Need help PAINTING Sabastien Shaw bust

[Darthmagpie]

Hello, I have a resin Anakin(Shaw) From the ROTJ Reveal scene. The difference between white resin with the black (eyes,scar) is different than an actor with white(and black) makeup on. If that makes any sense you are ahead of me. I don't understand how to achieve this. Any help appreciated. Thanks, Ben

 

[Too Much Garlic]

<div class='quotetop'>(Darthmagpie @ Aug 28 2006, 02:00 AM) [snapback]1308158[/snapback]</div>

Hello, I have a resin Anakin(Shaw) From the ROTJ Reveal scene. The difference between white resin with the black (eyes,scar) is different than an actor with white(and black) makeup on. If that makes any sense you are ahead of me. I don't understand how to achieve this. Any help appreciated. Thanks, Ben
[/b]

I think you are going for pale, which can be achieved with lots of white, a little bit of regular skin color and a tiny touch of silver to give that pale translucent effect.

Ratio:

White - about 80 %
Flesh - about 10-15 %
Silver - about 5-10 %

But be careful with the silver as too much will ruin the effect. Only use very little.

Mix until you are happy with the color.

Have only tried this with humbrol water based paints, so am unsure whether it works with other brands.

 

[Darthmagpie]

Very interesting. This is done in a mix not in layers, correct? I would have thought a layer thing was needed but I do like this. Thank you

 

[Gigatron]

There is another way to do this. It's not as easy, but not very difficult, either.

Mix up a batch of regular skin tone (I think it's a mix of burnt sienna, burnt umber and white) and spray the entire piece. Don't worry about highlights and shading and the regular stuff. Then do the scars and wounds.

Next, get some Future floor wax and give it a coat of that (this will protect the skin tone layer), then dull it with some Testors' dull cote (a spray on dull coat). Then get some artist's makeup (LFL probably just used that pancake makeup stuff) and give a coat of that until you're happy with the result.

Theoretically, this should give the most lifelike effect. All the makeup guys did was give SS some head wounds, then painted him with white makeup.

Just an idea.

-Fred

 

[Too Much Garlic]

<div class='quotetop'>(Darthmagpie @ Aug 28 2006, 03:56 PM) [snapback]1308392[/snapback]</div>

Very interesting. This is done in a mix not in layers, correct? I would have thought a layer thing was needed but I do like this. Thank you
[/b]

Well, I think layering is over-rated, as most of the time it will end up looking "painted" and not like real skin. Though, good layering can be achieved with airbrush and very slight nuance changes and then with a wash on top of that to blend the various colors together, but you gotta know what you're doing or it will not look good.

<div class='quotetop'>(Gigatron @ Aug 28 2006, 05:28 PM) [snapback]1308431[/snapback]</div>

There is another way to do this. It's not as easy, but not very difficult, either.
Mix up a batch of regular skin tone (I think it's a mix of burnt sienna, burnt umber and white) and spray the entire piece. Don't worry about highlights and shading and the regular stuff. Then do the scars and wounds.
Next, get some Future floor wax and give it a coat of that (this will protect the skin tone layer), then dull it with some Testors' dull cote (a spray on dull coat). Then get some artist's makeup (LFL probably just used that pancake makeup stuff) and give a coat of that until you're happy with the result.
Theoretically, this should give the most lifelike effect. All the makeup guys did was give SS some head wounds, then painted him with white makeup.
Just an idea.
-Fred
[/b]

I like this idea. My vote is definitely on this approach. :thumbsup

 

[PHArchivist]

<div class='quotetop'>(NoHumorMan @ Aug 28 2006, 06:30 PM) [snapback]1308539[/snapback]</div>

<div class='quotetop'>(Darthmagpie @ Aug 28 2006, 03:56 PM) [snapback]1308392[/snapback]

Very interesting. This is done in a mix not in layers, correct? I would have thought a layer thing was needed but I do like this. Thank you
[/b]

Well, I think layering is over-rated, as most of the time it will end up looking "painted" and not like real skin. Though, good layering can be achieved with airbrush and very slight nuance changes and then with a wash on top of that to blend the various colors together, but you gotta know what you're doing or it will not look good.

[/b][/quote]

I agree with the last few words, and disagree with the first few...

Overrated...? Not at all. Its just that it seems few have the skill sets to do it right. But there ARE board members here (whom I know personally) that are absolute masters at the layering of colors, and generate results that are better than silicon.

Does this look painted...?

 

[Too Much Garlic]

<div class='quotetop'>(PHArchivist @ Aug 28 2006, 09:16 PM) [snapback]1308561[/snapback]</div>

I agree with the last few words, and disagree with the first few...
Overrated...? Not at all. Its just that it seems few have the skill sets to do it right. But there ARE board members here (whom I know personally) that are absolute masters at the layering of colors, and generate results that are better than silicon.
[/b]

Yes, I know I might have been a bit too harsh... but it takes a "professional" or experienced to do a good layering-job... but hey... they have to start somewhere too. So, if that is what is chosen as the method, then by all means: best of luck. :thumbsup

<div class='quotetop'>(PHArchivist @ Aug 28 2006, 09:16 PM) [snapback]1308561[/snapback]</div>

Does this look painted...?
[/b]

My honest opinion?

Yes. It looks painted. It's a very impressive layering-job, no doubt about it, but it still looks too "painted" to me. It's similar to many make-up jobs, where the details - veining, spots, etc. - are too visible and "exaggerated" and not subtle as with real skin tones.

Some prefer this kind of look, I just don't.

But seriously... I'm not trying to diss anyone or their methods... just expressing that I find that it's not as naturalistic as I would prefer.

 

[PHArchivist]

Not harsh at all and your last phrase nailed it -- "you gotta know what you're doing or it will not look good."

Painting busts (I think) is one of the trickiest things to do, and for me anyway, I think some of my own greatest success were beginnier's luck.

On the pic above (of my friend's work), you made some good observations, as this was a work-in-progress. There were at least one or two more steps of moderate significance to be done after this stage.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

Well, also... I know what I like, but that's no indication to how well I can achieve that myself. :lol
I'm no master painter, though, I try to do as good as possible. I am very impressed by what is shown in this forum and some of it is truly great... and beyond my capabilites atm. Much of it is layering jobs, I'd suspect.

Interesting about the picture being of a not completed paint-job. Would be interested in seeing the finished result.

 

[QuartZ]

Indeed that wasn't the last layer ...this was nearly the end:

 

[Darthmagpie]

Wow great stuff guys. Not sure which way to go. Not sure about the floor wax though. How does it go on(spray? how? brush?) Will it smear different paints? Can I use the dull coat as the protective layer? I am more familliar with that. I may try the mix idea first as it takes less time and less work. If that fails on to the more complex process. Thanks again, Ben

 

[PHArchivist]

QuartZ coached my on bust painting...

He and I use Liquitex brand acrylic paints. They come in a tube, break down with water, and blend wonderfully (think of your line between the black eyes and the whitish face). You can thin them down and apply with a brush and blend out all brush strokes, or you can airbrush them. They're found at craft stores like Michael's.

I use Testor's Clear Flat in the rattle can. Goes on very thin, dries to the touch (depending on humidity) in 5-15 minutes, and is essentially impervious to the acrylic paints (i.e. you do a layer of paint, spary the Flat, and that first layer is permenantly locked in -- you can paint right over teh Clear Flat without effecting the underlaying layer).

I've not heard of using Future for the purpose of sealing between layers. Though I am VERY familiar with Future, and do use it for many other applications. No offense to the person who suggested it, but all I see is 'negatives' with this. It will go on a bit thicker than the Testor's. It will leave less "tooth" for your next layer of paint to grab (military modelers use it prior to decaling because it leaves a wonderfully smooth surface for decals to adhere to), and it will require amonia (I believe) to clean your air brush (water will clean the brush if you use acrylics). Not to mention that you have to haul out the airbrush in the first place (opposed to a ready-to-go rattle can).

If I were to paint this subject, I'd mix my base flesh tone (which is generally too white to begin with as "tanning" coats are added later) to a point where it looks like your skin does when you peel off a band-aide. Make sure it still is "fleshy, though -- not pure white. I'd do one or two thin base coats then seal it with the Flat. Then I'd add whatever effects are needed (mottling, veining, etcetera) and seal it again. Then I'd add one or two more coats of the base flesh color, and seal it again.

At that point I'd step back, examine, study, think, ponder... Then I'd start the true art work -- finessing it, adding details, "massaging" it until its just right. Sorry this last bit is vague, but this is where subjective, artistic talent takes over and overrides the more "mechanical" or "procedural" steps.

And enjoy yourself. Bust painting is tricky, but is really fun. If you're getting frsutrated or not having fun with it, something is probably wrong. Step back and reapproach it later.

Man I want to do one of these now.

 

[Gigatron]

Future Floor Wax will shoot through your airbrush, doesn't need to be thinned and can be cleaned up with Windex. It's an acrylic wax and has no reactive chemicals that I can think of. I've never seen it react negatively with any paints.

Dull cote won't act as a sealer, it's just a matte clear spray paint. And I have seen it wreak havoc with some paints :cry .

You might be able to pick up a flat/dull/matte clear coat from some automotive/hardware stores, but it's a different animal than dull cote. It's like automotive clear coat, just without the shine.

-Fred

 

[PHArchivist]

<div class='quotetop'>(Gigatron @ Aug 29 2006, 03:19 PM) [snapback]1309089[/snapback]</div>

Future Floor Wax will shoot through your airbrush, doesn't need to be thinned and can be cleaned up with Windex. It's an acrylic wax and has no reactive chemicals that I can think of. I've never seen it react negatively with any paints.

Dull cote won't act as a sealer, it's just a matte clear spray paint. And I have seen it wreak havoc with some paints :cry .

You might be able to pick up a flat/dull/matte clear coat from some automotive/hardware stores, but it's a different animal than dull cote. It's like automotive clear coat, just without the shine.

-Fred
[/b]

Like my old man used to say, "There' more than one way to skin a cat."

Future is definitely a good sealant, and doesn't (to my knowldge) have the solvents built into it that some paints do, so there are some pluses with it.

Have faith, though -- using Testor's flat with Liquitex acrylics works perfectly. Keep in mind that the Liquitex paints do not have solvents either, so there is no chemical interaction between the Liquitex and the Testors.

Using slovent-based rattle can clear coats over other solvent-based paints (either airbrushed out of a bottle or from a rattle can) CAN -- as Fred accurately stated -- wreak havoc. Not in all cases, but it can.


On a side note, in my modeling past, I became fairly well practiced at blending oil-based paints (like Model Master) using thinner. But for the past couple of years I've been predominantly using the Liquitex, which blends like a dream. I've gotten "spoiled" by the Liquitex, and have now lost my touch with blending oil based-paints.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

<div class='quotetop'>(PHArchivist @ Aug 29 2006, 05:34 PM) [snapback]1309099[/snapback]</div>

On a side note, in my modeling past, I became fairly well practiced at blending oil-based paints (like Model Master) using thinner. But for the past couple of years I've been predominantly using the Liquitex, which blends like a dream. I've gotten "spoiled" by the Liquitex, and have now lost my touch with blending oil based-paints.
[/b]

Intrigued. Please show some of your works where you used this stuff... I'd like to see what results and look this type of paint can accomplish. Maybe start a new topic about it or something.?

 

[PHArchivist]

Just scroll up. That bust by QuartZ (and my avatar) were both done with the same paints -- Liquitex.

Did you see my Yoda? Same thing.

 

[Too Much Garlic]

<div class='quotetop'>(PHArchivist @ Aug 29 2006, 09:23 PM) [snapback]1309260[/snapback]</div>

Just scroll up. That bust by QuartZ (and my avatar) were both done with the same paints -- Liquitex.

Did you see my Yoda? Same thing.
[/b]

Don't think I did... would love to see larger pictures, if possible... please.