possibly use a length of 4" PVC pipe with grooves or sections cut out ad light it from the bottom. Not super bright light but ambient lighting. Just a simple dollar store flashlight will work. Its just to hold the prop for display. Find closet to center balance on your prop and make that the point it sits inside the cut out on the PVC pipe. Please avoid the temptation of of the horrid steel grate or allen head screws or rivets. If your prop doesnt have these, neither should anything related to it.

 

[DukeNukem117]

Thanks. I actually didn't get to prime today. I was working so late that I didnt realize I attached the barrel 2 degrees skewed to the left. So I spent a good hour getting it off. I honestly didn't plan this as well as I should have. I thought I did all the homework and research, but it was like designing a puzzle, building the pieces, and solving it all at the same time.

I'm hoping to get it primed tomorrow, and I'll try to get my friend to send me the paint schemes before then.

Curious, but when trying to center a barrel between 2 pieces of wood, do you just eyeball it?

Update:
Here is a rough idea of what we are thinking of for the paint scheme. Remove the orange band on the barrel however.

 

[robstyle]

To get your barrel centered you can measure distances and use a dowel or set screw to get it in place.

Im glad you posted that progress picture. Where you have the wood box propping it up, thats where the 4" piece of PVC pipe would come into play as a display stand. Avoid clear acrylic or such and make it match the gun itself as if its made for it.

To my eye your going to need more black color on the top and or rear to even out the black barrel. For example on the rear area, where the tape is crossing that dot, maybe add some fine grate type material or use some screen to paint a pattern over it.

Where you have dots, whats the purpose? I assume they would be for assembly so it would have some form of nut/bolt or other attaching item inside. If you have an aircraft surplus near you you can pick up some wicked misc bits to place in those holes. Its added detail and fits the design. I have a small box full of this stuff if you want to make the drive from Long Beach to the LAX area. PM me for info if so.

 

[DukeNukem117]

I have some hex nuts that I want to insert into them after priming. I think I might paint them black before insertion. This is assuming the thick primer I have doesnt just fill them up completely.

I'm not sure I'll make a display panel just yet, as I think we turn these in individually. Though whenever I get it back, I think I will make something for display.

The color scheme is tentative. The primer I have is made by valspar and is very thick and white, which would probably work for the white base. I also have some car paint called "orion silver", which might be good to paint underneath certain parts so I can chip away it later during weathering.

My friend is also going to come over tuesday to help me weather. He says I should look into inserting some kitbash details into that cut-out panel in the main body. I think he is referring to "greeblies" by rpf lingo.

Any suggestions on how I should "mount" the gun for even spraying?

 

[robstyle]

For paint/primer either hang it by wire or do one side at a time. Its pending your location.

 

[DukeNukem117]

Hmmm, its a pretty heavy gun to hang by wire. I would probably need to support it at two points. Do I just go back and paint/prime over the wire area after the rest are dry?

 

[robstyle]

whatever works. You could even place it on a milk crate. Whatever works to get it propped up for an even coat. Dont over think it. I paint and primer most things in my hand with a plastic baggie wrapped around my hand or on top of a cardboard box. The thinner the paint the faster it dries and most items do not need a thick coat.

 

[DukeNukem117]

Ya, I'm probably overthinking this.

 

[DukeNukem117]

Long day working on this, so here is a little progress update:

I've primed it and is now wet-sanding it with 400grit. The primer I used is actually very white, so I think I might just leave that as the white basecoat parts.

However, I have encountered a few problems. Alot of the edges are being taken off to the material during sanding. I'm not sure if I should reprime those parts, are leave them be for weathering. I don't really know how to weather, so I don't know if I need those areas primed or not if I plan to give it the "scraped edges" look.

Another thing I noticed is that I don't have a middle parting line on the top and bottom. I can't believe I forgot this. I should have rounded the edges a bit before gluing them together, but crappy planning on my part I guess. I'm going to need to apply a thicker layer of primer on those parts, because the MDF is really absorbing the stuff. Should I try to carve a parting line out with an x-acto or dremel before or after I apply more primer?

I hope to paint the basecoat on Monday, spend tuesday weathering, and spray clear on wednesday to turn in thursday afternoon. We shall see...

 

[robstyle]

The ends or cuts on MDF is porous so it will never match the smoothed area of the acrylic or the top layer of the MDF. You can use bondo or seal it with some paint, then sand, primer and keep going. Definitely smooth the area down though. Nothings worse then doing all that leg work only to cheapen out on the finish coat.

Weathering can be simple or layered. You can do a wash with water based acrylics (the little dollar bottles of paint at Michaels) or layers of paint in various techniques. For a heavy repainted and scarred look you can use latex or Vaseline on some areas then paint over it, remove the latex or Vaseline and do it again for another layer.... Find the look you want then go from there. The layered paint with latex or Vaseline is what you would use to get a Boba Fett helmet look.

More simple methods are:

a paint pen to highlight wear areas as seen on the pistol on the bottom:

water based acrylics are easy and quick to wear and if you mess up, wash it off and start again:

I call this dry ragging where you take some spray paint applied to a cotton rag, rub it into the rag and then onto the surface your wanting to weather. It works very well if the base layer of paint is heavier than the dry rag color. The dry rag color reactivates the upper most top layer of the base coat and works itself into that layer adding depth.

Oil based stains, pretty advanced, need an airbrush, patience and some skillz. This involves advanced thought in color depth and how said colors affect each other when layered.

A combo of most of the above.