Lighters to collect that were used in movies

[VonMagnum]

I just bought an IMCO 4700 with no patent marks on the end cap (just says IMCO TRIPLEX on it). If legit, that has to be the 1936 model as the patent wasn't granted yet until 1937 and that's the only model Marion could have had in Raiders if the movie was real as the movie itself was supposed to take place in 1936. Of course, that doesn't mean that's what the actual movie prop was, but I wanted to have a historically accurate model in my Indy collection.

 

[VonMagnum]

This is the IMCO 4700 No Patent on the cap lighter I bought:

 

[Beery]

There was also some evidence that the 4700 was made up until at least 1961 and early 6700 models used some carry over 4700 parts later replaced (from the German lighter collector forum).

Yeah. I have a 6600 that backs that theory up - it has an insert from what I believe may be a 4700. I had assumed that someone put an old insert in post-production, but maybe this is how it was made in the first place.

Thanks for all the info. I just joined the German lighter forum (Lighterclub Deutschland) myself - I've had a resurgence of interest in my old IMCO collection, so I'm doing some serious research and acquiring some more lighters.

 

[VonMagnum]

I was watching Dark Passage with Humphrey Bogart (1947) and I spotted what appears to be a Ronson Adonis lighter very early in the movie around 19 and a half minutes in with light horizontal grooves and and empty monogram plate.

 

[VonMagnum]

It's amazing how many Adonis styles were made over the years. There's even variations to the part where the screw is near the snuff cap (some have a bit missing out of it like the above movie shot shows while others are rounded/smooth. Some have a screw on the back side and some don't and where the screw goes varies slightly, all making me wonder if some lighters had hand-made or high variation parts or whether something changed year-to-year as I think it was made for a long time. Some are Made In England and others are from Newark, NJ where Ronson was headquartered. There are sterling silver versions of both as well.

There are multiple styles with horizontal lines, but only one that's only evenly spaced horizontal lines that I've seen, which I think is the likely style used in Dark Passage above. Unfortunately, the only two I've seen with no monogram on them are in England and don't ship to the USA and if I recall correctly didn't quite match the lines of the one from the movie. There is one in the USA that is the same style with the correct lines and is also sterling silver, but it has a monogram on it (people just love to put their mark on things).

I was looking into how hard it would be to remove a monogram and it looks like it's primarily a bunch of sanding and then polishing to restore it to like new. The problem is the lighter in question is anything but "like new" looking and just doing the monogram would make it stand out like a sore thumb. The one in the movie based on the glitter as it moves is clearly brand new or darn close to it so perhaps it would be better cleaned and polished up. I wasn't really looking to spend a fortune on a sterling silver one either given I have no Dark Passage poster display in the home theater and I thought I'd be able to pick up one of these on the cheap since there's a ton of Ronson Adonis lighters out there. I could just wait until another shows up that matches the film, but it's more likely I'd forget to look after awhile.

There is another sterling silver one that's in brand new never used condition that would make a nice display model (and the owner offered to knock $30 off when he saw I put it on "watch"), but it's smaller lines interspersed with a larger clean line whereas the one in the movie looks like 24 even lines, which matches the monogrammed model that claims to be from the 1930s (Warner Brothers has a history of using lighters from the decade before in a lot of its movies, sometimes for time period historical accuracy (the Ronson Baronet in The Roaring Twenties was made in the '20s, but the movie was made in the late '30s, but then it reappears in the Maltese Falcon in 1941 in Gutman's living room as a table lighter (may not be the same lighter, of course and the cigarette box is missing in both and they're almost impossible to find now, but may have been more common back then).

Ronson was known for making a LOT of lighters so I've been consternated at how difficult it is to find one of those Baronet lighters for sale (I've been keeping an eye out for over 3 years, which is longer than it took to find a Colibri Blade Runner lighter even and I've only seen 5 known of those in collector's hands period and only one without a monogram that has the gold flat finish). It's likely in both cases, there are a lot of these out there in people's junk drawers and basements (or land fills) and simply never go for sale.

 

[Brigandia36]

I am looking for a 1974 Dodge Monaco cigarette lighter

 

[VonMagnum]

I am looking for a 1974 Dodge Monaco cigarette lighter
View attachment 1611111

Have you tried a junkyard?

 

[Brigandia36]

Have you tried a junkyard?

No car like that in France ...

 

[VonMagnum]

No car like that in France ...

I doubt it's any different from any other dodge car lighter of the period (or most car lighters in general). It was not something you wanted to accidentally drop in your lap once heated either.

 

[Beery]

This thread got me interested in re-watching Tales of the Gold Monkey, so I looked it up on Amazon and what do you know - it's currently available as a DVD box set for $27.99 - not bad for 22 one-hour episodes. Needless to say, I snapped it up, expecting the show to have aged poorly over the years. It's not exactly high art, but it's actually not bad (except perhaps for the ape costumes in the pilot).

Anyway, I'm watching the pilot today, and what do I see at the 55 minute mark but this beauty in the hands of a murderous Nazi (played by John Hillerman) - the IMCO 6700 (again posing as a 4700 - the same lighter Marion used in Raiders of the Lost Ark).

 

[VonMagnum]

This thread got me interested in re-watching Tales of the Gold Monkey, so I looked it up on Amazon and what do you know - it's currently available as a DVD box set for $27.99 - not bad for 22 one-hour episodes. Needless to say, I snapped it up, expecting the show to have aged poorly over the years. It's not exactly high art, but it's actually not bad (except perhaps for the ape costumes in the pilot).

Anyway, I'm watching the pilot today, and what do I see at the 55 minute mark but this beauty in the hands of a murderous Nazi (played by John Hillerman) - the IMCO 6700 (again posing as a 4700 - the same lighter Marion used in Raiders of the Lost Ark).

View attachment 1611719
View attachment 1611722

I'm not sure how you can tell for certain that's the 6700 when her hand is over is over the area where the button would be if it were the 4700. Otherwise, they look very similar.

As I showed on page 1, there's also a scene in the opening credits from an episode where Jake Cutter lights Louie's cigarette that shows a Dunhill trench lighter. That one you can tell even at low resolution because the top when opened hangs past vertical whereas IMCO stay straight vertical.

 

[Beery]

I'm not sure how you can tell for certain that's the 6700 when her hand is over is over the area where the button would be if it were the 4700. Otherwise, they look very similar.

The top button hole (where the button pops out when the flint assembly is raised) is a bit lower on the 4700 than the hinge rivet is on the 6700. Also, on the 4700, it's a hole in the housing, not a rivet, and there's a definite bright point there in the video, indicating a rivet. The DVD resolution is pretty bad, but you can just make out the rivet head, meaning it has to be either a 6600 or a 6700. Since the 6600 body is not much like a 4700 (so it wouldn't be a good substitute), and since 6700s and 6600s were both equally available in the '80s (as they still are now), I'm guessing the props department went with the 6700.

But for cosplay purposes, anyone doing a Tales of the Gold Monkey impression (and who valued historical accuracy) would probably want a 4700.

 

[VonMagnum]

You've got sharper eyes than mine.

 

[VonMagnum]

Beery - I got the 4700 and cleaned it up on the inside and installed new packing and a new wick, but it doesn't appear to have a working spring in it to shove the flint up to the spark wheel. I haven't been able to find any information online about how to change it or even how to eject the mechanism all the way out to get to it. Any ideas?

EDIT: Nevermind. The spring isn't terribly strong, but it does work after all. The flint just needed a little breaking in.

 

[benhs1898]

I couldn’t remember if I ever posted this but Ryan Gosling in The Nice Guys uses the Zippo 1941 replica in brass. It’s one of my favorite zippo styles.

 

[VonMagnum]

Here's my 1936 IMCO 4700 historically accurate "Marion's Lighter" for Raiders of the Lost Ark after a bit of light cleaning and with all new cotton packing and a brand new wick and flint installed. Thumbnails shown, click for closeup/slideshow.

1936 Patent Free Cap:



Lighter tank reassembled and ready to insert. Lighter body open in spring up position.




Lighter standing open with new wick installed



Lighter is Lit!



In my China Cabinet with one of my IMCO 6700 lighters and another lighter I have from 1936 and some other curios....

 

[Beery]

Looks awesome! It's funny - I was watching that lighter on eBay, and it looked in nice condition, but you never know. Glad it worked out for you. I just purchased a 4700 today. I already have one, but it's in nasty shape - doesn't even spark. The one I bought looks in very good condition - hoping for the best.

Regarding the spring mechanism, if you ever have problems with it (or if you want to clean it), you can push the button in again when it's in the top hole, then wiggle the flint housing up. There's an indentation on the lighter body opposite the top hole - this is kind of an extra stop in case the button doesn't engage the top hole. I found I can kind of just tug at the flint housing to get it past this, and it comes out. The flint spring is set into the bottom of the lighter body, so it comes loose from the flint housing when you get the flint housing out of the lighter body. Getting this back in the hole at the bottom of the flint housing is a bit tricky when re-inserting the flint housing - I use a pair of needle nose pliers to get it positioned right - eventually it pops into the hole and you can then push the flint housing into the lighter body. Don't push it down until you can see the spring moving up freely into the flint housing.

All of this might be something you don't want to do unless you're having problems with it - these old lighters can be a bit fragile, and I imagine it might be possible to mess up the spring.

 

[VonMagnum]

Beery - Thanks for the info. I was thinking it might be that indentation, but sometimes things aren't as tight afterwards if you have to fight to get it out. It didn't want to move up even pushing the button and I was afraid forcing it might screw something up.

It seems the lighter release is much stronger with a flint installed. It barely pops up without a flint, but shoots up (like I saw in a YouTube video) when the flint is in there. The flint has a tendency to want to fall out so I have to be careful. It might not be the right size, but it looks like it. I have two different flint sizes for various lighters and some expensive Dunhill brand ones.

I lightly scraped all the rust off the mechanism last night for smoother operation and it looks better. I'm going to polish the light scratches with a Dremel later. I tried cleaning up the spark wheel, but it may need some more attention. A little sharpening of the edges would probably increase the sparks as the 6700 I have lights up like a firecracker.

But after working the flint in with a bunch of starts, it almost sparks as well as the 6700 now most of the time and lights in one try probably 8/10 times now (might be a dirty spot somewhere clogging up a tooth), but it's in pretty good condition now and that triple folded wick I installed with new cotton packing (I save the cotton from vitamin/pill bottles) will probably last the rest of my life even if I used it a lot (I don't smoke so it won't, but I keep asking myself why I collect lighters...lol. I've got over 90 now in working and mostly good to mint condition including 25 Dunhills.)

I don't like how the 4700 fills compared to the 6700. Having to unscrew the top and then pour fluid in those side openings ends up being messier than just taking off the bottom and pouring it in on the 6700. I'm sure the tanks are interchangeable, but I want authenticity here.

 

[VonMagnum]

That 4700 with a new wick and packing puts out one heck of a tall flame with the adjuster/wind ring moved down. It reminds me of a Dunhill Rollagas lighter with the adjustment set to high....

I'm not sure why the lid sits at an angle above vertical, though. Other 4700s I've seen online sit flat. Nothing looks bent offhand and it sits right in the open area nicely with the lid up.

Speaking of the cap/lid, that's a pretty stiff one on it, stiffer to open/shut than any of my three 6700s. It has a nice feel to it, but I almost feel a bit nervous I'm going to burn my finger closing it as I have to put my thumb more square on it to get good leverage. It moves smooth, though.

 

[Beery]

I'm not sure why the lid sits at an angle above vertical, though. Other 4700s I've seen online sit flat. Nothing looks bent offhand and it sits right in the open area nicely with the lid up.

If you're talking about the lid when it's open, I'm not sure what that could be. Mine sits at 90 degrees.

If you're talking about the lid when it's closed, the older 4700s had two tiny lugs on either side of the cap assembly that, when you flipped the lid closed, would hit two triangular flanges on the sides of the flint housing next to the pivot point. Since these are so close to the pivot point, tolerances had to be very tight, and if they were even slightly off, the cap would sit at a weird angle on the body of the lighter. I have a 4700 like this. Later they solved the problem by adding a lip to the front of the lighter body - this method of stopping the cap was very successful and they used it on the 6700s (and the 6600s and 6800s).

Speaking of the cap/lid, that's a pretty stiff one on it, stiffer to open/shut than any of my three 6700s. It has a nice feel to it, but I almost feel a bit nervous I'm going to burn my finger closing it as I have to put my thumb more square on it to get good leverage. It moves smooth, though.

It all depends on the spring. Some are stronger than others. I also have this problem on my favorite lighter - a 6600. I've been thinking about buying another 6600 to replace it, but I haven't found one yet.