More details on the Vader ROTJ saber - Please archive

Discussion in 'Star Wars Costumes and Props' started by Brevin Din-Shay, Apr 27, 2003.

  1. Brevin Din-Shay

    Brevin Din-Shay Well-Known Member

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    Edit: At this point, I believe we're past the original question I asked. [​IMG]

    ====================

    Hi all,

    I'm wondering what the majority of you feel is the "correct" way to have the finish on this prop look...

    It has been popularly speculated that Vader's ROTJ saber was a replated Graflex. Whether chrome or nickel, nobody has a clue.

    Here's that famous SW to Indy pic:

    [​IMG]


    My question/discussion topic isn't about the plating. Instead, it is about what you feel would be more accurate.

    Would you replate the saber (whatever metal, doesn't matter) and then scratch it up a bit with a piece of Scotch-Brite?


    I realize everyone has a personal preference when it comes to this saber, but this question seems to be a constant. I just wanted to "test the waters," so to speak. [​IMG]


    Later all!

    **This thread is dedicated to Wada Yado, my biggest mentor and (from my viewpoint, along with many others) the greatest Darth Vader ROTJ lightsaber student/builder/teacher of all time**
     
  2. 7-11 Jedi

    7-11 Jedi Well-Known Member

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    I was always under the impression that they just wrapped some chrome or aluminum tape around it to make it a little shinier and just cut out the holes for all the goodies.

    Cheers!

    Mike
     
  3. Sporak

    Sporak Sr Member Gone but not forgotten.

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    I have one of Biskit's tops...In my opinion it's PERFECT for one of these...

    Yes it absolutely seems brighter than most Graflex's we've seen...

    Now here's a thought though.
    I've seen several real graflexes and every one of them has a slightly different shine on them depending on age or whatever...
    Also, we don't have a clear color shot of Lukes Graflex, at least not as clear as we do the converted one for the Vader...

    Well...What if Lukes was actually this shiny? or at least the one they reused for the Vader? Could it just be either a newly plated mint shell? Or a well worn and polished piece?

    Anyway...I would go with a newly plated Nickel finish, without the brushing. Let time and handling add the wear on it...This is the one to hand people when they want to see one [​IMG]
     
  4. Ghost Host

    Ghost Host Sr Member

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    I have a feeling that "they" tried to give the Graflex a shiny MPP finish, and just polished it up on a buffing wheel. I'd be surprised if they had it replated, or whatever.
     
  5. LiquidPhoenix

    LiquidPhoenix Well-Known Member

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    Well I have a question about this saber to.
    I noticed some holes(maybe for grips) at the end could it have been a unused ESB luke or a redone Graflex in lukes style?

    pic of holes:
    [​IMG]
     
  6. darthwilliam87

    darthwilliam87 New Member

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    yeah, that is what people are thinking liquidpheonix. I think ghost host is right, i bet they just pollished it up to make it look like the mpp, but i think they only did it to the top half. here is a picture that I took at the MOM exhibit last summer which shows the two finishes.
    [​IMG]
     
  7. Brevin Din-Shay

    Brevin Din-Shay Well-Known Member

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    Well, let's start with Mike:

    I really don't think they used tape, man. When I saw the prop in person, and after I've scanned almost 100 pics of the prop from MoM, I see no evidence of overlapping tape wraps. [​IMG]


    Ghost Host: Quite possibly your theory is correct!

    Bill: As always, great observations. [​IMG]



    LiquidPhoenix: I started a thread about the "leftover Luke holes" almost a year ago. Indeed, there are holes, both in the bottom grip section and the top.

    My biggest question dealt with the placement of the holes. After extensive research, it seems that there is no uniformity involved.
    The best conclusion that we reached was that wherever one of Luke's 6 grips had been (with the screw/rivet at the bottom), there was a smaller black screw attached (and basically camouflaged) at the RIGHT SIDE of the grips, near the top.


    I saved the thread to my hard drive. If you want specific info, I'll be happy to e-mail you. [​IMG]


    Back to the finish, though...I don't think it's nickel. As Sporak pointed out, there are several finishes that were used during the 1940-1947 Graflex era. The most popular was the "brushed" finish, I think...other than this, there were 2 others (identified by Padawan Michael). I only remember one off the top of my head: Chromed.

    So...that's all for now!
     
  8. Sporak

    Sporak Sr Member Gone but not forgotten.

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    Actually there is uniformity...Ghost Host did indeed drill his as if the 6 Luke grips were in place and removed, then replaced the 7 vader grips in the correct position...what he got was exactly the right formation of holes as seen in the Mom pics. As far as I'm concerned thats exactly what happened.


    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Brevin Din-Shay wrote:
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    My biggest question dealt with the placement of the holes. After extensive research, it seems that there is no uniformity involved.
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>
     
  9. Oohyeah KL

    Oohyeah KL Well-Known Member

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    It seems pretty obvious to me (I thought it was well-established, in fact) that the holes are teh Luke ESB holes. I did mine up with those holes and they matched perfectly too.

    I have some related questions:

    1) Is the MOM saber the same saber as the one in the top pic?

    2) Does the MOM saber have the same bright finish as the saber in the top pic (whether they are the same saber or not)?

    3) Assuming there's no replating or use of tape/foil, how exactly would you polish or buff up a Graflex to make it shinier?
    (ie., how would an idiot like me polish up my Graflex?) [​IMG]

    btw, if anyone is looking for more pics of this saber, the pic collection thread is now in the archives.
     
  10. Onigiri

    Onigiri Sr Member

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    Another thing to consider is the 'du;; 'area on the bottom would be where thr old grips WHERE nd the finish might be indicative of where thry were removed.
     
  11. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    I think that kind of finish can be achived by buffing it really well rather than plating it...
    As far as whether this is the same saber from the MOM, I persoanlly think it is...The photo from the "Indy to SW" book shows a set of scratches which look like teeth marks on the saber, these marks can also be seen on some of the MOM pics...
    Personally I think it is the same saber.

    Im planning on making this saber soon and am planning n adding the yellowish glue goo found between the grips.
     
  12. Brevin Din-Shay

    Brevin Din-Shay Well-Known Member

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    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Oohyeah KL wrote:
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    It seems pretty obvious to me (I thought it was well-established, in fact) that the holes are teh Luke ESB holes.
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

    Well KL, looking from all the different angles that I have seen, and taking into account the distance that the holes are from the midband, I have to disagree. Yes, the bottom holes are the same as a Luke ESB bottom, but the top ones...well, that's where I get my "educated guess" theory. They seem to be quite a bit lower than the Luke ESB saber pics with screws as we see in POSW.

    Here's more on what you asked. My answers are in BOLD.

    <TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>Quote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    I have some related questions:

    1) Is the MOM saber the same saber as the one in the top pic?

    I would have to say definitely so. Again, from my many pics that I've collected over the past year.

    2) Does the MOM saber have the same bright finish as the saber in the top pic (whether they are the same saber or not)?

    It's VERY hard to tell with the flash going off - kind of like when everyone first thought it had a brass rod and brass hex bolts. Lighting throws it all off.

    3) Assuming there's no replating or use of tape/foil, how exactly would you polish or buff up a Graflex to make it shinier?
    (ie., how would an idiot like me polish up my Graflex?) [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    No idiot, my friend! I'm wondering the same thing. What grain/grade of polish would work best to achieve that finish? I am also very curious (hence the reasoning behind the thread in the first place!).

    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>


    Interesting read, you all!
     
  13. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    Just in case it wasnt known, Vader's ROTJ lightsaber is longer than Lukes ESB stunt...
    Im guessing that this is due to there not being a clamp for the upper and lower shell to lock onto, thus probably changing the normal length of a Graflex flash when the bottom shel was manually attached to the upper shell...

    This might be why the holes are on a slightly different distance from the ROTJ Vader and the ESB Luke..
     
  14. James Kenobi 1138

    James Kenobi 1138 Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Since the top shell is so beat up and scratched, but the copper underneith the plating is not showing, I have often wondered if they simply didn't just paint the top shell with a silver/buffing paint after ESB to 'spruce-up' the saber a little?

    Considering it's condition, I can't imagine they actually had it replated? Too much time and trouble.

    I can't see any edge to indicate foil or tape, too clean on the raised button areas.

    I'm wondering more and more it it's not just painted silver?
     
  15. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    What about the stuff on the bottom of the saber??
    Im referring the "putty" looking stuff under the D-ring..Kinda looks like metal epoxy with a whitish grey color to it.
     
  16. TallDarkandDisfigured

    TallDarkandDisfigured Sr Member

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    DS- The putty is just what it looks like(judging from amny hours of studying). Metal putty, the exact reaon we don't know. Some thought the original endcap had been knocked loose during the Dagobah training scenes, but other Graflex pro's said that couldn't have happened since the endcap is set in a ridge inside the tube. It would be very hard to knock out without splitting the tube.
    So that leaves my theory that it was just banged all to hell, and the putty was purely cosmetic.

    As for the finish, it seems to have been buffed to shine. The scratches don't have the brass look but they very easily could be just "mucked up"<--very technical term
    The difference in the two halves alone proves that it is not the original finish(even though some graflex have higher shines than others).

    Now, the holes in the grips, I again have to agree with DS on this one, the bottom holes are definatley from the Luke ESB saber, the top holes are most likey from the Luke also.
    As most of us know the Luke ESB had small screws set on the right side of each grip to give them extra security during a duel. Now I had thought that the Ranch saber had screws on the left and right side of the grips(could be wrong) but that would explain the odd positioning.

    Also the top holes are further from the clamp(midband) than the bottom holes are from the end of the tube. But again this could be due to the way the 2 halves were fastened together.

    The mystery behind the ugliest saber in the galaxy continues....
     
  17. Oohyeah KL

    Oohyeah KL Well-Known Member

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    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Brevin Din-Shay wrote:
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    Oohyeah KL wrote:
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    It seems pretty obvious to me (I thought it was well-established, in fact) that the holes are teh Luke ESB holes.
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

    Well KL, looking from all the different angles that I have seen, and taking into account the distance that the holes are from the midband, I have to disagree. Yes, the bottom holes are the same as a Luke ESB bottom, but the top ones...well, that's where I get my "educated guess" theory. They seem to be quite a bit lower than the Luke ESB saber pics with screws as we see in POSW.
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

    As DS and TDD mentioned, the distance difference could be cos the mid-band is at a different position to the graflex clamp.
    Even if the position of the top holes are slightly different, I would just say that they merely used a different Luke ESB from the one(s) we've seen.
    The way the holes are positioned, I just can't see this having any other explanation other than that they were there as Luke's ESB saber previously.

    Thanks for your response on my other questions! [​IMG]

    I'm still trying to figure out how an idiot like me can buff up the Graflex without workshop tools.

    eg., Can I just use Scotchbrite and keep rubbing it??
     
  18. TallDarkandDisfigured

    TallDarkandDisfigured Sr Member

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    KL
    You could use a rubbing compound on a rag and and buff it out. Then use a metal polish to add the shine. I have a 2 cell endcap here I can experiment on for fun.
    Just hold the rag by each end and buff like a pair of shoes.
     
  19. Oohyeah KL

    Oohyeah KL Well-Known Member

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    aah, thanks, Dan!

    What sort of rubbing compound should I be looking for?
     
  20. TallDarkandDisfigured

    TallDarkandDisfigured Sr Member

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    I'm not sure yet. I'll try out my 2 cell with some stuff and let you know.
    Just check with the metal polishes for a compound. As long as it is mildly abrasive, it should work.
     
  21. Brevin Din-Shay

    Brevin Din-Shay Well-Known Member

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    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Oohyeah KL wrote:
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    It seems pretty obvious to me (I thought it was well-established, in fact) that the holes are teh Luke ESB holes.
    ---------

    As DS and TDD mentioned, the distance difference could be cos the mid-band is at a different position to the graflex clamp.
    Even if the position of the top holes are slightly different, I would just say that they merely used a different Luke ESB from the one(s) we've seen.
    The way the holes are positioned, I just can't see this having any other explanation other than that they were there as Luke's ESB saber previously.

    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

    I understand what you're saying, KL. The thing I neglected to mention in this thread is that the top grip holes are misaligned. In other words, you can't wrap a piece of tape or string (whatever serves the purpose) around the saber and come out with any distinct pattern.
    Like the prop itself, the holes seem to have been "thrown together." [​IMG]


    DS brought up a very important point about the length of the saber, however. How very true that it may be a different length due to the midband setup!

    <TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>Quote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Thanks for your response on my other questions! [​IMG]
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

    You're quite welcome, bud! We're always trying to figure stuff out, right? [​IMG]
     
  22. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    Im stil;l wondering what the control box could be and how they attached the bottom and top shell...Do you think theres a connector tube inside the bodt holding the upper and lower half together??
     
  23. dcarty

    dcarty Sr Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Great thread! For whatever reason this saber fascinates me too (kind of like the A-10 Warthog--mean, ugly, and dangerous).

    One detail I have noticed that seems to get missed from time to time on our replicas is that the Linhoff bar for the D-ring has been painted black on the original.

    You can see where the paint is chipping around the edges here:

    [​IMG]

    Cheers,

    Dave C.
     
  24. Oohyeah KL

    Oohyeah KL Well-Known Member

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    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    dcarty wrote:
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    One detail I have noticed that seems to get missed from time to time on our replicas is that the Linhoff bar for the D-ring has been painted black on the original.
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

    How interesting. I had always thought it was just a reflection. Then I checked some other MOM pics I had, and they all seem to show that the Linholf bar IS black!!
    eg.:

    [​IMG]

    See more pics in the Archive:
    http://rpf.prop-planet.com/viewtopic.php?topic=39875&forum=4

    But then, there's this other pic, which fried mon calamari posted on the archive thread that was meant to have been in an old Insider Mag:

    [​IMG]

    Looks like it probably IS just a reflection afterall!
    (unless they painted the thing black for MOM?!)
     
  25. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    One thing I noticed that some people dont have on their replicas is that the two screws on the control box have flat head screwdriver slots on them...But most of the replicas I see have no slots at all, just a flat surface..
    Why is this?? Where there caps covering these screws at one time??
     
  26. Oohyeah KL

    Oohyeah KL Well-Known Member

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    interesting...

    I went to the Archives to look again, and it seems hard to tell that there are!

    Here are a few shots (courtesy of you! [​IMG]):

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The bottom one seems more obvious but the top one is hard to make out. Even when there seems to be a line on it in a couple of the pics, the line angle does not seem consistent.

    hmmm... I wonder whether Ob1Kenny's kit has them?
     
  27. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    Im at work right now but when I get home I'll post some super closeups which have been brightened up and sharpened...

    Oh, and also there are a couple of pics where you can see the threaded stem under the head of the screw...
     
  28. TallDarkandDisfigured

    TallDarkandDisfigured Sr Member

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    Great pics guys! I can say Kenny's kit has no lines. But I never had them on my sabers. I thought I heard somehwere that the activator was some kind of circuit breaker.
     
  29. obi1kenny

    obi1kenny Well-Known Member

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    What are you guys talkin about?

    The plugs in my control box are solid cylinders. But they are made so they can be pushed out from the bottom, should you choose to modify them, or paint them the correct way. As in the front cylinder in only painted black on the very top and not on the side of the cylinder that you can see through the front opening of the box. As seen in the pics above.

    Pat, please post some cleaned up pics if you have them. I only see a faint line if anything, if you are looking for a screw driver slot on the top of the plugs.
     
  30. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    Ill post some pics as soon as I get home...
     
  31. jedi5150

    jedi5150 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think that they could have buffed/polished a graflex up to that finish. I have one graflex that I tried that with, and what ended up happening is that the nickel finish started wearing off and the brass shows through now... [​IMG]
    And I was buffing by hand...


    So unless the nickel on mine was just REALLY worn out, I think that the same would have happened to them.

    It looks like a replate to me....in my humble opinion...

    Doug
     
  32. Probe Droid

    Probe Droid Master Member

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    Here's a pic of that saber I shot at MoM years back in Washington.
    [​IMG]
    Is it my imagination--or bad eye sight--or is there an extra piece covering the screws that's now missing from the more recent pix? It's possible I'm just not seeing it.

    Also, I've seen a lot of Graflexes in the last ferw years, easily more than a dozen, and some of them are pretty shiny. If the original finish was very bright, it's possible the prop guys could have given it a real good polish. The MoM guys also could have done it.

    Just a thought.
     
  33. steveday72

    steveday72 Well-Known Member

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    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    DARTH SABER wrote:
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    <snip>
    As far as whether this is the same saber from the MOM, I personally think it is...The photo from the "Indy to SW" book shows a set of scratches which look like teeth marks on the saber
    </snip>

    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

    Ahh, that would be where the Wampa tried to eat it, then spat it onto the floor of his cave. [​IMG]

    I'm planning to make a few of these too (one for me to keep) - I bought a bunch of the door latches from England already (a company called Darco made the original one and still manufactures them now).

    I used to hate this saber, but after reading about it on the RPF over the last year, now I like it a lot (more than the Luke ROTJ).

    Steve
     
  34. kurtyboy

    kurtyboy Master Member RPF PREMIUM MEMBER

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    Maybe they filled the top of the screws with modeling clay/putty etc.

    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Oohyeah KL wrote:
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    The bottom one seems more obvious but the top one is hard to make out. Even when there seems to be a line on it in a couple of the pics, the line angle does not seem consistent.

    hmmm... I wonder whether Ob1Kenny's kit has them?
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>
     
  35. SinkTube Jedi

    SinkTube Jedi Well-Known Member

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    I don;t know about the replating the thing look slike Hell;. I would take the regular brushed finished. I thinkm it is the light that makes it shinny. But hell where is WadaYada he seen the thing in person.
     
  36. obi1kenny

    obi1kenny Well-Known Member

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    The finish does look to be a polished up graflex. I thought the Biskit blanks were too shinny at first. But now that I read through this thread and start thinking about it, they are dead on for this conversion.

    I have a comparison pic I took of recent Graflex repos that I can post tomorrow to show the difference in those and a real graflex.



    Also, I looked again at the reference pics I have, in talking about slots on the plugs in the control box. Well, they could be, but they are filled in with putty or a lot of paint or it is just a really bad uneven surface. I have seen some people make them with cut slots in them and it looks wrong. I think if you went either way on it, it is more smooth that slotted. But like I said the plugs in my control box can be pressed out from the bottom, if you wish and they can be beat to hell with a hammer or slotted or a simi-filed slot is probably the best way to go then a ton of thick paint. But I like them smooth and flat.
     
  37. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    Okay, here are some close up of the front and rear screws....

    [​IMG]

    Now, it seems that there was, at one time, something covering the threaded stem of the front screw...
    Take a look at this-

    These photos were taken at different times (probably years apart)..
    One photo shows the "V" cut on the underside of the screw head and the threaded stem, while the other photo shows some kind of tube like covering over the "V" cut and stem...

    [​IMG]
     
  38. obi1kenny

    obi1kenny Well-Known Member

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    Here is a pic:

    [​IMG]
     
  39. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

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    Jeez, what a crappy saber!!!

    Anyhow, it looks like putty on the head or tape or something...
     
  40. obi1kenny

    obi1kenny Well-Known Member

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    Yup.

    Geeezzz....someone posted a very wide pic in the thread, I hate when I have to scroll to the right!


    Also, yes I have seen a few pics of where the front plug is broken away and the screw shows through. I wonder if these are earlier pics or later pics, well I know that if was probably not broken before and then after it breaks away it doesn't grow back on it's own. But the plug may have gotten turned at some point.


    So it looks like a hollow cylinder with a screw head in the top of it and them painted or puttied over. Sound good to you?
     
  41. Brevin Din-Shay

    Brevin Din-Shay Well-Known Member

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    There is a LOT to take in from this thread so far.

    I'm gonna back up and hit on the major points.

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    DARTH SABER wrote:
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    What about the stuff on the bottom of the saber??
    Im referring the "putty" looking stuff under the D-ring..Kinda looks like metal epoxy with a whitish grey color to it.
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE>

    The answer Dan gave is also what I believe. The bottom either popped out and was puttied, or possibly they machined a new bottom. Weird!


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    dcarty wrote:
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    Great thread! For whatever reason this saber fascinates me too (kind of like the A-10 Warthog--mean, ugly, and dangerous).

    One detail I have noticed that seems to get missed from time to time on our replicas is that the Linhoff bar for the D-ring has been painted black on the original.

    You can see where the paint is chipping around the edges
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

    Thanks, Dave! Maybe I should rename it now. [​IMG]
    Well, like KL pointed out, I think it's the lighting (again!!!).
    Nice observation, though! [​IMG]


    As for this WHOLE issue about the activation box having screws in it, I totally disagree. Besides blaming the lighting again, I know of a person who has spoken with someone that knows exactly what the original box was made from - a British momentary contact switch. The part that looks like threads are actually coils.

    Maybe he'll chime in. I'll give him a PM. [​IMG]


    (Hey, KL...would you consider asking the Admins to merge this thread with your archived one?)
     
  42. obi1kenny

    obi1kenny Well-Known Member

    Trophy Points:
    931
    Momentary switch, that's right! I had an un-named older prop guy tell me what this original part was and I just kept forgetting what the heck the name was.

    Is it wrong of me to say I could care less if it's a screw or a spring as it make no difference? It's still painted over and you aren't supposed to see it anyhow.
     
  43. Oohyeah KL

    Oohyeah KL Well-Known Member

    Trophy Points:
    705
    PD - your pic isn't showing (anymore). Can you email it to me and I'll host it?


    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    obi1kenny wrote:
    <HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Here is a pic:

    [​IMG]

    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

    Whoaa... now THIS is a super-clear pic!! And I think it now explains why the front cylinder top is unclear whether there's a slot or not, and why the possible slot line directions seem inconsistent between pics - cos it has faint 'lines' from being so beat up! You could read there to be a horizontal line, or a vertical line, depending on your "point of view". [​IMG] And YET another optical illusion!! [​IMG]

    Which brings me to the obvious question: What should a prop replicator do? Slots or no slots?
    With the lines as faint as they are, and since they probably tried to putty it over to cover the slot lines, I would go for no slot lines (which is great since my Ob1kenny kit doesn't have them... [​IMG])

    As for the threading showing through:

    [​IMG]

    I'm not sure that the bottom pic is clear enough to show that there is no threading. My bet it is probably... yep, you guessed it - an optical illusion... [​IMG]

    Brevin - yep, no probs - I too think that we shoudl certainly archive this thread, either merged with the PIC thread, or on its own.
     
  44. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

    Trophy Points:
    2,790
    Even if the bottom pic has or doesnt have threading you can still see that theres a cylinder missing hence exposing whatever is inside...
    On the top pic you can clearly see that the stem/coil is recessed farther back than the edge of the head..
     
  45. Brevin Din-Shay

    Brevin Din-Shay Well-Known Member

    Trophy Points:
    941
    True, Pat...but if we're seeking 100% accuracy here, the key point on this subject is whether the coils are spiral (like a screw) or horizontal.


    Do ya get me? [​IMG]
     
  46. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

    Trophy Points:
    2,790
    Any electricians in the house???
    I wonder if those coils are springs for a button?? They knda look like theyre going in an angle..

    Great thread ...
     
  47. steveday72

    steveday72 Well-Known Member

    Trophy Points:
    566
    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    Oohyeah KL wrote:
    <HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>

    ----------8<---------- snip ---------->8----------
    As for the threading showing through:

    <IMG SRC="http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0TQDeAvsWy2!sfOJj!QmL*plBfcRYv0xp0Z2e7ElTm7USqOC9EI2kO*yoavEXQBBYAOsFYd2!JHA3G6LlxHw91L7VuzRafs!8dzAGJ9DzTD7Kwn*UDuNfuA/ROTJ-THREAD.jpg
    " BORDER="0">

    I'm not sure that the bottom pic is clear enough to show that there is no threading. My bet it is probably... yep, you guessed it - an optical illusion... [​IMG]

    Brevin - yep, no probs - I too think that we shoudl certainly archive this thread, either merged with the PIC thread, or on its own.
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

    Funnily enough I was looking at this earlier this afternoon.

    The following image shows that the thread is there all along, but somehow the lighting washed out the shadows and it disappeared - to the eye anyway, but not to the camera!

    [​IMG]


    The image on the left is original with only the levels adjusted for maximum contrast and range, while the image on the right has been lightly sharpened and then adjusted using photoshop adjustment curves.

    I set the curves to create a very high contrast within a short range of luminance values and inverted the bright areas.

    The result is that the details that were washed out by the lighting now become visible, clearly showing the threads on the nearest screw.


    ...As for the coil idea. If it's a momentary action switch, then it would have springs inside rather than coils (relays have coils). One photo that was posted earlier shows a taper on the underside of the head, which makes me think it's a flat-head blade-type countersunk screw rather than a spring or coil.

    When I first started looking for this part, I had a hunch it was an electrical device and one of the things I've been trying to track down is an old style of electrical lighting wall switch. The style I saw once has two round buttons, one over the other, and they were mounted to the backside of a wall plate. One button turned the light(s) on, the other turned the light(s) off (this was before the single throw rocker switch was invented, which is what we have in our homes today).

    Until the actual item is found, I still have another theory that it could be an old electrical circuit breaker. These had a button which popped out when the breaker tripped, a small window showing either green or red (the trip status) and another button to reset the breaker.

    I think I'll have to make a 3D model of it, with as much detail as we already have, then see if showing it at another angle makes it easier to identify.


    Steve
     
  48. DARTH SABER

    DARTH SABER Master Member

    Trophy Points:
    2,790
    Cool, good work on the contrast pics Steve..


    I have not yet made this saber from a real Graflex and was wondering if you veterans could answer a couple of questions...

    1) Most of you use a PVC pipe to connect the bottom and top, yes??

    2) Does the PVC pipe fit perfectly inside the Graflex or does it need altering???

    3) What size PVC pipe do you use??

    4) was a PVC pipe used to connect the top and bottom on the original Saber??


    This is so funny...For every OT saber that comes up in a thread a member pops into mind also...
    Almost every OT has a fanatic RPF member attached to it...

    Obi Wans ANH saber- Gav, Serafino

    Lukes ESB- Jameskenobi

    Vaders ANH- PaulN (And your truly)

    Vaders ROTJ- Brevin

    Lukes ROTJ v.2- MJF
     
  49. fried mon calamari

    fried mon calamari Well-Known Member

    Trophy Points:
    555
    As far as the threading and screw slot details, looking at some of the closeups of the box, switch, breaker, it looked to me like they had painted it several times. Easily enough to fill in the slots and possibly the threads as well. You can see a pretty thick layer of flaked/ chipped paint on it.

    [​IMG]

    What throws me off the switch idea is, if they are screws, how would they function as push buttons? Why wouldn't they be a solid button?
     
  50. Oohyeah KL

    Oohyeah KL Well-Known Member

    Trophy Points:
    705
    Great work, Steve! Thanks for that!


    </SPAN><TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
    DARTH SABER wrote:
    <HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>

    This is so funny...For every OT saber that comes up in a thread a member pops into mind also...
    Almost every OT has a fanatic RPF member attached to it...

    Obi Wans ANH saber- Gav, Serafino

    Lukes ESB- Jameskenobi

    Vaders ANH- PaulN (And your truly)

    Vaders ROTJ- Brevin

    Lukes ROTJ v.2- MJF
    </TD></TR><TR><TD><HR></TD></TR></TABLE><SPAN CLASS=$row_color>

    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    You got Paul wrong!! He should be "Vader ESB"!!!!! [​IMG]
     

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