The Matrix 4!

[Bloop]

ld have liked to see a more experienced actor in that role. Michele Yeoh maybe.

No offense to you, but I'm really confused why people think Michelle Yeoh is a good actress. Is it the wire-work and fight scenes she did in Crouching Tiger? I don't think her acting ability is good at all. I haven't seen her in much, but she's terrible on Star Trek: Discovery. Granted, the character she plays is written cartoonishly, but she plays it poorly, in my opinion. The only thing she succeeds at is making me not like a character that's intended to be unlikable, but it's also because I don't believe her characterization of the role. I cringe every time she's on screen.

 

[Bloop]

Now that some have suggested that this is the last Jedi of the matrix, I can’t help but get mad. I turned it on for a second watch but once it cut to keanu tapping on his keyboard, I turned it off and started watching the original.

I have this conspiracy after watching Netflix Cowboy Bebop. I was about halfway through that series and was realizing that it’s almost not worth watching and rewatching the anime would be a better use of my time. And lo and behold, it is a recommended title next to the live action, to which you might say “duh, obviously”. But it sparked a thought, what if the reboot isn’t about making a good end product necessarily, because they don’t care. If the reboot is bad, you’d naturally end up rewatching the original which happens to be on Netflix, they win. If the reboot is good, that might just be a happy accident, they win. As far as streaming goes, if they own streaming right to old material then they can’t lose.

I would argue that all the Hollywood studios are in the game of making content that isn't original, just making and remaking things that people are already familiar with and like. Look at Disney. How many truly original movies and shows have they made in the past couple decades? They do live-action remakes of their own popular animated movies, they make more and more Star Wars and Marvel content, which is based on existing properties. It's all just big corporations trying to make big money with lower risk. An original concept is an unknown, but making movies and shows based on people's nostalgia and love of certain properties is the safer bet. Also, they can get the people that fondly remember these movies, comics and cartoons from their youth to see "new" content based on those properties, while also introducing the properties to the fans' children. It's the "4 quadrant" model of marketing.

That said, there can be original ideas implemented into existing properties. Or even if it's not original, sometimes a well-executed story based on an existing one can be successful from a critical point of view. But there's a reason we keep seeing existing properties being redone over and over. It's easier than taking a risk on original properties.

 

[CB2001]

I couldn't get half way through with this film. I stopped at the point where Neo turns up at Trinity's motorcycle shop. I just couldn't connect with the characters or the situation.

I will say this: I think Lana purposefully made this film in order to tank the franchise. I mean, look at the scenes with Thomas at work. He didn't want to do "another Matrix", but Warner Brothers is forcing him to do it. So, Lana decided to try to tank the franchise as best as she could to keep the franchise dead. It certainly seems like the case. And she's pretty much gone on record as stating that Warner Brothers approached her MULTIPLE times over the years for another Matrix film.

 

[Malibu139]

No where near as groundbreaking or epic as the first.
So much better than either sequel.

For me the premise was good and unexpected( i went in spoiler free).
The callbacks didn’t feel as heavy handed as I though they would be.

The score and music were so bad, it was continual “ caper tension music “ for 2 hours.

It was a fun ride that i probably won’t take again.

 

[PoopaPapaPalps]

John Wick on the other hand is Bold Fresh and very repeatable viewing wise so its not an age thing.
Was the Stunt guy who makes those movies involved in this.... I am thinking not.

Funny enough, that's only half-true. The guy that plays "Chad" in this? That's the stunt-double for Keanu in the Matrix and its sequels, and the director of John Wick, Chad Stahelski.

 

[The Sweatshop]

I couldn't get half way through with this film. I stopped at the point where Neo turns up at Trinity's motorcycle shop. I just couldn't connect with the characters or the situation.

I will say this: I think Lana purposefully made this film in order to tank the franchise. I mean, look at the scenes with Thomas at work. He didn't want to do "another Matrix", but Warner Brothers is forcing him to do it. So, Lana decided to try to tank the franchise as best as she could to keep the franchise dead. It certainly seems like the case. And she's pretty much gone on record as stating that Warner Brothers approached her MULTIPLE times over the years for another Matrix film.

Honestly I wish that I left at that bike scene. I don’t know how I feel about Lana potentially tanking it. As a fan, of course I want more and more good matrix films, but the wachowskis shouldn’t be treated as slaves to the studio. I think I can be fine with this being the last bad matrix film if no more are forced into existence.

 

[CB2001]

Honestly I wish that I left at that bike scene. I don’t know how I feel about Lana potentially tanking it. As a fan, of course I want more and more good matrix films, but the wachowskis shouldn’t be treated as slaves to the studio. I think I can be fine with this being the last bad matrix film if no more are forced into existence.

It's understandable. However, I've recently heard that according to Jonathan Groff, Lana sat through meetings similar to the scene we see with Thomas (the creator of the game) hearing from fellow game programmers, what they think The Matrix is about. However, considering that it's reported that Warner Brothers bothered the Wachowskis for years about doing a sequel, I wouldn't be surprised if the scene where Thomas is told by Smith that Warner Brothers wanted another Matrix game is lifted directly from real life (replace game with film, and it definitely sounds like something a studio would say: "Make another Matrix film or we'll do one without you."). It's not the first time a studio has done that. And it'd make sense that the Wachowskis were tired of Warner Brothers pestering them and just wanted to make more projects that were not Matrix related (this would explain why Lilly didn't have any involvement with the film as well).

It just seems like the Wachowskis have tried to do projects after the Matrix films that were not commercial successes. And Warner Brothers breathing down their necks for years about another Matrix film, because of how popular they were, it's understandable if there's some creator backlash subtext in the film. I mean, even Prince hated working with Warner Brothers after signing with them (and it's also the reason why he changed his name from Prince to the symbol he used for a while, because he felt that his name was no longer his and Warner Brothers owned it). But, I could very well be wrong on my assumptions.

 

[The Sweatshop]

It's understandable. However, I've recently heard that according to Jonathan Groff, Lana sat through meetings similar to the scene we see with Thomas (the creator of the game) hearing from fellow game programmers, what they think The Matrix is about. However, considering that it's reported that Warner Brothers bothered the Wachowskis for years about doing a sequel, I wouldn't be surprised if the scene where Thomas is told by Smith that Warner Brothers wanted another Matrix game is lifted directly from real life (replace game with film, and it definitely sounds like something a studio would say: "Make another Matrix film or we'll do one without you."). It's not the first time a studio has done that. And it'd make sense that the Wachowskis were tired of Warner Brothers pestering them and just wanted to make more projects that were not Matrix related (this would explain why Lilly didn't have any involvement with the film as well).

It just seems like the Wachowskis have tried to do projects after the Matrix films that were not commercial successes. And Warner Brothers breathing down their necks for years about another Matrix film, because of how popular they were, it's understandable if there's some creator backlash subtext in the film. I mean, even Prince hated working with Warner Brothers after signing with them (and it's also the reason why he changed his name from Prince to the symbol he used for a while, because he felt that his name was no longer his and Warner Brothers owned it). But, I could very well be wrong on my assumptions.

Yep definitely felt that the honesty through the film. Deep down I’m wondering if it’s less of the Captain going down with the sinking ship, but rather Warner bros threatened to hire a new captain, and Lana is like “hell no not happening, I’ll sink my own ship so the desire for matrix sequels is gone and I can leave the original fans with my original work.” Imagine trying to replace George Lucas before giving him 4billion. I’d burn the whole thing down. I’m sure I’m way too close to the movie and I need to think rewatch it when it’s not so fresh. One great thing this movie does perfectly is make me rewatch the old movies, I’m even treating myself to some props on Etsy just to make myself feel better.

 

[Mottrex]

But the car made that whole scene!!!

By the way, I was coughing I was laughing so hard when I read this

You hit the nail on the Head!

 

[Mottrex]

Prince hated working with Warner Brothers after signing with them (and it's also the reason why he changed his name from Prince to the symbol he used for a while, because he felt that his name was no longer his and Warner Brothers owned it). But, I could very well be wrong on my assumptions.

I seem to remember the story going WB asked him to write a song for Batman and he came back with an Album of tracks and got miffed when they or Mr Burton wouldn't use them. This was pre internet and it was printed in a local rag newspaper

( how us oldies used to get our news )

Its prolly online now somewhere

 

[CB2001]

I seem to remember the story going WB asked him to write a song for Batman and he came back with an Album of tracks and got miffed when they or Mr Burton wouldn't use them. This was pre internet and it was printed in a local rag newspaper

( how us oldies used to get our news )

Its prolly online now somewhere

I actually heard that due to the fact he was working with Warner Brothers, he was over producing material in order to get out of his contract, with Warner Brothers rejecting a lot of the material (in fact, one of his later albums he tried to release as two separate albums at the same time, but WB refused to do so and instead released it as one album with two discs, with some of the songs cut). Him coming back with an album of tracks when asked to do one song for Batman sounds consistent with that information.

 

[Mottrex]

The first one was. It's been going downhill ever since. We'll have to see with 4.

I enjoyed the camaraderie of JW3 with Winston's continued interaction and lightning quips and we finally got Charon to be more than a concierge!
(Loved him in Fringe) but I digress..

 

[Mottrex]

Funny enough, that's only half-true. The guy that plays "Chad" in this? That's the stunt-double for Keanu in the Matrix and its sequels, and the director of John Wick, Chad Stahelski.

Yes I know my poor use of grammar.. I meant was Chad involved in This Matrix movie..

 

[Mottrex]

I would argue that all the Hollywood studios are in the game of making content that isn't original, just making and remaking things that people are already familiar with and like. Look at Disney. How many truly original movies and shows have they made in the past couple decades? They do live-action remakes of their own popular animated movies, they make more and more Star Wars and Marvel content, which is based on existing properties. It's all just big corporations trying to make big money with lower risk. An original concept is an unknown, but making movies and shows based on people's nostalgia and love of certain properties is the safer bet. Also, they can get the people that fondly remember these movies, comics and cartoons from their youth to see "new" content based on those properties, while also introducing the properties to the fans' children. It's the "4 quadrant" model of marketing.

That said, there can be original ideas implemented into existing properties. Or even if it's not original, sometimes a well-executed story based on an existing one can be successful from a critical point of view. But there's a reason we keep seeing existing properties being redone over and over. It's easier than taking a risk on original properties.

And not forgetting keeping hold of a franchise licence by making a quick..
Sequel
Direct to Video
Cartoon
Video game
At least it used to work that way..

 

[Cephus]

I enjoyed the camaraderie of JW3 with Winston's continued interaction and lightning quips and we finally got Charon to be more than a concierge!
(Loved him in Fringe) but I digress..

I didn't say there weren't some parts to like, but the whole thing went completely off the rails once absolutely everyone on the planet was an assassin and the High Table essentially rules the world. I think it was another one of those franchises where they had absolutely no clue what to do after the first movie became successful and just went for absurd over intelligent.

 

[Bigdaddy]

After rewatching the 1-3 last week my curiosity got the better of me..... I'm convinced they should have just stopped after the first movie. Every installment got more convoluted but this made no sense and was such an obvious cash grab, complete trash.
This pretty much sums it up.

 

[Mottrex]

I didn't say there weren't some parts to like, but the whole thing went completely off the rails once absolutely everyone on the planet was an assassin and the High Table essentially rules the world. I think it was another one of those franchises where they had absolutely no clue what to do after the first movie became successful and just went for absurd over intelligent.

I agree on the whole High Table arc and the Silly Desert part..

Those Albanian ? Dogs were Awesome and quite scary in equal measures...

 

[Cephus]

I agree on the whole High Table arc and the Silly Desert part..

Those Albanian ? Dogs were Awesome and quite scary in equal measures...

I think the problem they had, and this applies to the Matrix movies too, just to keep it on topic, is that they made one movie and didn't expect it to blow up and then when the studio insists they make a sequel, they have no clue what to do. They just make it bigger with more explosions and more action and the story goes entirely sideways. John Wick could have gotten better if they'd has a plan up front, just like the Matrix could have been. Instead, look at what we got. Terrible stories, absurd characters and catering to the lowest common denominator.

 

[stussy]

Those Albanian ? Dogs were Awesome and quite scary in equal measures...

Belgian Malinois

 

[Mottrex]

I think the problem they had, and this applies to the Matrix movies too, just to keep it on topic, is that they made one movie and didn't expect it to blow up and then when the studio insists they make a sequel, they have no clue what to do. They just make it bigger with more explosions and more action and the story goes entirely sideways. John Wick could have gotten better if they'd has a plan up front, just like the Matrix could have been. Instead, look at what we got. Terrible stories, absurd characters and catering to the lowest common denominator.

I don't think JW has slipped half as far as The Matrix has, You can't say the the Action scenes are dull or that the music doesn't pump your gears in JW.. Maybe I am easily pleased ( I do have a thing for trashy 70s SciFi )
The New Matrix biggest problem for me was the horrible ""Sunset Glow" which seems to be the default look of a lot of current movies, No Time To Die suffers badly with this oversaturation look too with over the top white glare suffer from this..
I love my movies crisp clean not what looks like the old vaseline round the lense trick which seems the norm too.
JW doesn't pretend to have a Checkov level of plot but The Matrix Had built up what Was a multilevel Universe with all manner of plots subplots twists and turns which got jettisoned in the first five minutes of this movie rushed into production as basically an HBO TV movie of the week...

Anyway thats my take I'm off for a mulled cocktail