Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Pre-release)

Solo4114 · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Yeah, I remember first seeing it a little after Saving Pvt. Ryan came out. That film brought in a bunch of the "documentary style" look to films, even though I figured they were doing it more to create a visceral, confusing effect in battle.

It made sense kind of as an artistic choice, but now people do it without thinking about why.

niennumb1 · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

The Terminator said:
He didn't come up with that, don't give the man credit he doesn't deserve
Even Attack of the Clones got that quick zoom thingy

Okay I'll give ya that one, haha! He definitely didn't invent that shot, but he's sure known for overusing it these days.

The Terminator · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

niennumb1 said:
Okay I'll give ya that one, haha! He definitely didn't invent that shot, but he's sure known for overusing it these days.

He is overusing nothing BUT crap these days, look at Man of Steel, crap from start to da finish! Ain't no hope for Supes when Snyder is in charge

I seriously hoping for Benman/Batfleck to not only beat Superman, but to wipe him out and get back to an at least decent Superman film.

seelsa73 · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Lutso said:
JD said:

Not enough lens flare and no one was doing a "space jump."

Click to expand...

That joke hasn't gotten old yet, why stop now right?

I beg to differ.

Scratchy · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Okay, you guys have 255 pages on this thread, so please forgive me if I don't read it all just to answer my question. I've heard rumour and speculation that models would be used for filming, added with the CGI. I also heard rumour and speculation of a full scale Millennium Falcon being constructed for the live action shots.
Now my question....

Has anyone heard if a new Studio Scale Millennium Falcon filming model will be built for SW7?
I think it stands that the original filming models are past their use, due to age. Although quit possible, they could be used after a much needed restoration.

Edwardowan · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

I'm just speculating here but George retained ownership of the archives and I find it unlikely he will loan anything out to be used for the new films. some of it goes out on tour (and you would be surprised at how many of those props on tour are actually fan made and otherwise non-screen used props) And as you say age and condition could be an issue. Now, I say this because a new R2D2 is being built for E7 (by two R2 Builder club members hired for their experience, skill and knowledge) and if GL was going to loan out props you'd think since he has around 16 r2D2s from the past films at least one of those could have been sent restored for use just as they restored a few for use in the prequels. (ILM also built one droid for filming Phantom menace.) so if george is making them build a new R2 then I would imagine they will have to build all new stuff period.

Scratchy said:
Okay, you guys have 255 pages on this thread, so please forgive me if I don't read it all just to answer my question. I've heard rumour and speculation that models would be used for filming, added with the CGI. I also heard rumour and speculation of a full scale Millennium Falcon being constructed for the live action shots.
Now my question....

Has anyone heard if a new Studio Scale Millennium Falcon filming model will be built for SW7?
I think it stands that the original filming models are past their use, due to age. Although quit possible, they could be used after a much needed restoration.

Ronan87 · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

The Terminator said:
and I got screwed up for life! I can no longer watch a horror film..... and get scared. Totally sucks butt

Then do what i and a lot of people did, switch to Asian horror movies... especially what the Japanese are coming up with.

Makes anything Hollywood made look like a flick for kids...

You'll never look back or waste money in the theater for the latest 'horror movie' :lol

Bryancd · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Scratchy said:
Has anyone heard if a new Studio Scale Millennium Falcon filming model will be built for SW7?
I think it stands that the original filming models are past their use, due to age. Although quit possible, they could be used after a much needed restoration.

No, only the comments the production team has made about wanting to use both practical and CG effects. TPM used a lot of model work as computer work, a nice combination that created visually probably the most beautiful looking SW film regardless of what one might think off the film itself. I would be cautious, however, in managing expectations about how much practical models are going to be used. Yes they look great but are far more expensive then CG and films do have budgets.

Edwardowan · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

agreed. While they say they will use more practical props and sets there will still be more CGI than most want to believe there will be. (CGI keeps getting better.)
I look through Cinefex visual effects magazine and it is mind blowing what is actually CGI in films that I had thought was practical effect and location. While a lot of CGI is noticeable so much more isn't noticeable at all... people shouldn't be so dismissive of CGI these days. A lot has changed even since ROTS. My feeling is real props, real droids interacting with actors on real locations and sets but I would bet if there are extra ships or droids in the background those will be inserted with CGI. And if R2 is expected to reveal one of his swiss army knife gizmos I wouldn't put it past production to just add it in with CGI. The thing is George Lucas went overboard and put a bad taste in our mouths.. too much is not a good thing.. .but use it subtly and sparingly where it counts with real sets, location and props the CGI is a valid and unnoticeable special effect. and that is what I think they meant by less CGI for the next film.

Bryancd said:
No, only the comments the production team has made about wanting to use both practical and CG effects. TPM used a lot of model work as computer work, a nice combination that created visually probably the most beautiful looking SW film regardless of what one might think off the film itself. I would be cautious, however, in managing expectations about how much practical models are going to be used. Yes they look great but are far more expensive then CG and films do have budgets.

Bryancd · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Edwardowan said:
agreed. While they say they will use more practical props and sets there will still be more CGI than most want to believe there will be. (CGI keeps getting better.)
I look through Cinefex visual effects magazine and it is mind blowing what is actually CGI in films that I had thought was practical effect and location. While a lot of CGI is noticeable so much more isn't noticeable at all... people shouldn't be so dismissive of CGI these days. A lot has changed even since ROTS. My feeling is real props, real droids interacting with actors on real locations and sets but I would bet if there are extra ships or droids in the background those will be inserted with CGI. And if R2 is expected to reveal one of his swiss army knife gizmos I wouldn't put it past production to just add it in with CGI. The thing is George Lucas went overboard and put a bad taste in our mouths.. too much is not a good thing.. .but use it subtly and sparingly where it counts with real sets, location and props the CGI is a valid and unnoticeable special effect. and that is what I think they meant by less CGI for the next film.

Agreed back at 'ya.

And from what we have seen, they have enlisted the R2 Builders Club to make a practical R2 for the films, a very good sign of their commitment to that. But story requirements and cost might mean some CG as well. People, and when I say people I mean all of us SW fans over the age of 35, need to accept that we are NEVER going back to the late 70's early '80's and the heyday of model shops, as much as we cherish them.

Lutso · Mar 25, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Bryancd said:
TPM used a lot of model work as computer work, a nice combination that created visually probably the most beautiful looking SW film regardless of what one might think off the film itself.

Agreed. I've never heard anyone besides myself admit this.

The Terminator · Mar 26, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Ronan87 said:
Then do what i and a lot of people did, switch to Asian horror movies... especially what the Japanese are coming up with.

Makes anything Hollywood made look like a flick for kids...

You'll never look back or waste money in the theater for the latest 'horror movie' :lol

:lol

Um I have watched several japanese films and never did finish a single one(!). I either get bored out of my mind and/or almost fall sleep... they do less than nothing to me

Like after I saw the Grudge(us version, didn't like it at all) I found out it was a remake so I checked out the original and enjoyed it even less. Also subtitles for the win, HATE, haaate dubbing

Lutso said:
Agreed. I've never heard anyone besides myself admit this.

Add me to the list then

I'm also a firm believer that CGI can't do everything, so the more REAL you have in a shot will determine how good it looks. At least this is what I thought until I recently saw Gravity. I am now a firm believer of not-a-damn-thing :lol

airair · Mar 26, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

I wonder if Billy Dee Williams is in this. I'll probably be off to meet him at the London Comic Con along with Palpatine!

Solo4114 · Mar 26, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Bryancd said:
Agreed back at 'ya. And from what we have seen, they have enlisted the R2 Builders Club to make a practical R2 for the films, a very good sign of their commitment to that. But story requirements and cost might mean some CG as well. People, and when I say people I mean all of us SW fans over the age of 35, need to accept that we are NEVER going back to the late 70's early '80's and the heyday of model shops, as much as we cherish them.

I don't think we even really NEED to go back to the model shop era, necessarily. But what is needed is care and attention to detail in the use of CGI, especially with respect to lighting. The problem with green screen rooms and CGI is that it is all too often improperly lit, which makes it look fake (in a way that models didn't look fake). Some CGI is great, but poorly done CGI is, well, poor. I'd hope we see more movement towards detailed, well-done CGI.

I also think that it's really important for actors to have actual models and sets to work with, even if you're gonna greenscreen background stuff in. A tennis ball on a stick isn't enough.

The Terminator · Mar 26, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Solo4114 said:
I also think that it's really important for actors to have actual models and sets to work with, even if you're gonna greenscreen background stuff in. A tennis ball on a stick isn't enough.

Exactly, do what they did on Gravity. After having seen the BTS stuff I may not love the film but the work put into it, WOW, love that.

ghostryder · Mar 26, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Nothing really new, but interesting reading:

https://news.yahoo.com/star-wars-plot-revealed-094500060--politics.html

Zombie_61 · Mar 26, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Solo4114 said:
...A tennis ball on a stick isn't enough.

Yeah, but Lucas cast Hayden Christensen, so the other actors had to work with him.

Jeyl · Mar 27, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Zombie_61 said:
Yeah, but Lucas cast Hayden Christensen, so the other actors had to work with him.

Funny story. If you listen to the commentaries on Episodes II and III, the effects crew did some digital tinkering of their own on Hayden to make him more lively, even during the emotional scenes.

mkstewartesq · Mar 27, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

Zombie_61 said:
Yeah, but Lucas cast Hayden Christensen, so the other actors had to work with him.

Actually, I take some issue with this laying of blame on Hayden. He showed real acting chops prior to AOTC - watch "Shattered Glass" for instance, which came out pre-AOTC. I remember Rolling Stone stated that his performance was "a revelation". Heck, Natalie Portman was wooden like piece of lumber in the SW films too, and she got an Oscar for Best Actress in 2011. So I have to chalk their performances up, in very large part, to very poor directing by a man who, by his own admission as well as reputation, just isn't really any good at working with actors. Throw in the veritable stimulation-deprivation of having to work against a green screen without any real-world input atmosphere to play off of or draw inspiration from, and I'm pretty sure Olivier himself would have had a problem delivering the goods.

M

Riceball · Mar 27, 2014

Re: Star Wars Episode VII

mkstewartesq said:
Actually, I take some issue with this laying of blame on Hayden. He showed real acting chops prior to AOTC - watch "Shattered Glass" for instance, which came out pre-AOTC. I remember Rolling Stone stated that his performance was "a revelation". Heck, Natalie Portman was wooden like piece of lumber in the SW films too, and she got an Oscar for Best Actress in 2011. So I have to chalk their performances up, in very large part, to very poor directing by a man who, by his own admission as well as reputation, just isn't really any good at working with actors. Throw in the veritable stimulation-deprivation of having to work against a green screen without any real-world input atmosphere to play off of or draw inspiration from, and I'm pretty sure Olivier himself would have had a problem delivering the goods.

M

I agree, I don't know about Hayden but I've seen Natalie Portman in things prior to and post PT and she was very good in those films. I thought that it was really telling how a first time director, Zach Braff, got a much better performance out of Natalie Portman then a "seasoned" director like Lucas. Considering that Lucas hadn't directed a thing in decades prior to taking the helm of the PT I guess that it's no surprise that the performances of some of his actors were so poor, add to that the fact that they often had to act on a green screen set to tennis balls on sticks it would have taken a miracle (or a combination of award winning directors with an award winning cast) to have gotten a good performance out of the cast. If Lucas wasn't so arrogant he would have either a) realized that he's rusty and produced a couple of small movies prior to The Phantom Menace for practice, or b) hired another director to do the directing like he did for Empire & Jedi.

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