Ghostbusters: Afterlife

[Psab keel]

While I can understand the TFA comparisons I think where they diverge is that Afterlife delivered on honoring the past, partly to it's own detriment, but I'd still take that over a story that sees our beloved heroes all end up as disgraced cowards the way the ST did.

I still maintain that Afterlife needed some work, but in all it's at least a step in the right direction towards honoring continuity and respecting the fans enough to try and deliver something worth watching, even if it retread the last act of the original film. I just hope going forward they dig deeper into the supporting characters and create an original antagonist so that the new cast can truly stand on their own. My observations are not necessarily harsh criticisms so much as frustration because there was a lot to like here and I wanted more from the new people in the story which speaks to their potential as characters.

 

[ghostryder]

 

[Rogue]

I still contend that Shandor should have been the main antagonist. He has enough of a presence and history tied with the original movie to feel like a natural continuation without having to bring back Gozer. Even if Shador's goal was to summon Gozer at least it would have added some new layer to the threat. That was the point where I was rolling my eyes because it just felt like a cop out. Having the old team reunited to literally fight the same exact battle on a smaller scale is where it just felt lazy to me. Just from a writing perspective it was frustrating because they'd set up an interesting premise with Egon's estranged family and a possible new threat, so to have to revert back to an old one was just tiresome.

The idea of having Shandor's body preserved and in suspended animation was weird, but showed potential. His backstory from the original film actually lent that movie a sense of mystery and dread they could have easily capitalized on. Especially when you consider the opening sequence from Afterlife which I thought set the stage for something really spectacular. By the time Olivia Wilde showed up it kind of felt like a parody to me. So in another 10 years will Gozer show up AGAIN? I mean it's like the Death Stars. How many do we need to have?

The moment you have your heroes fighting the same antagonist 30 years after being defeated always runs the risk of being anticlimactic. I fully understand that the emotional impact was deriving itself from Phoebe trying to find her place and all, but at the least it would have given more originality to her story to have her face off with a different foe. She should have been afforded her own original antagonist rather than have to fight off her grandfather's and she was likeable enough where I thought she deserved her own.

This is really my frustration with this movie too. It did a lot of things right but it also squandered some of it's potential.

I'm still wary about undermining the experience for people yet to see it, so spoiler tags just in case!



Shandor's presence in the film is one of the things that bugged me. He invested all that time, money, and energy into building a giant temple in New York to summon Gozer, then decided to wait... in the bottom of a mine over a thousand miles away? Shandor would have his body kept in the New York temple ready to greet Gozer on their arrival and so he could hand her a city of millions to destroy as a "welcome basket".

Fighting the same antagonist can be risky, but again the narrative makes sense here. The team repelled the first attempt, but Spengler realised it took more than just closing the door to stop an ancient and ridiculously powerful entity, so he set out to end the threat for good. That works for me.

What doesn't make sense at all is why the other Ghostbusters wrote his theories off (or why he didn't explain them properly at least, they seem to suggest he kept being unnecessarily cryptic). The bad guy's name is quite literally written all over the town and the mine, the mine is the known source of material for building the New York temple, and there's another temple (not to mention a body in some kind of suspended animation) at the bottom of it. Spengler really wasn't asking them to take a leap of faith based on flimsy evidence or gut instinct; it's completely unbelievable that a short letter and two or three photographs wouldn't have convinced the rest of the team to at least investigate. Or even a 30 second phone call to be honest, can't imagine they'd need him to provide photographs to back up his eye witness account. Apparently they'll do it on the basis of a short cryptic phone call from a young girl that none of them knew existed at that point, but not on the word of a trusted colleague with proven knowledge and expertise in occult matters.

People are still arguing even now over why the Beatles split up. One or two fuzzy throw-away lines during an exposition dump doesn't really sell the audience on why Ray (of all people!) would turn his back on Egon (of all people!) because of a weird theory. I could understand the team splitting with Ray supporting and following Egon, Peter not really being interested, and Winston just keeping his head down and getting on with life. I struggle to understand how the situation in the film could come about, or at least not without inventing additional head-canon to make it work. The film needed to sell that idea but missed the mark.

It was great to see the old team together again but let's face it, they were massively wasted. Turning up at the perfect moment to save the day was just lazy, lazy cliche. They didn't really have much to do, they were just given a throw-away line or two then left to stand in the corner looking heroic and waving their wands around. I get that it's a handover film with the old guard giving the new guard their blessing, but it could have been handled without feeling so... cheap.

Also - and this REALLY, REALLY bugs me - if the traps were powerful enough to split up and suck in a god-like being along with every ghost in the area... why was Egon's ghost still there at the end?

Oh, and while we're at it, I think it would have been useful to throw in a line to explain why trapping one of the keymaster/gatekeeper pair weakened Gozer (unless they explained it and we just missed it). The person I saw it with asked a quite sensible question - "now the door's been opened and Gozer has come through, why does it matter what happens to the dog creatures?" My head-canon is that Gozer can project itself into this plane but needs a lot of bandwidth to do it. Zuul and Clortho are less powerful entities that can slip in to this plane through the smaller cracks and then act as big phat data pipes for their master. Trapping one of them essentially reduces the bandwidth and interferes with Gozer's ability to project itself into this plane.



I still loved the film and will be watching it again, just some little bits that I felt were disappointing.

 

[Lightning]

He invested all that time, money, and energy into building a giant temple in New York to summon Gozer, then decided to wait... in the bottom of a mine over a thousand miles away?

I thought that after the New York rituals failed to gather enough spiritual energy, the mine was the backup plan, with a more active way of generating spiritual energy (killing the miners). And it's a much more secure place to store your body if you don't want it to be discovered and disturbed.

Also - and this REALLY, REALLY bugs me - if the traps were powerful enough to split up and suck in a god-like being along with every ghost in the area... why was Egon's ghost still there at the end?

People keep bringing this up and I don't see the issue. You have to be quite close to a trap for it to suck in a ghost. Otherwise you could just aim a trap at a ghost, no proton stream needed. Anyway, Egon and the rest of the Ghostbusters are simply standing outside the buried trap grid. I may need to watch it again but I don't remember it sucking in other ghosts that didn't enter the grid.

 

[Rogue]

I thought that after the New York rituals failed to gather enough spiritual energy, the mine was the backup plan, with a more active way of generating spiritual energy (killing the miners). And it's a much more secure place to store your body if you don't want it to be discovered and disturbed.



People keep bringing this up and I don't see the issue. You have to be quite close to a trap for it to suck in a ghost. Otherwise you could just aim a trap at a ghost, no proton stream needed. Anyway, Egon and the rest of the Ghostbusters are simply standing outside the buried trap grid. I may need to watch it again but I don't remember it sucking in other ghosts that didn't enter the grid.

I can see where the first point is coming from, but I was under the impression that the miners were sacrificed after their job was finished (which may well have been before the building was complete). I see the mine as a temple that was used while waiting for the city temple to be completed. Shandor very much strikes me as a "posh city temple" kind of guy and there was already a concealed part of the building that could house the body.

They also had an idea of when Gozer could return. The New York temple appears to have been built between the 1908 and 1945 dates, so I could see the argument that they failed in 1945 so decided to try the mine... but the 1984 event happened in New York and I reckon they would have expected that. I still think he would have seen a city filled with millions of people as giving the best chance of collecting and channeling the necessary energy.

As to the second point, that might benefit from a re-watch because I may have mis-remembered. I am fairly certain they cut to a shot showing ghosts from a wider area being sucked towards the farm. If that's taken out of the equation then I'm happier conceding on the second point.

 

[QuinnMallory]

The Game is better than new film and will always be Ghostbusters 3 to me

I've been sort of out of the loop. How did ghostbusters fans receive the new movie? I thought it was actually pretty awful, but it's engineered to pander to fans so I wouldn't be surprised if people loved it.

 

[Nightwing Returns]

I've been sort of out of the loop. How did ghostbusters fans receive the new movie? I thought it was actually pretty awful, but it's engineered to pander to fans so I wouldn't be surprised if people loved it.

Pandering is something I'm not a fan of. Like, "I'll be back" in every Terminator is a big eyeroll and that's how this movie felt to a degree.

 

[Halliwax]

I've been sort of out of the loop. How did ghostbusters fans receive the new movie? I thought it was actually pretty awful, but it's engineered to pander to fans so I wouldn't be surprised if people loved it.

right there with ya buddy

 

[Rogue]

I've been sort of out of the loop. How did ghostbusters fans receive the new movie? I thought it was actually pretty awful, but it's engineered to pander to fans so I wouldn't be surprised if people loved it.

While I do enjoy an occasional bit of pandering, recognising that and putting it aside I still thought it was a very enjoyable film that was competently made on a budget. 10 minutes extra runtime to throw in a few extra scenes to explain things/set them up for later would have been a great investment though.

For example, they could have a scene where the kids find some big-ass scary ugly spider/critter of some sort. Everyone else jumps around screaming. Phoebe is clearly nervous but takes a deep breath, picks it up, stares at it curiously, and puts it in a jar. Establish that her scientific curiosity outweighs her fear. That way, when the later spooky events happen you're not wondering why she's rolls with it when other people would be freaking out, because you've already seen that character trait through the more relatable analogue of the spider/critter scene.

 

[Kylash]

I mean there is her line of "over-stimulation calms me" but yes it would have been better to see it demonstrated.

 

[Paul Andrew]

We just got out of the theater and both really enjoyed it. No deep dives or nitpicking, just had fun.

 

[Psab keel]

I thought that was a really strange choice to have her say that. I mean I guess it does give more credence to the idea that she wouldn't react to seeing strange things, but it's also not exactly relatable considering 98% of people get anxiety when being overloaded with information or stimuli. I guess it was a way to try to explain that she's not like most people, but it felt like a stretch.

I did find it really, really hard to believe that barely anyone reacted to seeing ghosts. Like hardly a reaction at all. It pulled me right out of the movie.

 

[CB2001]

I thought that was a really strange choice to have her say that. I mean I guess it does give more credence to the idea that she wouldn't react to seeing strange things, but it's also not exactly relatable considering 98% of people get anxiety when being overloaded with information or stimuli. I guess it was a way to try to explain that she's not like most people, but it felt like a stretch.

I did find it really, really hard to believe that barely anyone reacted to seeing ghosts. Like hardly a reaction at all. It pulled me right out of the movie.

Or... Just tossing this out there... She inherited Egon's semi-emotional stability. I mean, most of the time in the first film, Egon was mostly calm. We know she got Egon's sudden outbursts of anger (as we see when she tries to use the Proton Pack as a weapon but is stopped by her mom, much like how Egon had his sudden outburst against Peck). I could be wrong.

 

[Psab keel]

I mean I guess it works. Egon was socially awkward at times and she was a lot like him, thus the way she related to him and his work. I just thought it was a weird way to explain it.

 

[Halliwax]

I thought that was a really strange choice to have her say that. I mean I guess it does give more credence to the idea that she wouldn't react to seeing strange things, but it's also not exactly relatable considering 98% of people get anxiety when being overloaded with information or stimuli. I guess it was a way to try to explain that she's not like most people, but it felt like a stretch.

I did find it really, really hard to believe that barely anyone reacted to seeing ghosts. Like hardly a reaction at all. It pulled me right out of the movie.

Or... Just tossing this out there... She inherited Egon's semi-emotional stability. I mean, most of the time in the first film, Egon was mostly calm. We know she got Egon's sudden outbursts of anger (as we see when she tries to use the Proton Pack as a weapon but is stopped by her mom, much like how Egon had his sudden outburst against Peck). I could be wrong.

I just figured she was on the spectrum, and that’s why they kept pushing the dry jokes

 

[Lightning]

I thought that was a really strange choice to have her say that. I mean I guess it does give more credence to the idea that she wouldn't react to seeing strange things, but it's also not exactly relatable considering 98% of people get anxiety when being overloaded with information or stimuli. I guess it was a way to try to explain that she's not like most people, but it felt like a stretch.

Or... Just tossing this out there... She inherited Egon's semi-emotional stability. I mean, most of the time in the first film, Egon was mostly calm. We know she got Egon's sudden outbursts of anger (as we see when she tries to use the Proton Pack as a weapon but is stopped by her mom, much like how Egon had his sudden outburst against Peck). I could be wrong.

case in point: "I'm sorry, Venkman. I'm terrified beyond the capacity for rational thought." Outwardly he's perfectly composed.

 

[JediMichael]

I enjoyed the over all theme of this, but there were definitely some issues.
I love when things can be nostalgic, but this movie did play very heavy on that, and that Harold Ramis is gone.
The little things I have read without actually spoiling really too much, I pretty much figured how the movie would probably play out, and I was right.
It was nice to see the original gang again, but I knew they were going to conveniently show up at the right time.
One thing I wonder, as far as I can remember, every single ghost has always been bad that the team wants/needs to stop and capture, so why was Egon good and helpful?
It felt like he was the jedi of ghosts all of a sudden.
I do hope they make another and can flesh out these characters some more with new ideas.....no evil paintings......

 

[CB2001]

Here's a BTS video which shows that there was a little bit "extra" for some scenes that got trimmed down a bit.

 

[Halliwax]

Here's a BTS video which shows that there was a little bit "extra" for some scenes that got trimmed down a bit.

Thank you for sharing, I love stuff like this

 

[Halliwax]

We recently learned all the traps in the dirt field were spirit traps, all rigged to open at once, but then all 100+ traps needed to be closed manually and recovered in dirt

The original crews packs were dressed up in gb2 fashion

The new red “switch me on switch” was added because of the hotel elevator scene from gb1 BUT there was a miss understanding when building the 20 plus packs, they ended up having the switch under the crank box in the wrong location

On set very last minute they made the new switch under the ion arm, and it actually is the main power switch for the pack which made it very convenient for them to turn them on and off

McKenna graces hands were so small she couldn’t active the fire button on the practical thrower, so there is a tactile switch hidden in front of the rear grip that she uses to fire it

Benofkent’s ghost sniffer is in the house

Throwing chickens gigameter is in the underground bunker under the wall of framed degrees

4 rubber traps were made for the truck roll scene because the real traps are solid aluminum weighing almost 7 lbs

Frank ippolito was hired to make (I think 4) rubber stunt packs very last minute for when the OG crew get slammed into the ecto (even the Alice frames were rubber, and am told it’s a engineering masterpiece how he cast these)

One of the RC traps was run over by the ecto 1 and destroyed